My wife and I took an 8 day, 450 n.m. sailing vacation that ended Friday On our last day out, we started hearing a clunking sound coming from under the cockpit floor that correlated with movement of the steering wheel. About 40 miles from home port, I decided I should investigate the noise. Because we were traveling in the ICW, there was no place to simply pull over and have a look. So, I removed the cockpit floor that covers the steering mechanism as we sailed. With the floor removed, it was easy to spot the problem. The end of the steering rod connects to the rudder with a ball and socket joint. The socket on the end of the steering rod had popped off of the ball on the rudder arm and was still partially working only because the socket was around the nut that holds the ball joint to the rudder arm. The clunking sound we were hearing was the steering rod knocking against the cockpit floor cover. Anyway, with the cockpit floor cover removed, there was no longer any force holding the steering arm socket on the nut above the ball on the rudder arm and the steering arm simply popped completely off of the rudder. Now life became much more interesting and exciting. With no steering and on a beam reach in a about 15 knots of wind, we changed course for the bank of the ICW. While my wife turned the wheel I grabbed the steering arm and tried to pop the socket back onto the ball on the rudder arm. However, the rudder arm kept wandering around aimlessly. Just before we plowed into the bank my wife was able to turn the wheel to coordinate movement of the steering arm with the movement of the rudder arm, and I got the socket back onto the nut above the ball on the rudder arm. A few moments later, driven by a generous amount of adrenalin, I was able to pop the socket back onto the ball. We managed to both avoid going aground and plowing into a power boat which was in the process of passing us. Has anyone else experienced anything similar with the rack and pinion steering? Can anyone explain why the socket could pop off and why I could simply pop it back on? This is a 1999 model 340 and I can't believe the ball and socket could be worn out already. If it helps, I have about 1,800 n.m. on the log. Thanks for any insights you can pass along.
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Emergency Tiller is always a good backup.
No matter what steering wheel mechanism you have, a good emergency tiller is a must. In the close quarters of the ICW on a beam reach with suspected steering problems, I would have had the emergency tiller installed and ready for action. I've never had rack and pinion steering, so I can't help you with the ball and socket question. I personally would prefer a yoke and clevis pin connection.
No matter what steering wheel mechanism you have, a good emergency tiller is a must. In the close quarters of the ICW on a beam reach with suspected steering problems, I would have had the emergency tiller installed and ready for action. I've never had rack and pinion steering, so I can't help you with the ball and socket question. I personally would prefer a yoke and clevis pin connection.
emergency tiller won't work
Don: I have an emergency tiller, but you can't remove the cockpit floor with the emergency tiller in place. But, your point is well taken.
Don: I have an emergency tiller, but you can't remove the cockpit floor with the emergency tiller in place. But, your point is well taken.
Inspection Port
Mike, you might have an inspection port in the deck right above the top of the rudder stock. Remove the plate and you should be able to drop the tiller head right into place at the top os the stock. Good Luck.
Mike, you might have an inspection port in the deck right above the top of the rudder stock. Remove the plate and you should be able to drop the tiller head right into place at the top os the stock. Good Luck.
There is an inspection port, but
Paul: You are right, there is an inspection port. However, the inspection port is part of the cockpit floor cover that must be removed to access the steering mechanism. Thus, you cannot simultaneously have the emergency tiller attached and remove the cockpit floor.
Paul: You are right, there is an inspection port. However, the inspection port is part of the cockpit floor cover that must be removed to access the steering mechanism. Thus, you cannot simultaneously have the emergency tiller attached and remove the cockpit floor.
Same "feature" on Legend 37.5
I have used the emergency tiller on my Legend 37.5 and Mike is right about the inspection port. I removed the port and installed the emergency tiller, thus preventing removal of the cockpit floor to access the steering mechanism (cables on the 37.5). However, if you plan for it, you could remove the screws to get the cockpit floor ready for removal and have the emergency tiller ready to install once the floor is removed. Once the screws are out, I think it would be possible to remove the floor and install the tiller within 15 seconds. Mike: Have you checked to see if possibly there is a missing retaining clip to hold the socket onto the ball on your rack and pinion steering? Does the Hunter owners manual have detail drawings of the steering mechanism so you can check it out? My experience has been that sometimes things are left off at the factory.
I have used the emergency tiller on my Legend 37.5 and Mike is right about the inspection port. I removed the port and installed the emergency tiller, thus preventing removal of the cockpit floor to access the steering mechanism (cables on the 37.5). However, if you plan for it, you could remove the screws to get the cockpit floor ready for removal and have the emergency tiller ready to install once the floor is removed. Once the screws are out, I think it would be possible to remove the floor and install the tiller within 15 seconds. Mike: Have you checked to see if possibly there is a missing retaining clip to hold the socket onto the ball on your rack and pinion steering? Does the Hunter owners manual have detail drawings of the steering mechanism so you can check it out? My experience has been that sometimes things are left off at the factory.
Factory Response?
I also own a 1999 340 & had occassion to have the cockpit floor removed while checking the rudder bearing for excessive play this spring. The ball & socket appeared to be a press fit. Have you contacted the Hunter factory? I would be interested in their response as I too wondered about the reliability of the ball & socket.
I also own a 1999 340 & had occassion to have the cockpit floor removed while checking the rudder bearing for excessive play this spring. The ball & socket appeared to be a press fit. Have you contacted the Hunter factory? I would be interested in their response as I too wondered about the reliability of the ball & socket.
I've contacted Edson
Just an update: I have contacted Edson's customer service department rather than Hunter or my dealer. I wanted to to to the most knowledgeable people on this steering system. Esson is going to replace the part at no cost and is extrememly interested in why the ball and socket has failed. Apparently, this is a relatively rare type of problem and they are anxious to view the parts and diagnose the cause. I will update my post when I next hear from them.
Just an update: I have contacted Edson's customer service department rather than Hunter or my dealer. I wanted to to to the most knowledgeable people on this steering system. Esson is going to replace the part at no cost and is extrememly interested in why the ball and socket has failed. Apparently, this is a relatively rare type of problem and they are anxious to view the parts and diagnose the cause. I will update my post when I next hear from them.
Steering by sails
I'm not being critical about this particular situation cuz I don't know the facts, but you can steer a sailboat even with a lost or disable rudder (assuming its not stuck to one side like happened to me once). Trim the jib and loosen the main and she bears off; trim the main and loosen the jib and she'll bear up. Try it -- could come in handy some day and is also applicable to those constant post about problems with weather helm.
I'm not being critical about this particular situation cuz I don't know the facts, but you can steer a sailboat even with a lost or disable rudder (assuming its not stuck to one side like happened to me once). Trim the jib and loosen the main and she bears off; trim the main and loosen the jib and she'll bear up. Try it -- could come in handy some day and is also applicable to those constant post about problems with weather helm.
steering with sales and no rudder control?
Bryan: Try sailing with no rudder control by simply adjusting sails. I can easily see fixing the rudder in position and then controlling direction with sails. I think allowing the rudder to wander and controlling direction with sails adds a level of complexity that would keep like interesting.
Bryan: Try sailing with no rudder control by simply adjusting sails. I can easily see fixing the rudder in position and then controlling direction with sails. I think allowing the rudder to wander and controlling direction with sails adds a level of complexity that would keep like interesting.
Ya might be right
You got a point there -- when I have played around steering by sails I usually locked the rudder at center. I would assume if the rudder was loose it would not wander back and forth as the flow of water would keep it relatively centered and there would be no pressure to cause it to turn to either side. On the other hand, without the rudder's foil at the stern it would no doubt be much more difficult to keep her pointing in the desired direction. Good experiment for next weekend!
You got a point there -- when I have played around steering by sails I usually locked the rudder at center. I would assume if the rudder was loose it would not wander back and forth as the flow of water would keep it relatively centered and there would be no pressure to cause it to turn to either side. On the other hand, without the rudder's foil at the stern it would no doubt be much more difficult to keep her pointing in the desired direction. Good experiment for next weekend!
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