What is the difference between racing sails and cruising sails? OK, racing sails cost more, so will I go faster?
Racing or Cruising
- Thread starter Ron10127
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Unless...
Unless you are going racing, I'd stick with cruising sails. They make laminate "high performance" cruising sails out of Pentex and the like if you want better stuff than Dacron. Cruising laminates are faster than Dacron, and racing laminates are faster than the cruisers. All of this assumes that you are an expert trimmer (worrying about the last 2" of trim on the sheet making a big difference). I think for the money that most of the time a good Dacron sail works just fine. Just ask the J-105 guys
B
Unless you are going racing, I'd stick with cruising sails. They make laminate "high performance" cruising sails out of Pentex and the like if you want better stuff than Dacron. Cruising laminates are faster than Dacron, and racing laminates are faster than the cruisers. All of this assumes that you are an expert trimmer (worrying about the last 2" of trim on the sheet making a big difference). I think for the money that most of the time a good Dacron sail works just fine. Just ask the J-105 guys
B
Yes there's a difference and no it's not minimal. However, if you are a cruiser then you don't need the extra performance and speed. Racing sails cost more because they are made from more expensive fabric and are more labor intensive to produce. All of this pays big time on the race course. Cruisers will not be interested in the extra performance and the associated costs. For the Wed nite "beer can" series good Dacron sails will do just fine. If you are using 10 year old Dacron, well there's no hope of ever getting any kind of sail shape with old rags.
Cruising vs. racing.
Ron, racing and cruising are two different disciplines. Racing is based on speed and competition and cruising is based on travelling and relaxation. To each its own. Cruising sails do not serve a racer well and viceversa. Racing sails are way more expensive and do not wear well under everyday use and adverse conditions. Will racing sails make you go faster? Yes, they will on the average. In rough terms the maximum speed of a monohull is a function of its water length. With enough wind your boat can attain its maximum speed with either set of sails. Now when the wind becomes less abundant the racing sails will give your boat better speed than the cruising sails. Is it a significant increase in speed? This where the racer says "yay" and cruiser says "nay". A gain of a couple of minutes may win a race but to the cruiser the loss of a few minutes to reach a destination is insignificant. The big equalizer is that cruisers will crank the engine up if the wind dies but racers cannot do that and continue in the race.
Ron, racing and cruising are two different disciplines. Racing is based on speed and competition and cruising is based on travelling and relaxation. To each its own. Cruising sails do not serve a racer well and viceversa. Racing sails are way more expensive and do not wear well under everyday use and adverse conditions. Will racing sails make you go faster? Yes, they will on the average. In rough terms the maximum speed of a monohull is a function of its water length. With enough wind your boat can attain its maximum speed with either set of sails. Now when the wind becomes less abundant the racing sails will give your boat better speed than the cruising sails. Is it a significant increase in speed? This where the racer says "yay" and cruiser says "nay". A gain of a couple of minutes may win a race but to the cruiser the loss of a few minutes to reach a destination is insignificant. The big equalizer is that cruisers will crank the engine up if the wind dies but racers cannot do that and continue in the race.
racing / cruising sails
Ron, don't let anyone convince you that serious cruisers care less about their sails than racers. Their goals are just different. Here's a quote from Tom Whidden of North Sails: "Cruising sailors should be able to get from here to there as efficiently as possible. Their sails should take full advantage of the new labor-saving devices on the market, thereby requiring the minumum crew. Cruising sailors should demand sails that are light in weight because their boats have more accommodations and less stability than racing sailboats. Sails should be strong and durable, as cruising sailors don't typically have the crew or inclination to respond to failures. Cruising sailors should be able to go fast when desired, have sails that hold their shape to give them enough weatherliness to claw off a lee shore, and go in safety whatever the weather. The sails should be the best looking and last for the longest possible time. A sailboat with poor sails is like and eight-cylinder car running on seven cylinders-and can be more dangerous" To answer Ron's question. Yes you will go faster with racing sails. Racing sails are designed and built for SPEED. They employ expensive, high tech materials to reduce stretch and maintain shape. Cruising sails are designed and built for EFFECIENCY and DURABILITY. The cloth and construction methods of cruising sails reflect this purpose. A laminated racing sail's useful lifespan is considerably less than that of a cloth cruising sail. Once the laminate starts breaking down it can't be repaired, it's worthless. A dacron sail's life can be extended by re-cutting and re-stitching. Go visit a few sailmakers' websites. They're very informative. Try a google search.
Ron, don't let anyone convince you that serious cruisers care less about their sails than racers. Their goals are just different. Here's a quote from Tom Whidden of North Sails: "Cruising sailors should be able to get from here to there as efficiently as possible. Their sails should take full advantage of the new labor-saving devices on the market, thereby requiring the minumum crew. Cruising sailors should demand sails that are light in weight because their boats have more accommodations and less stability than racing sailboats. Sails should be strong and durable, as cruising sailors don't typically have the crew or inclination to respond to failures. Cruising sailors should be able to go fast when desired, have sails that hold their shape to give them enough weatherliness to claw off a lee shore, and go in safety whatever the weather. The sails should be the best looking and last for the longest possible time. A sailboat with poor sails is like and eight-cylinder car running on seven cylinders-and can be more dangerous" To answer Ron's question. Yes you will go faster with racing sails. Racing sails are designed and built for SPEED. They employ expensive, high tech materials to reduce stretch and maintain shape. Cruising sails are designed and built for EFFECIENCY and DURABILITY. The cloth and construction methods of cruising sails reflect this purpose. A laminated racing sail's useful lifespan is considerably less than that of a cloth cruising sail. Once the laminate starts breaking down it can't be repaired, it's worthless. A dacron sail's life can be extended by re-cutting and re-stitching. Go visit a few sailmakers' websites. They're very informative. Try a google search.
Increments...
To a racer, it is worth spending twice as much money for sails that give a 5% performance increase, because that 5% is the difference between finishing first or tenth. Sure, with the racing sails your boat will generally be faster from A to B. So the question becomes whether you are willing to pay the extra bucks for sails that give you a little performance edge but won't last as long. Some are willing, some are not. And if you ARE racing, how are the other guys set up? If their boats are really prepped out, yours had better be, too. If they are more casual in their approach, then you can compete evenly with less than state-of-the-art gear.
To a racer, it is worth spending twice as much money for sails that give a 5% performance increase, because that 5% is the difference between finishing first or tenth. Sure, with the racing sails your boat will generally be faster from A to B. So the question becomes whether you are willing to pay the extra bucks for sails that give you a little performance edge but won't last as long. Some are willing, some are not. And if you ARE racing, how are the other guys set up? If their boats are really prepped out, yours had better be, too. If they are more casual in their approach, then you can compete evenly with less than state-of-the-art gear.
It's a matter of priority
Alan, "For the Wed nite "beer can" series good Dacron sails will do just fine." Objection Yes the "beer can" boys are there but stop and think, most all the stink boats are off the water by 7 O' clock, it's the middle of the week it perfect for a race and the beer is not the focus, but a good shot of whiskey or some cap'n morgan works,, especially if you lost.
Alan, "For the Wed nite "beer can" series good Dacron sails will do just fine." Objection Yes the "beer can" boys are there but stop and think, most all the stink boats are off the water by 7 O' clock, it's the middle of the week it perfect for a race and the beer is not the focus, but a good shot of whiskey or some cap'n morgan works,, especially if you lost.
Disagree with some of these posts
I fancy myself a performance minded sailor and have on board our race rigged 28.5 a Mylar bi-radial 155% Genoa, aMylar / Dacron mullti-laminate tri-radial 135% Genoa and the OEM 110 all Dacron jib. We were still winning light air races and out pointing our competitors with our 1st Mylar 155 for 16 years before it delaminated. Our second 3.4 oz Mylar 155% shows some age but trims tight and has kept its shape because we take it down when we should and use the 135 effectively. The sail maker said the 135% would outlast the boat - I'm begining to think he may be right as it's going strong at 17 or 18 seasons now. some panels at the tack are yellowed now. We rarely ever have the 110 hoisted. We bought our second dacron maisail about three years ago: a lose footed Dacron 'racing cut' in that it has maximum roach and radial cut head and clew with full top batten and 4 IOR length battens, two reefs, etc. We carefully fold the Genoas and keep them flat in 'mummy bags' while the 110 is flaked and rolled - all are always put away dry. No these aren't the latest high tech materials now but we've taken a lot of 1st's in crusing divisions and cleaned up on a lot of PHRF 'racers' who rated much lower. Talk to your sailmaker - there is a lot of middle ground in sail construction and longevity.
I fancy myself a performance minded sailor and have on board our race rigged 28.5 a Mylar bi-radial 155% Genoa, aMylar / Dacron mullti-laminate tri-radial 135% Genoa and the OEM 110 all Dacron jib. We were still winning light air races and out pointing our competitors with our 1st Mylar 155 for 16 years before it delaminated. Our second 3.4 oz Mylar 155% shows some age but trims tight and has kept its shape because we take it down when we should and use the 135 effectively. The sail maker said the 135% would outlast the boat - I'm begining to think he may be right as it's going strong at 17 or 18 seasons now. some panels at the tack are yellowed now. We rarely ever have the 110 hoisted. We bought our second dacron maisail about three years ago: a lose footed Dacron 'racing cut' in that it has maximum roach and radial cut head and clew with full top batten and 4 IOR length battens, two reefs, etc. We carefully fold the Genoas and keep them flat in 'mummy bags' while the 110 is flaked and rolled - all are always put away dry. No these aren't the latest high tech materials now but we've taken a lot of 1st's in crusing divisions and cleaned up on a lot of PHRF 'racers' who rated much lower. Talk to your sailmaker - there is a lot of middle ground in sail construction and longevity.
I gather them fancy sails can last ...
quite a bit inside a sail bag, but put it in a roller furler and watch it desintegrate.
quite a bit inside a sail bag, but put it in a roller furler and watch it desintegrate.
What?
What does roller furling have to do with the sail's life? Roller furling should extend a sail's life. A sail's life is shortened by: Flogging, there are a certain number of tacks in the sail before it starts to come apart. Folding, laminate sails don't like sharp creases. Overstress, either the sail up in too much wind or too much halyard tension. Once a laminate sail is distorted by force there is no return. UV exposure, while sailing UV degrades the sail. Just what about a roller furler is so hard on the sail? Flogging ... no difference. Folding ... roller furling puts no creases in the sail. Overstress ... no difference. UV ... yes the sail is exposed to UV if it is uncovered ... so cover it.
What does roller furling have to do with the sail's life? Roller furling should extend a sail's life. A sail's life is shortened by: Flogging, there are a certain number of tacks in the sail before it starts to come apart. Folding, laminate sails don't like sharp creases. Overstress, either the sail up in too much wind or too much halyard tension. Once a laminate sail is distorted by force there is no return. UV exposure, while sailing UV degrades the sail. Just what about a roller furler is so hard on the sail? Flogging ... no difference. Folding ... roller furling puts no creases in the sail. Overstress ... no difference. UV ... yes the sail is exposed to UV if it is uncovered ... so cover it.
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