Poo on a Starboard heal......

Peggie Hall HeadMistress · Sep 19, 2010

What was happening....

Liquids run downhill...and when you heel far enough to put the inlet fitting and/or the vent fitting on the holding tank AND the tank above the toilet, tank contents will spill into the toilet discharge line and/or the vent line and run back to the toilet and/or spill out the vent.

There are two ways to prevent it: put a loop--not necessarily a vented loop, just a loop--in the toilet discharge line that remains higher than the tank. Or..relocate the inlet and vent fittings on the tank to put them toward the centerline of the boat, away from the hull...so that when you heel, tank contents flow AWAY from them.

You also need to replace the joker valve in your toilet...that should be done at least every two years...annually is better. Even a new one won't completely block slow seepage...but if yours allows waste to flood the bowl, it's been totally worn out for years! And it's likely that all the other rubber parts in the pump are also so worn that they're on the edge of failure...so you prob'ly should rebuild the toilet too.

You don't say whether your waste tank is vented or not...you didn't mention anything about waste spilling out the vent too, so I'm guessing it may not be. If so, that's something you have to correct...'cuz although flexible water tanks don't have to be vented, USCG regs require that all WASTE tanks MUST be vented to the outside of the boat.

Peggie Hall HeadMistress · Sep 19, 2010

So instead of actually fixing the problem...

You're just gonna put a band-aid on it (replace the joker valve) and hope that's enough?

BotanyBay · Sep 21, 2010

Rebuilding Groko Model K's

tgrace said:
OK.... You are making me feel bad and band-aids are not what I really want but my knowledge of marine toilets is null and want to approach this carefully. So you are suggesting a full rebuild? If so how involved a task is this on a Groco type K? And are the rebuild instructions easy to follow? Can you suggest a vendor to purchase a kit?
Tim

I purchased one of these heads new in 1993 and actually moved it on to the new boat. These are a great unit and just take a bit of care to rebuild every couple of years (as a full time liveaboard). The only tricky part is getting the bronze piston out and when you realize there is a threaded bit in the middle to hold it with everything makes sense.

If you need help please let me know, I have been through these many times.

David

C lectric · Sep 23, 2010

You need to install a tank vent and as pointed out , to the outside of the boat.
You have been lucky so far. When you use the toilet you are pressurizing the tank, without that vent. If you hadn't made such apparently minimal use of the tank it might have burst.
That may also partly explain why the toiltet backflowed. You do still need to repair the toilet properly and use a loop as Peggy suggested.

Stu Jackson · Sep 23, 2010

tgrace said:
Thanks David...... I did find out that the tank is not vented and no loop between the head and tank so that will be my first chore.... I see that Groco sells a vent for the loop so would you suggest purchasing that one?
Tim

Tim you could, but you can get them anywhere from WM or any other chandler.

Sorry no picture, Defender may have on on their website.

http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wc...toreNum=10111&subdeptNum=10636&classNum=10639

Look it up in the WM catalog, everyone should have two: boat & home.

Stu Jackson · Sep 23, 2010

Yup:

http://www.defender.com/product.jsp?path=-1|51|106370|316448|316445&id=102587

Peggie Hall HeadMistress · Sep 23, 2010

Yes....I'm suggesting you do everything I recommended...

tgrace said:
OK.... You are making me feel bad and band-aids are not what I really want but my knowledge of marine toilets is null and want to approach this carefully. So you are suggesting a full rebuild? If so how involved a task is this on a Groco type K? And are the rebuild instructions easy to follow? Can you suggest a vendor to purchase a kit?

You didn't mention till now that your toilet is Model K...that's about an $800 toilet...the rebuild kit is about $125...about the same price as a complete cheap disposable piece of junk toilet. But opting to replace that toilet instead of rebuilding it is tantamount to replacing a BMW with a Yugo because a tune-up for the BMW costs as much as the Yugo. Google "Groco K rebuild kit" to locate it for the best price.

Rebuilding a toilet only requires slightly more mechanical ability than is needed to turn doorknobs...if you don't have at least THAT much, you have no business owning a canoe, much less a sailboat big enough to have plumbing! It's very easy...so easy that there are no step by step instructions, only a drawing that shows all the parts, where they go, and their orientation...so pay close attention to that drawing and you'll do fine.

The loop between the toilet and the tank does not have to be vented...it just has to be high enough (see my original post)...so you don't have to buy a "vented loop"...you can buy a 180 from any hardware store for a fraction of the price.

But the TANK vent has nothing to with all that! It's a totally separate issue. Clectric is correct that every time the toilet is flushed into into a tank, the tank will become increasingly pressurized unless the air in the tank displaced by incoming waste has an escape route--the tank vent. And bladder tanks are notorious for blowing out fittings when they become even slightly pressurized. So it's a VERY good thing you haven't used the toilet very much!

In fact, if it were my boat, instead of just venting the bladder, I'd replace it with a rigid tank. Your best source is Ronco Plastics (no relation to Ron Popeil and his pocket vegomatic) Ronco Plastics They make TOP quality thick walled tanks for a very reasonable price (that's even more reasonable if you order it through the online store at this site) and have more than 400 shapes and sizes, over 100 of which are non-rectangular...and they install fittings in the sizes and locations specified by the customer when they make the tank.

I'll be glad to help you spec out what you need to solve your existing problems and prevent future ones...If you'd like my help, send me an email (click on my name at the left of this post and follow directions)...it ain't rocket science...I've just gotten good at it 'cuz I've been doing it for 20+ years. :dance: