O'Day 25 or Catalina 25

Apex · Oct 29, 2014

I now have an Oday 28, moving up from a Catalina 25 fin keel....not quite apples to oranges. The C25 was a very easy boat to sail, is easy to get parts for and the catalina25association website for support is unsurpassed. We love our Oday, and there are a few features about the 28 that may be common to the mfr lineup that are nice, for instance the forward hatch lip is very long allowing you to keep it cracked in rain.

Check the hull shape if on the hard, Catalina will tend to dig it's shoulder in in heavier weather and really handled everything well.....fin keel though. Some Oday 25's I have seen seemed to sail nice but several have come to their final demise due to chainplate connections, so check those areas closely.

Compare specs, look at hull form, but in the end which one speaks to you more?

Stu Jackson · Oct 29, 2014

The two are very comparable. I owned a C25 for 13 years, fixed keel, sailed great. I sailed an O25, great in the light air we had that day, then picked up and sailed just fine, don't know the keel deal on that one, it was borrowed for the day from friends.

The issue with a C25 swing keel in salt water is servicing the mechanism for the swing keel. Ours was fixed, but a dock mate had a swing keel. Both boats are still sailing 16 years later - both were early 1980s boats!

Ask about it here: http://catalina-capri-25s.org/forum/forum.asp?FORUM_ID=3

The other thing is layout down below. IIRC, the O25 didn't have a quarterberth.

HukilauMike · Oct 29, 2014

I like the Oday centerboard design better than the Catalina design. I like having all of the ballast encapsulated in the stub keel; I was never wild about the fact that all of the boat's ballast hangs by one pin. I also think the Oday centerboard is easier to control than the Catalina swing keel. With the Oday, it's just one line in the cockpit; no fuss, no muss, no real maintenance. With the Catalina, its a mechanical crank; the crank is a robust piece of equipment, but it needs maintenance and can fail. And with the Oday, you always know the position of the centerboard just by looking at how much line is in the cockpit. With the Catalina, you have to crank the keel all the way up or all the way down to be sure of its position. I found that to be a pain.

You don't mention if the Catalina is the pop-top version of the 25. That is a really nice feature that the Oday lacks. If you intend to cruise at all, it makes a big difference.

And for my money, centerboard/swing keel boats do not point as high as fin keel boats. Just a fact. When sailing downwind, you do get an advantage over a fin keel in that you can retract the centerboard and reduce wetted surface. But overall, I just think fin keel boats sail better than centerboard boats. And by the way, when you wrote "full keel", I assume you meant fin keel, not really a full keel boat (e.g., a Pearson Triton, a full keel boat where the rudder is attached to the keel).

redhead78 · Oct 29, 2014

not sure it applys here but check some older posts here, there seems to be some ?? on keels coming off Some of the oday models. I think Maine had some info on this subject a short while ago....Red

cb32863 · Oct 29, 2014

The O'Day 25 is either a fin keel or a shoal keel with a centerboard. Not both. I have a 77 that is for sale, hint hint.... anyway. I had to replace the bulkheads due to water infiltration and replace the core under the mast step as it was rotten too. Check out my blog link in my sig for all that fun and excitement. The keel coming off was a different model O'Day, I think the 322. The 25 does not point for sh## with the board up. Sometimes they get stuck as the board can get water in it and swell. I replaced mine and it still won't drop, possible water infiltration in the trunk and that has swollen too.

Personally, if I had it to do all over again, I would have dropped the O'Day off my list and kept looking. All depends on what kind of sailing you do and where you do it though....

fwiw my 2 cents.

vizwhiz · Oct 29, 2014

Have you considered a Mac25? Same weighted swing keel idea in the same age bracket you're referring to, lots and lots of them out there, and good support for them... I hear they sail well, but have no experience in one.

Jackdaw · Oct 30, 2014

cb32863 said:
Personally, if I had it to do all over again, I would have dropped the O'Day off my list and kept looking. All depends on what kind of sailing you do and where you do it though....

Some sailboats can actually sail to weather! Who knew???

FWIW I used to own a Cat25 swing keel. OK boat with TONS of room inside for its length. Just ok sailing, but at the time room inside was more important to the (former) missus. Fixed BOTH of those problems.

Ron20324 · Oct 30, 2014

FWIW, after I sold my Oday 222, I was looking at all the 25s. Then I saw the Beneteau 235... and I bought it.

higgs · Oct 30, 2014

A "full keel" is always preferable to a swing keel for stability and pointing ability. Unless you have a reason to own a swing keel, go for the boat that has a permanent keel.

Jackdaw · Oct 30, 2014

higgs said:
A "full keel" is always preferable to a swing keel for stability and pointing ability. Unless you have a reason to own a swing keel, go for the boat that has a permanent keel.

I think you are confusing FULL with FIN keel.

Neither the oday or Catalina 25 have full keels. And full keels point like crap.

Ward H · Nov 1, 2014

redhead78 said:
not sure it applys here but check some older posts here, there seems to be some ?? on keels coming off Some of the oday models. I think Maine had some info on this subject a short while ago....Red

Hi Red, This issue was on larger O'day boats with bolt on keels, never read about it on <30' boats.

Jan, as cb32863 said, if the O'day has the centerboard it is the shoal keel with the lead fully encapsulated. Not sure if the fin keel is bolted on or not but most of the 25s I have seen are the shoal draft w CB.

My CB can get stuck in the up position if I yank the pendant too hard. We (yard and I) think we have it figured out that the D shackle for holding the pendant to the board is too long and wide. It is much wider than needed at the attachment point on the board and longer than needed to attach the pendant.

In any case, if it does get stuck up, I keep going. Cannot point into the wind as well but we keep sailing. Last day of sailing this season we had winds 12 to 15 with gusts to 23. We did find without the CB.

I think the O'day CB system is simpler to maintain but I think it is more of which boat has what you want as far as cabin layout and other features, sail condition, etc. If all of that is the sameI would go with the simpler CS setup.

Barnacle Bill · Nov 5, 2014

Re: The Lancer.....it only has a shoal keel and is not very good at windward sailing because there is no centerboard or swing keel. Inside there is a recessed area that offers stand up headroom because you can step into it. On most boats, this is considered the bilge area, but they use it for headroom instead. The Catalina 25 swing keel is made of cast iron which will rust and so it requires maintenance. The O'Day, as someone mentioned has a shoal keel which is a part of the hull (not bolted on) and then there is a slot for the centerboard, which is also fiberglass and much lighter than the Catalina keel. It takes a winch to raise and lower the Catalina keel, but only a rope by hand to raise and lower the O'Day 25 centerboard. The Catalina keel is held in place with a large hinge pin that fits into two substantial hangers that are held in place each with two hex bolts. The entire weight of the keel is held in place with 4 bolts (and the cable which raises and lowers it). I have seen Catalina 25's grounded where one or two bolts have sheared off. If this happens, you have lost 25% of the holding power with just one broken bolt. If you cannot get the bolt out with an easy out, etc., removing the Catalina-made anchor is a chore as it is fiberglassed into the hull up in the keel trunk. I have done that repair and it is a pain. The O'Day has a pin held in place with two wedges that are held in place with two straps screwed into the bottom of the hull. Not much to go wrong there and not as vulnerable. Also, usually shoal keel boats are self righting regardless of centerboard position, where a lot of swing keel boats are only self-righting when the keel is down. Both boats offer about the same interior accommodations. After a certain year, Catalina made the pop top standard and before that it was an option. O'Day 25's never had a pop top. The rest is up to what you like or dislike about any of the boats after you climb in and check out their accommodations, condition and equipment.

CCrane2299 · Nov 6, 2014

Just sold a 79 Oday 25 and bought a Catalina 22. Head room alone is a big deal with the oday at 5.9 feet. I have no idea how much headroom is in the Catalina 25. But in the 22 you either pee sitting down or open the hatch. The transom on the Oday needed backing plates to hold an 8 HP 2 stroke. I have heard the bulkheads often get wet and rot on the Oday, but mine were fine...I had to replace them on the 22. My thought is they are probably both good boats and have similar but different issues.

BobM · Nov 6, 2014

He said a a Lancer 27, which is the power sailor. The 25 has the wide stub keel and the 28 is pretty much just a bigger 25. The 25 and 28 were designed to be maxi trailerables. To be frank, if you have no need for a trailerable boat don't buy one. After owning a Lancer 25 any trailerable boat is a compromise, if only in limiting beam. The cost of owning a 25 footer versus something larger is minimal. I think it costs me about $300 more for my 30 a year than it did for my 25. There is, however, more maintenance if the systems are more complex. If I was to buy a 24-25 I would look at a C&C. They are great performing boats, plentiful and inexpensive. There is a boat for sail in RI below. The S2 is a well built boat and there are a lot of 7.3s around.

http://www.sailboatlistings.com/view/38351

There is a Catalina 27 for $995!

http://www.sailboatlistings.com/view/46458

Classic looks and quality Ina Cape Dory 25 with condition listed as excellent

http://www.sailboatlistings.com/view/44296

My advice is to keep shopping and not to limit yourself to the boats from the big box manufacturers. Buy the best boat you can afford and buy the boat in the best condition you can find.

Bob

BobM · Nov 6, 2014

The performance of most 30 footers is head and shoulders above most 25s under most sailing conditions. Mast height helps in light air and displacement helps in heavy seas and strong winds. It is as easy to single hand a 30 as a 25 for the most part. Although it was almost a waste to have sheet winches on my 25 with a 110. Didn't need them. If I tack well I might need to take a couple of turns for the 30. I sail it solo 80% of the time. I can also take the 30 out in conditions that overpowered the 25 significantly. A small craft warning is a reason to go out and play in the 30.

Chief RA · Nov 7, 2014

BobM: Sure glad you said "most 25's"! Catalina 250 wing keel, tall masts will definitely sail well in big water. My prior sailboat was a Clipper Marine 26 with a 600lb swing keel and she would handle 12' seas easily. Her fair bow would rise so quickly that even in 12' seas water would not come over the bow!
The reason I own a trailerable boat is because I do not want to tend and maintain a docked boat all winter. If it stays in the ocean year round much more maintenance is involved plus the annual costs does go up a lot. Just monthly docking fees alone will be thousands more money. Once you can't readily remove your boat and store at home, your costs will at least triple!
I am not saying owning a larger sailboat is bad, just that the realization of the pertinent issues is important for selecting a boat size.
Chief

BobM · Nov 8, 2014

Agreed. But if you are thinking 25 feet but don't plan to trailer it then the extra five feet only cost me $300/year for winter storage. As I said, it is the complexity that increases costs, not necessarily the length. A C27 with an outboard is a
more boat than a C25 and the cost difference should be minimal. As I suggested. Go have fun and look at boats!

Meriachee · Nov 8, 2014

The thought of ever going back to doing virtually everything on your knees would even add value to a "project" 30 footer. Once was enough, and headroom is way underrated

BobM · Nov 8, 2014

Amen to that. After my Wife refused to agree to the purchase of a $3500 trailer for our $1000 lancer 25 I decided that I wanted a new boat I could pee standing up in.