i had the displeasure of lowering the mast on my h23 this weekend. i used a "come along" winch out the bow roller when i raised the mast and things went pretty easy. however, this time, while lowering, the tongue was extended on the trailer and i ran out of scope on my harness to get the mast all the way down...an ugly situation with the mast at about a 60 degree angle. (necessating chalking the trailer wheels and backing the truck to push the tongue in and giving me more scope on my harness....not a safe or user friendly way to do things. i want to rig a ginpole and use my mainsheet in the future to raise and lower. my criteria are: the ginpole has to be stowable on the boat...(and of course the mainsheet has its own purpose). simple, user friendly, singlehand, idiot-proof, safe. my main question as to using a ginpole is how long and how far up the mast to attach it for maximum mechanical advantage. (and also, does one loop the forestay over the ginpole and pull on that or pull directly on the ginpole?) this will dictate how i design and stow it. i have seen, (and have drawings somewhere of a cable system to attach around the stanctions to steady the mast side-to-side while raising and lowering. and as a sidelight....my cleating system sucks. something is binding or twisted. after pulling tension off the mast with the jib halyard i can pull the front pin easily enough....if one considers driving/twisting/punching etc. but, after the mast is in the crutch things are in such a bind that it almost took an act of god to get the back pin out. no way singlehanded. i was holding the mast back at the spreaders, twisting, moving side-to-side, raising, lowering, cussing....basically every thing i could do to unbind the back pin. while my buddy was pounding, punching, pulling, bleeding, etc to get the bound back pin out. this aint natural....is it? (yes, i know the mast is top heavy so he was pushing down on it too....and up...and sideways and any other way we could try to move things to get the back pin out). before my mast goes back up i've got to figure out whats amiss with this cleating system and it gotta to be fixed somehow! tia
more mast raising/lowering questions...ginpole?
- Thread starter william3045
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sorry to hear
of your problems. I do not have a 23 but a 1994 23.5 which has a mast raising and lowering system. What I can tell you from the Hunter design is that they have the gin pole at the base of the mast. I can't tell you the pole length (heavy gague stainless steel approx 4.5 feet long) as it is on my boat one hr. away. The Hunter system has two stabilizing cables that are connected to each side of the mast apporx. 5 feet up from the base and the other end is connected to the stanchions. The stabilizer cables are an integral part of the system as it prevents side to side swaying that can be catastrophic. A fellow member of our yacht club had to replace his mast plate on his H 23 because his mast shifted to one side and he lost it. There is a cleat on the side of the mast that you cleat off your jib halyard and connect the other end to the gin pole. The mainsheet is also connected to the end of the gin pole and to the anchor connection in the anchor locker. Hope this helps. There is a photo forum where someone made a mast raising system for an H23. Good Luck. Jonathan Costello Heeling Powers
of your problems. I do not have a 23 but a 1994 23.5 which has a mast raising and lowering system. What I can tell you from the Hunter design is that they have the gin pole at the base of the mast. I can't tell you the pole length (heavy gague stainless steel approx 4.5 feet long) as it is on my boat one hr. away. The Hunter system has two stabilizing cables that are connected to each side of the mast apporx. 5 feet up from the base and the other end is connected to the stanchions. The stabilizer cables are an integral part of the system as it prevents side to side swaying that can be catastrophic. A fellow member of our yacht club had to replace his mast plate on his H 23 because his mast shifted to one side and he lost it. There is a cleat on the side of the mast that you cleat off your jib halyard and connect the other end to the gin pole. The mainsheet is also connected to the end of the gin pole and to the anchor connection in the anchor locker. Hope this helps. There is a photo forum where someone made a mast raising system for an H23. Good Luck. Jonathan Costello Heeling Powers
this helps allot
so the h23.5 basically attaches the jib halyard to the ginpole and then one cleats off the other end and then one pulls on the ginpole? (therefore using the jib halyard to pull up the mast and not the forestay?) there is a pretty solid 4 point padeye about 5' up my mast that looks like it would be a good place to attach a cable to and run to the ginpole (that i had already found attaches to the foot of the mast portion of the cleat), and from there attach the mainsheet between say an eye on the other side of the ginpole and the fore chainplate....or maybe a block at the chainplate and turn it aft toward a winch. (i'm rigging about a 1'x2" section of stainless to extend that chaiplate from out of the chainlocker to be able to attach the forestay and tack to....i hate that "down the hole" arrangement. i of course will have to shorten the forestay by about a foot. ...besides, i'm thinking furler. as far as the mast cleat itself goes, it looks like the section on my mast is going to have to come off and be straightened. the section on the deck looks pretty straight. ...probably some previous owner got things askew and torqued it because upon closer examination i can see it needs seriously straightened....thats most likely where my bind on the pins is coming from. i found the "cable" steadying system diagram i knew i had and it looks pretty viable. one short section of cable attaches between the front 2 stanction bases on each side with something like carabinas, and a second section attaches between that and the mast....again with something like a carabina so is therefore free to ride forward with the mast while still steadying it. i like simple! i have cable, thimbles, ferrels, and a crimping tool so this kind of rig should be pretty easy to build. as to the ginpole....i have been considering running a couple of 1"x2" oak planks between my front stanctions anyway to attach stuff too so they might could be easily detachable and rigged as a ginpole. they're a little over 6' long tho and i'm not sure about their strength if used as a ginpole....even of 2, 1"x2" oak pieces side by side. when i'm done they can be returned to their origional positions between the port and starbord stanctions.. dont know, just thoughts and brainstorming right now.....getting ideas......i just know if i keep this boat that mast raising is going to be a simple process and not a 2 man ordeal!
so the h23.5 basically attaches the jib halyard to the ginpole and then one cleats off the other end and then one pulls on the ginpole? (therefore using the jib halyard to pull up the mast and not the forestay?) there is a pretty solid 4 point padeye about 5' up my mast that looks like it would be a good place to attach a cable to and run to the ginpole (that i had already found attaches to the foot of the mast portion of the cleat), and from there attach the mainsheet between say an eye on the other side of the ginpole and the fore chainplate....or maybe a block at the chainplate and turn it aft toward a winch. (i'm rigging about a 1'x2" section of stainless to extend that chaiplate from out of the chainlocker to be able to attach the forestay and tack to....i hate that "down the hole" arrangement. i of course will have to shorten the forestay by about a foot. ...besides, i'm thinking furler. as far as the mast cleat itself goes, it looks like the section on my mast is going to have to come off and be straightened. the section on the deck looks pretty straight. ...probably some previous owner got things askew and torqued it because upon closer examination i can see it needs seriously straightened....thats most likely where my bind on the pins is coming from. i found the "cable" steadying system diagram i knew i had and it looks pretty viable. one short section of cable attaches between the front 2 stanction bases on each side with something like carabinas, and a second section attaches between that and the mast....again with something like a carabina so is therefore free to ride forward with the mast while still steadying it. i like simple! i have cable, thimbles, ferrels, and a crimping tool so this kind of rig should be pretty easy to build. as to the ginpole....i have been considering running a couple of 1"x2" oak planks between my front stanctions anyway to attach stuff too so they might could be easily detachable and rigged as a ginpole. they're a little over 6' long tho and i'm not sure about their strength if used as a ginpole....even of 2, 1"x2" oak pieces side by side. when i'm done they can be returned to their origional positions between the port and starbord stanctions.. dont know, just thoughts and brainstorming right now.....getting ideas......i just know if i keep this boat that mast raising is going to be a simple process and not a 2 man ordeal!
a farther question
given the crutch at its highest position, and the back pin in the cleat, should there be enough purchase with say a cabintop winch just to use the jib halyard, (connected at the fore chainplate), to raise the mast? (with some kind of athwartships bracing of course). i wonder what the load would be on the halyard. 3000# aprox breaking point comes to mind for my 3/8" halyard. does that sound about correct?
given the crutch at its highest position, and the back pin in the cleat, should there be enough purchase with say a cabintop winch just to use the jib halyard, (connected at the fore chainplate), to raise the mast? (with some kind of athwartships bracing of course). i wonder what the load would be on the halyard. 3000# aprox breaking point comes to mind for my 3/8" halyard. does that sound about correct?
The gin pole on a 240
is just under 6 feet tall. The gin pole needs to be as close to the base of the mast as posssible for the best leverage. The attatching point on the pole for my jib halyard is a 1/8 " stainless cable about 6" long with 2 loops. this allows it to float through the pole through 2 holes so you arent pulling directly on the pole. I don't have much problem pulling the rear pin on the mast base, sometimes i need to wiggle the mast side to side in the crutch. Make sure the tension on the halyards is released. I also made a sling out of 1/8" stainless similar to the mast sling to stabalize the gin pole. It helps alot. Some people use the trailer winch to raise the mast, but that only works on the trailer. Another way to lower the mast would be to use a figure 8 descender and a single line to lower it, you still would have to use the main sheet or come along to raise it. It gets easier after you have done it a few times, you'll develop a system that works for you. Good luck.
is just under 6 feet tall. The gin pole needs to be as close to the base of the mast as posssible for the best leverage. The attatching point on the pole for my jib halyard is a 1/8 " stainless cable about 6" long with 2 loops. this allows it to float through the pole through 2 holes so you arent pulling directly on the pole. I don't have much problem pulling the rear pin on the mast base, sometimes i need to wiggle the mast side to side in the crutch. Make sure the tension on the halyards is released. I also made a sling out of 1/8" stainless similar to the mast sling to stabalize the gin pole. It helps alot. Some people use the trailer winch to raise the mast, but that only works on the trailer. Another way to lower the mast would be to use a figure 8 descender and a single line to lower it, you still would have to use the main sheet or come along to raise it. It gets easier after you have done it a few times, you'll develop a system that works for you. Good luck.
A helping hand
William, I have a h26 which, except for a longer mainsheet, uses the original mast raising system that came with the boat. I have no problem (up to now) raising and lowering the mast, I can even do it on my own. Anyway, it sounds very nearly the same system that you are describing. I will be @ Pueblo North Shore Marina this weekend. If you would like to see the parts and how they work, or if I can help in any way you can contact me via VHS. I monitor CH16. or through the directory Hope It all works out. Chris
William, I have a h26 which, except for a longer mainsheet, uses the original mast raising system that came with the boat. I have no problem (up to now) raising and lowering the mast, I can even do it on my own. Anyway, it sounds very nearly the same system that you are describing. I will be @ Pueblo North Shore Marina this weekend. If you would like to see the parts and how they work, or if I can help in any way you can contact me via VHS. I monitor CH16. or through the directory Hope It all works out. Chris
unfortunately i will be working sunday...
i appreciate the offer, and i would very much like to look at your system if we could get together some other time. right now my boat is in my driveway. (it has been at so marina till last mon.) so i can't contact you on VHF but if you could e mail me at gdbg66a2000@yahoo.com maybe we can make arrangements for some other time when you will be at your boat. first things first tho...i have the foot/cleat off my kenyon mast and it is obviously seriously torqued in about all dimensions! think i will take it up to johnnys boiler and see if they can straighten it. i have called hunter and they dont stock the part but gave me the name of a co that might....probably be 4x as much as having this one straightened if it can be done. thanks~ william
i appreciate the offer, and i would very much like to look at your system if we could get together some other time. right now my boat is in my driveway. (it has been at so marina till last mon.) so i can't contact you on VHF but if you could e mail me at gdbg66a2000@yahoo.com maybe we can make arrangements for some other time when you will be at your boat. first things first tho...i have the foot/cleat off my kenyon mast and it is obviously seriously torqued in about all dimensions! think i will take it up to johnnys boiler and see if they can straighten it. i have called hunter and they dont stock the part but gave me the name of a co that might....probably be 4x as much as having this one straightened if it can be done. thanks~ william
There are several mast-raising rigs available
The Photo Forum contains details of at least three mast-raising rigs for the H23, including one that I developed from an idea I saw in SAIL magazine. These rigs are far superior to a gin-pole and require no connection to the front of the mast. The mast isn't really top-heavy, in fact the top of the Z-Spar mast is actually tapered to reduce weight aloft, and the mast is light enough to lift with one hand. The real problem is that the mast is so long that its CG is past the point where most people can reach with upraised arms. More importantly, one of the flaws of the H23 is that when the mast is laid down far enough to reach by hand, it rests on the main hatch and the unbalanced weight actually forces the base upward, wedging it in the tabernacle and making the back pin extremely difficult to remove. I also posted pictures in the Photo Forum of an extendable mast crutch that was developed by Bill Foster in the late 80's. I have a machine shop here in Orlando that can make you one for a reasonable price. You can even get it powder-coated like mine. One last thing. You shouldn't raise the mast by pulling on the forestay. If you let go while trying to fit it into the turnbuckle you could lose the mast. Use the jib halyard instead. Peter H23 "Raven"
The Photo Forum contains details of at least three mast-raising rigs for the H23, including one that I developed from an idea I saw in SAIL magazine. These rigs are far superior to a gin-pole and require no connection to the front of the mast. The mast isn't really top-heavy, in fact the top of the Z-Spar mast is actually tapered to reduce weight aloft, and the mast is light enough to lift with one hand. The real problem is that the mast is so long that its CG is past the point where most people can reach with upraised arms. More importantly, one of the flaws of the H23 is that when the mast is laid down far enough to reach by hand, it rests on the main hatch and the unbalanced weight actually forces the base upward, wedging it in the tabernacle and making the back pin extremely difficult to remove. I also posted pictures in the Photo Forum of an extendable mast crutch that was developed by Bill Foster in the late 80's. I have a machine shop here in Orlando that can make you one for a reasonable price. You can even get it powder-coated like mine. One last thing. You shouldn't raise the mast by pulling on the forestay. If you let go while trying to fit it into the turnbuckle you could lose the mast. Use the jib halyard instead. Peter H23 "Raven"
Extendable Mast Crutch Wanted
Hi Peter, In your reply you mentioned that you have a machine shop and could create an extendable mast crutch for a reasonable price. I'd like to get one before I have to step the mast this Fall. What are you considering reasonable? Steve sullrich@integraonline.com
Hi Peter, In your reply you mentioned that you have a machine shop and could create an extendable mast crutch for a reasonable price. I'd like to get one before I have to step the mast this Fall. What are you considering reasonable? Steve sullrich@integraonline.com
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