Modifying a Trailer
- Thread starter Jfelkins
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It wasn't a pantoon trailer but it might help.
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The 4x4's are treated lumber and indoor out door carpet on the bunks.
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The 4x4's are treated lumber and indoor out door carpet on the bunks.
I would buy a tandem powerboat bunk trailer that would handle the weight of your boat and be long enough to float it off and on at the ramp. Your 23 weighs 3085 Lbs, so you would need a trailer that would be long enough to handle a 24' boat and take the weight, plus the weight of everything inside your boat. Then, I would check out the Long Boat Trailer Company in Tarboro NC http://www.macraesbluebook.com/search/company.cfm?company=320123
and buy some longer extension brackets for your bunks. They have the best bunk extension brackets I've ever seen. I have the 24" brackets on my trailer which is a Long Aluminum tandem powerboat bunk trailer. For the keel, you can take two pressure treated planks and attach them to the center of your trailer's cross members using power company galvanized lightning arrester brackets. You wouldn't need to drill any holes in the cross members to hold these planks. You would only drill the holes into the planks and countersink the heads so the keel won't hit them. The bolts are carriage type galvanized. Any power company bracket will work such as fuse cutout brackets, and high voltage URD (Pot heads) termination kits. They don't always use these brackets and they wind up throwing them away. They'll probably give them to you. You may need two or three depending on the location of the cross members. Here's some pics of my Long trailer.
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Thanks, this is really helpful. I'm trying to avoid buying a trailer right now, although I know that's my long term solution. Below is the trailer I probably can get access to. The second pic is from the tongue of the trailer. It has an actuator brake also. I have a 4 X 4 Chevy Suburban (Big Nasty) to tow it. I just need to get it out of the water, home, cleaned up and back before spring. That should be easy right! :Liar:
PLUS: The boat isn't even mine yet but I can't stop my mind from working on all the logistics to make this happen.
Thanks again for the great input.
PLUS: The boat isn't even mine yet but I can't stop my mind from working on all the logistics to make this happen.
Thanks again for the great input.
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Jfelkins,
In the long term, Joe (Trinkka) is right on. I did something similar with scrap steel from work and raised the roller assemblies to meet the hull, but I like Joe's better. In the short term, Mario is the man. You can certainly invest $100 max in lumber an build a cradle for it. Done right, this would be the cradle in your yard too. Be sure to cross brace everything! And don't cheap out like I usually do. An extra $10 for screws beats $500 in crane fees to get it of the pavement of I84!
The close up is the junk trailer I bought. The boat on the trailer is after raising the rolller assemblies, getting ready to sail in a 11 knot breeze. NICE!
In the long term, Joe (Trinkka) is right on. I did something similar with scrap steel from work and raised the roller assemblies to meet the hull, but I like Joe's better. In the short term, Mario is the man. You can certainly invest $100 max in lumber an build a cradle for it. Done right, this would be the cradle in your yard too. Be sure to cross brace everything! And don't cheap out like I usually do. An extra $10 for screws beats $500 in crane fees to get it of the pavement of I84!
The close up is the junk trailer I bought. The boat on the trailer is after raising the rolller assemblies, getting ready to sail in a 11 knot breeze. NICE!
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I gambled and centered the keel on the wheels. Seems to have paid off. The tongue weight is around 300 lbs and she tows like a dream. One thing that I didn't do but should have, is support the bow. If you look at my photo, you'll notice the boat is supported by the rollers before and after the keel. But the bow is floating. It tends to bounce a little going dwon the road. Especially since it was low tide last week and I couldn't get her the last 2 inches to the bow stop rollers. You can control the bounce by putting cinch (sp ?) strap from the bow loop to the trailer frame.
Yes. That's the first thing you'll need to do. It's pretty much in the center of the keel. So if you figure the keel being pretty much in the center of the twin axles, it will give you a ball park place to start. You'll need to get the proper tongue weight which should be any where between 5 to 10% of the boat's fully found total weight. I used a bathroom scale to do mine. I unhooked the trailer with the boat on it, and got the trailer level by putting the scale on a block of wood. Then I hooked it back up and backed down the ramp and let the boat float back a few inches and brought it back up and weighed her again until I got the proper tongue weight for my boat. All that was left after that was to move the winch stanchion so that the bow roller was against the bow and tighten it down. The adjustment for the 24" bunk extension brackets was a breeze. All I did was put a jack under the two middle brackets on each side of the trailer, raise, measure, and tighten them down. Then I did the same thing to the front and rear brackets. The bunk boards will bend and conform to the hull and this is what you want. If you have any concerns about the adjusters slipping down, I didn't, but I suppose that it can be a possibility, you could insert measured pieces of 2X4s to fit between the top of the trailer's cross members and the under side of the bunk. These small pieces of wood can fit up against the adjuster and be attached with zip ties or whatever you want to use. There's no way those bunks could ever creep down with those inserted under the bunks. That's about it. Good luck!
Joe
“dscribner” from your pictures I see your problem with not getting the boat forward against the bow stop roller.
Your winch is too low, it should be level or slightly higher than the bow eye. With the winch lower the pull is down on the bow thus holding the stern up, the pivot point is the front lollers or the front edge of a bunk, as your winch pulls down on the bow when at the ramp, because of it’s angle the stern is floating above the rear trailer roller or bunk. When you pull the boat out of the water the stern settles down on the rear rollers or bunk thus lifting the bow away from the bow stop roller.
What your want is the reverse too happen, with the winch level or slightly higher, as you pull the boat forward on the trailer you’re lifting the bow and sinking the stern to start matching the angle of the ramp so when the stern settles down on the rear rollers or a bunk the lift is not as great on the bow.
Your winch is too low, it should be level or slightly higher than the bow eye. With the winch lower the pull is down on the bow thus holding the stern up, the pivot point is the front lollers or the front edge of a bunk, as your winch pulls down on the bow when at the ramp, because of it’s angle the stern is floating above the rear trailer roller or bunk. When you pull the boat out of the water the stern settles down on the rear rollers or bunk thus lifting the bow away from the bow stop roller.
What your want is the reverse too happen, with the winch level or slightly higher, as you pull the boat forward on the trailer you’re lifting the bow and sinking the stern to start matching the angle of the ramp so when the stern settles down on the rear rollers or a bunk the lift is not as great on the bow.
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Roller trailers are great if you're going to do a lot of trailering. I had a Load-Rite roller trailer that came with my boat new and there was nothing like it for launching my boat in most ramps. Not all sailboats hulls are suitable for roller trailers but I know that the O'Day hulls can take them. Where I'm only trailering about twice in the season because I have a mooring at the club, I chose the tandem bunk trailer. There are advantages and disadvantages to these trailers compared to the roller trailer. The bunk trailer needs to be long enough to be able to float the boat on and off at the ramp, unless you can rig up an extra long tongue like my friend Wayne did to his trailer. Then you're always going to have the problem of the bow falling a couple of inches short of the trailer's bow roller after you pull the trailer up the ramp. This has more to do with the angle of the ramp in relation to the boat floating on the water. When the keel meets the trailer's keel board, it will probably hang up on that spot and as the trailer goes up the ramp, the keel settles on the board at that spot. There are ways of getting around this problem though and you'll probably need to experiment with them. Here's some pics of Wayne's rig and some pics of my old Load-Rite which finally bit the dust a few years ago.
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I couldn't tell you how easy it is to launch and retrieve my C-22 where I only need to get the trucks rear tires wet, and it will float on or off the trialer very easy. Alone it takes seconds. I've trailered as much as 600 miles one way, the tongue wright is such I can pick it up to hook it on the bumper with the boat on the trailer and the tongue on the ground.
Watercolors! You're my hero! It's been bugging me ever since I did it but, hey, I'm clueless! I'll raise it when the temp goes below 90! Thursday I think.
Trinkka, I trailer EVERY time. It takes about 30 minutes to get the mast up or down and get in the water. We get better at it each time. I've replaced many shackles with snap shackles & spring hooks to speed the process and built a mast cover that supports the roller furler, covers all the rigging and contains all the straps to hold everything together and hold everything down. (No more bucket o' bungees). I also built a gin pole tha straps to the mast and has all the guide leads and a block and tackle permanently attached. So, only 2 things to worry about!
Trinkka, I trailer EVERY time. It takes about 30 minutes to get the mast up or down and get in the water. We get better at it each time. I've replaced many shackles with snap shackles & spring hooks to speed the process and built a mast cover that supports the roller furler, covers all the rigging and contains all the straps to hold everything together and hold everything down. (No more bucket o' bungees). I also built a gin pole tha straps to the mast and has all the guide leads and a block and tackle permanently attached. So, only 2 things to worry about!
It sounds like you have everything covered for quick and easy trailer sailing. You'll come up more ways to make it easier as you go along. To me, these modifications are so much a part of the fun of owning a boat.
Smooth Sailing!
Joe
Jeff,
I did it at our club one day when I first brought my new trailer down there to load my boat on it. We have a pretty good ramp. What I did before I loaded my boat on the trailer was, I got a rough measurement of the height of the rollers on my old Load-Rite trailer and set my bunks up for that height. As it turned out though, the bottom of my keel was sitting about an inch or two off the keel board after I loaded her on the trailer and pulled her up on to level ground, but that's OK. In other words, the bunks were supporting that boat plus the keel. It's better to have your bunks set a little high at first than to have them set so low that when you pull the boat out of the water, the boat tips to one side.
Then I pulled the trailer over to the level ground. I don't remember whether I lowered the boat down so that the keel was sitting on the trailer's keel board, or whether I chalked the trailer wheels and disconnected the trailer from my truck and checked the tongue weight. I remember backing the trailer down the ramp and letting the boat float back a few inches because the tongue weight was too heavy. Wayne was there that day and he said, "I'd let the boat float back about to this mark." We used one of my trailer's guide posts as a reference and I lightly drew a pencil mark where he pointed to on the hull. After I pulled the trailer back on to the lawn again and got the proper tongue weight, I left the trailer connected to my truck and proceeded to lower my boat so that the keel was setting on the board. I may have used two of my sailboat stands, one on each side in the stern of my boat to hold the weight and keep the boat straight as I lowered the hull, plus my hydraulic jack under the bow from the ground, or sitting on planks on the trailer frame. There are so many ways to do this. I probably lowered the two sailboat stands a little at a time in conjunction with the hydraulic jack after I loosened the bunk extension brackets. After I got the weight of the boat plus the keel sitting on the keel board, I put a jack under each of the center extension brackets and raised them up to the hull. I took measurements and tightened the bolts and did the other extension brackets in the same way.
I used two 2"X 10"X 8' pressure treated planks for my trailer's keel board and I cut about 10.5" off them because they were a little too long. I counter sunk the holes for the carriage bolt heads on the top plank with a large Forstner bit and used a 3/8" drill bit for the carriage bolts.
If I didn't have my sailboat stands with me that day to lower my boat on the trailer, I'm almost certain that I could have done it with three jacks. If you look carefully at my trailer, you'll see that my winch stand is on the inside of my trailer frame. That's where it needed to go after I got the proper tongue weight. I've been very fortunate that my trailer is long enough for me to back down the ramp and float my boat off it without swamping my truck, otherwise I'd have to install an extension tongue on my trailer like Wayne has on his.
Joe
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Joe,
You are being very gracious with the time you are spending on these answers. Thank you very much. I'm modifying my trailer this week and hopefully getting my boat on it this weekend so this is all very timely. I would be happy to talk via phone if it would be easier but here are a few detail questions my "fab shop" asked me.
What dimensions are the risers? Are they 1 1/2 by 1 1/2 square?
How long are the risers?
Do I understand you and the pictures to show that the risers are held to the cross pieces via friction only?
Am I seeing 2 risers for the bow bunks and 3 risers for the main bunks?
Thanks again. I'm sending my phone number to you via private message in case you want to talk instead.
John
You are being very gracious with the time you are spending on these answers. Thank you very much. I'm modifying my trailer this week and hopefully getting my boat on it this weekend so this is all very timely. I would be happy to talk via phone if it would be easier but here are a few detail questions my "fab shop" asked me.
What dimensions are the risers? Are they 1 1/2 by 1 1/2 square?
How long are the risers?
Do I understand you and the pictures to show that the risers are held to the cross pieces via friction only?
Am I seeing 2 risers for the bow bunks and 3 risers for the main bunks?
Thanks again. I'm sending my phone number to you via private message in case you want to talk instead.
John
Hi John,
It was purely my pleasure. Perhaps some day I'll make it to that good place where everyone wants to go when they leave this earth.
To sum up what we talked about on Skype yesterday, and in answer to your questions that you pose on this entry, the risers or bunk extension brackets on my Long trailer are 2"X 2" square stock galvanized tube and each one is 24" long. Actually, if you measure from bottom the bracket to the top of the bunk board you get about 26.5"
The flat plate brackets that hold these extension brackets, have two U bolts that fit over my trailer's cross members which are 3"X 3" square stock galvanized tube. Friction holds them on. As I previously pointed out John. If you have any issues with it you could cut some 2"X 4" pieces of wood to fit between the top of the cross members and the bottom of the bunk, but I really don't think that it would be necessary.
Yes. You are seeing two sets of extension brackets. One set of two brackets is for the bow section of my trailer, and another set of three extension brackets for the main bunks.
When I first got my trailer, I had to change the locations of the front bunks by relocatating the lags in order to get that bunk's V shape to hold the bow of my boat. Note the difference in the placement of the forward bunks in each picture. It was just a matter of removing some lags to allow the bunk to swivel on the bracket as I moved the two front brackets closer together to form a V under the bow. Then I redrilled the bunks for the new location of the lags. I hope that this will help you and if you have any additional question, don't hesitate to ask me. Good luck!
Joe
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