Mast height ?

[jmnewell]

My boat is a 1982 H27 Cherubini
I pulled up specs online for the H27 75-84, and it shows a mast height of 36'3". When I measure the mast I have its 30'8". If there were no other variations for mast dimensions during those years. The only other answer is the PO retrofitted with some other variation. Does anyone have anything that may clear this up. If not it will clear up some of my previous post about mast & boom connections and spreaders.


thanks John

 

[Benny]

The mast height distance as quoted in the specs is from the top of the mast to the boat's waterline. The purpose of this spec is to reference vertical clearance not to how long the spar itself may be. The h27 Cherubini tall rig model was a mere marketing denomination as there was no short rig produced by the factory. The tall rigs with high aspect main sails and large genoas were in vogue at the time and most manufacturers offerd both configurations but the h27 just bore the popular designation. Because of the age of the boats many have been re-rigged and re-configured so you may find individual boats with different specs. The h27 "C " bore an excellent design and was overbuilt as at the time the strength design limits of fiberglass construction were not well defined. The boat is an excellent pocket cruiser even though it was designed to be the least expensive boat in its class. Small winches and sparse equipment attest to that.

 

[jmnewell]

The specs I pulled up show a few different measurements, it looks to be there is one for the mast above the water line as in your reply then there is the mast height which are different. As I measure my mast lying on the ground it measures 30'8". I will enclose hopefully a pdf file with the specs mentioned.

 

[emkay]

The mast height distance as quoted in the specs is from the top of the mast to the boat's waterline. The purpose of this spec is to reference vertical clearance not to how long the spar itself may be. The h27 Cherubini tall rig model was a mere marketing denomination as there was no short rig produced by the factory. The tall rigs with high aspect main sails and large genoas were in vogue at the time and most manufacturers offerd both configurations but the h27 just bore the popular designation. Because of the age of the boats many have been re-rigged and re-configured so you may find individual boats with different specs. The h27 "C " bore an excellent design and was overbuilt as at the time the strength design limits of fiberglass construction were not well defined. The boat is an excellent pocket cruiser even though it was designed to be the least expensive boat in its class. Small winches and sparse equipment attest to that.

This is incorrect, the mast height is the mast height from the deck. Height from the waterline is a different measurement. Also you are incorrect about Hunter producing a tall and short rig, they did. The Hunter 27 had a short rig and a tall rig, it was changed to a tall rig sometime in 1979. The mast height for the short rig is 33' 5", and height from waterline is 39' 1". The tall rig which the original poster should have has a mast height of 36' 3" and a height from waterline of 40' 11" the mainsail luff on the short rig was 29' 8" , and of course the mainsail luff on my boat (and also one from 1982) is 32' 4". making a 30' mast physically impossible. Also, my mast was down on top of my boat all winter, with about 5' overhanging each end of the boat, also impossible for a 30' mast

 

[jmnewell]

does it seem probable that the PO has changed the mast? do you have any of the original info such as mast/boom manufacturer? I have been curious because nothing seemed to jive with this.

 

[Benny]

emkay, I don't dispute that your boat may have been delivered from factory with a shorter mast configuration and that latter models were delivered with a taller mast. All I'm saying is that a transition from one size mast to another does not support the assertion that the h27 Cherubuni had a tall and short rig option in their production line. The tall rig denomination, if I'm not mistaken, was first used for the 1982 models. There was no option provided to the boat buyer to choose from a tall or short rig in any production year. The tall rig denomination was introduced as a marketing tool to indicate to the public that the rig was in line with the popular tall rigs offered at the time. In the issue about the mast height and vertical clearance you are correct and I was unaware of the source of the information and had incorrectly assumed it had come from the boat info specs in this forum which usually provide vertical clearance.

jmnewell, by 1982 production of the h27 Cherubini had been pretty well streamlined so if the specs called for a mast heighth of 36'3" and yours measures 30'8" it would be safe to say it may have been replaced. I believe that the mast manufacturer used by Hunter in 1982 for the h27 was Kenyon. Check and see who the manufacturer of your mast is. As for the reason a PO may have replaced or shortened the mast is just matter of speculation. In some parts of the country rigs are shortened for the purpose of being able to clear vertical obstacles irrespective of tides. Another reason for replacement can be a repair and availability and cost may have played a factor. You do not mention wether you have a deep draft or shallow draft keel. If it is a shallow draft keel perhaps the boat sails better with the reduced sail area. Hope all this discussion may have given you a better insight of what out there. As additional information the Luhr family started Hunter in 1973 and the first model year for the h27 was 1974. Back in the early days availability of components was not very stramlined so components which differed from the original design specs may have regularly found their way into boats just because they were there. I believe that by 1979 those problems were surmounted but to this day most boats manufacturers reserve the right to divert from specs.

 

[jmnewell]

Benny & Emkay
Thanks so much for some additional information each tidbit and thread of info seems to help a bit more. You asked what my H27's keel design was. I have the deep keel. Also I know my boom is a kenyon boom & can only assume the mast is of the same. I can submit pictures if need be.

thanks John

 

[jmnewell]

A question to pose. This part will be later in my refurb project, and I am in the information preperation phase of this portion so I have time to plan. If I end up going back to specs with the mast& stay with Kenyon what would the dimensions be? Mine looks to measure 5.00 X 3.50 at the base, and actually looks closer to 5.24 X 3.50 depending on where you get the measurements. I looked on Rig Rites website & the closest in size is the 3550 does this sound about right?

thanks again John

 

[emkay]

Benny, you still have a lot of incorrect info. As I stated, the short rig was manufactured up to sometime in 1979, not 1982. Mine is a tall rig as stated in my post as it was manufactured in 1980 and the mast is 36' 3". I did not state my boat has a short mast, it has a tall one. Also, the H27 started production in 1976, not 1974. Not sure where you are getting your info, but it is not correct.

 

[tomgrigsby]

does it seem probable that the PO has changed the mast? do you have any of the original info such as mast/boom manufacturer? I have been curious because nothing seemed to jive with this.

Did the mast come installed or simply accompanying the boat? There are any number of reasons why the original would be gone and something that could be made to work included. That may involve recutting all shrouds, stays, and modifying the boom attachment point. Obviously the spreaders (or more correctly - lack thereof) is a point of concern.

 

[jmnewell]

Tom
I'll try to give you the brief knowlege as I know it. I purchased the craft from someone in OKC, he had started on the project completing a few cosmetic items, mostly in the cabin etc. He had to let the project go due to some life changes. I picked it up at what I still think was real reasonable as I was wanting to tackle a "project boat" to come away with what I wanted. Anyway the history lesson he gave me was the fella he had purchased it from had initially purchased it anticipating he was going to just scrap it out for parts, but when he looked the project over felt bad about scrapping a boat in as good of condition it was in. during all this the boat was trailered with the mast boom and sails stowed in and on the boat, however there was not any running rigging cables, and some other parts still missing from the mast. I measured the sails that are provided & they conform to the mast I have with it, but not with the specs. This would lead me to believe that the mast may have been damaged and shortened or a replacement mast of a shorter height was put on in place of the original?? The boom has the Kenyon emblem on the outhaul end. I may leave the mast and boom problem to last, then try to replace close to original with exception adding a main traveler over the companionway etc

any info you could offer would be helpful

thanks John

 

[Benny]

Emkay, there was no tall or short rig option for the 1980 models. You can designate your boat as a tall rig model but the factory desiganation did not come till latter. Your specs may or may not be original but I doubt Hunter has kept production records so we are wasting our time arguing about this. I have researched the history of Hunter Marine and have researched the various Cherubini models and their designer. His son John Cherubini II provided very useful information in this forum a few years ago. To the best of my understanding there was a 1975 model produced with production commencing in 1974 but if you have evidence to the contrary I would be more than glad to acknowledge as I have no vested interest in the issue.

 

[emkay]

Benny, Hunter didn't designate it as a tall rig, they just changed it in 1979 for the 1980 models. The documentation to prove this came with my boat and is also available on Hunters website. The brochure has the tall rig specs, the manual that came with the boat is for a short rig 1979 model with an additional page that has the updated 1980 specs. The 27 was built in 1976 and on. The 25 started production in 1974

 

[tomgrigsby]

John
Sounds like you have an excellent plan for the project. Certainly the mast and rigging can wait for later. You have a popular boat so if you start looking now, I'd be surprised if you couldn't find the proper mast for the boat. Jorge Fife posts quite a lot in the mid-size forum, and he is near a boat scrap yard. You may want to check in with him. He has offered to keep an eye out for needed items.

 

[jmnewell]

Tom
Thanks so much, I may have to bother you in the future. This is going to be a process to get my H27 back "ship-shape", but it will be worth it. Ive got a good sound hull as a base to start with.
Thanks again Shipmate

 

[tomgrigsby]

Don't give a though to bothering anyone on this forum. Everyone has been wonderful about helping out with questions. Getting to talk about sailboats is the next best thing to sailing them. And we all get to be experts! Occasionally an abrupt answer is forthcoming, but even then in a gentlemanly fashion.