Nasty low_tide_like odor just began to appear in my powerboat since the end of last season. Never an odor when I get to the boat. Only appears after I get moving. Per comments I've seen to Peggy to others, I removed every acces plate, storage unit, flush mount items to visually inspect all the areas possible. Nothing seen. I'm suspecious there's a nasty pocket of water somewhere in the bilge that sloshes upon moving. And so, I've been going through the bilge areas. However, I'm not certain it's water born??? I've tried different products then water flusing attemps. Bilge cleaner, spray nine, bleach, odor-xit. ALl NG. AT the end of last season I fresh water flushed all 3 zones while the boat was blocked rather bow high, clean water flowed out the transom drain in all cases. Other info... boat is a 2000 I've owned since new, problem only started last year. it's a single outboard so rather stern light, and with that water in the center and lowest bilge zone tends to collect more forward at rest. This center zone is actually divided into forward and aft bilge areas, with a pvc pipe passing the water forward<>aft under the gas tank compartment. I can see the pipe from the aft center bilge, but can't see it in the forward zone. Other 2 zones sit a bit higher running lengthwise outside from the chine to about a foot inward. I can see the full length down the port side, dry and clean. I can only see 2/3s way down the starboard side, and I have found a bit a water on this starboard side at times. No access plate to check out the aft section, but I could blindly just about reach over a stringer to fell around. Nothing at the end. However, wiring is rigged down a large pvc pipe down this side, and just exits the pvc and drags through this section as it bets to the center aft bilge. Could reach to feel most of this wiring, but the couple of excess wire bundles I could reach were clean. Just this evening I really tried pin pointing where the odor starts... start moving and the shut down quick, no smell, tried a little more, and appears the smell starts light in the aft center bilge and the startboard side. After running a few minutes, the smell pours out strong from the cabin. This is the first discouaging boating problem I've had in my 25 years of boating. Loosing it! Please advise.... Thanks for any help, Timing ps I've read so much good of KO on this board, I'm thinking of flushing with it???
low tide smell...
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The source is definitely waterborne....
"Low tide" odor that rolls out when agitated by motion of the boat...all add up to a swamp--trapped water, most likely sea water--somewhere below decks. And from what you've said about how it starts, I'm betting that's somewhere on the starboard side...and that the PVC wiring chase may be creating the barrier that's blocking water drainage. I'm not sure what a 240wac is...I'm assuming it's a 24' something with a cabin...is there a shower sump? Wet dirty sumps are excellent sources of swamp/sewer odor. You said you've used all kinds of cleaners...Have you tried a power washer and plenty of detergent and THEN a thorough flushing out to get into places you can't reach? You may have a better chance of pinpointing the source location if you put someone in the cabin while you do the same maneuvers you just tried...have all the access hatches, lockers drawers etc open while you do it to allow the odor an immediate escape route. This is gonna take some detective work, but we'll find it. I don't think K.O. will help, though..'cuz wherever the water is trapped is an anaerobic environment...that's why it stinks. Let's work together on it.
"Low tide" odor that rolls out when agitated by motion of the boat...all add up to a swamp--trapped water, most likely sea water--somewhere below decks. And from what you've said about how it starts, I'm betting that's somewhere on the starboard side...and that the PVC wiring chase may be creating the barrier that's blocking water drainage. I'm not sure what a 240wac is...I'm assuming it's a 24' something with a cabin...is there a shower sump? Wet dirty sumps are excellent sources of swamp/sewer odor. You said you've used all kinds of cleaners...Have you tried a power washer and plenty of detergent and THEN a thorough flushing out to get into places you can't reach? You may have a better chance of pinpointing the source location if you put someone in the cabin while you do the same maneuvers you just tried...have all the access hatches, lockers drawers etc open while you do it to allow the odor an immediate escape route. This is gonna take some detective work, but we'll find it. I don't think K.O. will help, though..'cuz wherever the water is trapped is an anaerobic environment...that's why it stinks. Let's work together on it.
thanks...
Peggy, Firstly, sincere thanks for helping me with this frustrating problem. Boat is a walk around cuddy cabin. Single engine outboard. Weather permitting this evening, I’ll take some digital pics and post them for reference.. Couple of quick notes for now… Waterborne swamp. I’m thinking 2 possible sources… Because of my boats slight list forward, and the bilge water collecting up front, just last spring I installed a bilge pump up there. Installed a new thru hull fitting about 3/4s the way up from the water line, and that’s about a 1/3 of the way back. That’s actually higher then the thru hull for the near by sink, and never had bay/sea water back wash to the sink. However, perhaps some seawater did backwash from this new forward bilge pump thru fitting. I thought about this over the winter and just this spring installed a check valve and added more bilge hose to hang it at the highest point I could get to. This high point is now about even with the bumper rail. Last season we had several tubing outings with the kids and friends. Lots of kids with bay water dripping in the cockpit and cabin. Cabin floor has a drain to the center bilge. Perhaps… Oh, and based on your suspicion near the wiring… Perhaps I should add a deck plate on the euro transom integrated swim platform on the Starboard side where those wires drag from the large PVC rigging tube, across to the aft center bilge. Stinkin and thinkin… Timing
Peggy, Firstly, sincere thanks for helping me with this frustrating problem. Boat is a walk around cuddy cabin. Single engine outboard. Weather permitting this evening, I’ll take some digital pics and post them for reference.. Couple of quick notes for now… Waterborne swamp. I’m thinking 2 possible sources… Because of my boats slight list forward, and the bilge water collecting up front, just last spring I installed a bilge pump up there. Installed a new thru hull fitting about 3/4s the way up from the water line, and that’s about a 1/3 of the way back. That’s actually higher then the thru hull for the near by sink, and never had bay/sea water back wash to the sink. However, perhaps some seawater did backwash from this new forward bilge pump thru fitting. I thought about this over the winter and just this spring installed a check valve and added more bilge hose to hang it at the highest point I could get to. This high point is now about even with the bumper rail. Last season we had several tubing outings with the kids and friends. Lots of kids with bay water dripping in the cockpit and cabin. Cabin floor has a drain to the center bilge. Perhaps… Oh, and based on your suspicion near the wiring… Perhaps I should add a deck plate on the euro transom integrated swim platform on the Starboard side where those wires drag from the large PVC rigging tube, across to the aft center bilge. Stinkin and thinkin… Timing
Aha!
Bilge pumps always leave some water...whatever is between the pump and the top of the arch in the hose runs back down. It has to be manually removed. Even with a check valve (which is a VERY bad idea, btw, because it can fail or become clogged and completely block the flow of water), unless it's right at the pump a little can still run back...and even a half cup at a time can stagnate and stink, especially in hot weather. I doubt that posting any photos will help to identify the source of the water. You're thinking in the right directions...just keep using your nose and fingers...you'll find it.
Bilge pumps always leave some water...whatever is between the pump and the top of the arch in the hose runs back down. It has to be manually removed. Even with a check valve (which is a VERY bad idea, btw, because it can fail or become clogged and completely block the flow of water), unless it's right at the pump a little can still run back...and even a half cup at a time can stagnate and stink, especially in hot weather. I doubt that posting any photos will help to identify the source of the water. You're thinking in the right directions...just keep using your nose and fingers...you'll find it.
status...
Yesterday, I managed to get the digital camera where my head couldn't fit, pics showed nothing conclusive. Still thinking 2 possible sources: 1. starboard / aft corner and wiring. From the camera angle shot from the cabin all the way back, looks like only some of the wiring droops to rest on the floor. Perhaps not a lot of opportunity for a pocket to collect? Today I’m installing a deck plate on the built in euro transom platform so I could finally see what’s going on in that zone. Very interesting question... In searching under deck by hand and smell, when rubbing a section of fiberglass near those wires in the starboard corner zone and smelling mildew on my hand, could that turn into the low_tide smell when washed wet? 2. mid bilge track. As a result of the digital pics, I can also see that pvc pipe that runs under the gas tank sub floor. Actually, that mid/forward bilge section looked fine along with the entry to the pvc pipe. Now I’m certain water is passing thru that pvc pipe, and The products I’ve flushed with so far have passed thru there, But I’m wondering if there could be some residual stuff Hanging on the walls? Makes me wonder… could this stuff be On the upper side of that pipe, and flushing only gets the lower portion? Perhaps a snake with a small bottle brush? General: In asking if I’ve flushed with the unreachable areas with detergent, What would you recommend detergent / solution wise? I do have a bottle of KO at this time. Thanks again for your help. Still stinkin & thinkin... ps Looking forward to recieving your book I recently order from sailboatowners.com.
Yesterday, I managed to get the digital camera where my head couldn't fit, pics showed nothing conclusive. Still thinking 2 possible sources: 1. starboard / aft corner and wiring. From the camera angle shot from the cabin all the way back, looks like only some of the wiring droops to rest on the floor. Perhaps not a lot of opportunity for a pocket to collect? Today I’m installing a deck plate on the built in euro transom platform so I could finally see what’s going on in that zone. Very interesting question... In searching under deck by hand and smell, when rubbing a section of fiberglass near those wires in the starboard corner zone and smelling mildew on my hand, could that turn into the low_tide smell when washed wet? 2. mid bilge track. As a result of the digital pics, I can also see that pvc pipe that runs under the gas tank sub floor. Actually, that mid/forward bilge section looked fine along with the entry to the pvc pipe. Now I’m certain water is passing thru that pvc pipe, and The products I’ve flushed with so far have passed thru there, But I’m wondering if there could be some residual stuff Hanging on the walls? Makes me wonder… could this stuff be On the upper side of that pipe, and flushing only gets the lower portion? Perhaps a snake with a small bottle brush? General: In asking if I’ve flushed with the unreachable areas with detergent, What would you recommend detergent / solution wise? I do have a bottle of KO at this time. Thanks again for your help. Still stinkin & thinkin... ps Looking forward to recieving your book I recently order from sailboatowners.com.
6/16 pm update
Peggy, I took the day off work to dig into the odor problem on the boat.... Not yet fixed, but... Installed the deck plate on the transom platform for inspection. Nothing conclusive. Just a few areas of slight wetness, with a slight mildew. This includes the wires that exited the PVC rigging tube and ran accross to the aft-center bilge. Interesting find: there's a hose that feeds the transom shower that runs the length of this starboard bilge, under the PVC rigging tube, and fastened with plastic loops screwed into the ribes every 2 feet. This is just about off the floor at the inside chine corner. From that new inspection plate, I felt some wetness and in just one 4" section a sligh gooyness. However it just smelt like slightly mildewy water. Again noting slight water build did occur in this last 20% of the inside chine. BTW, the boat has a reverse chine, so this does leave a slight pitch down & out to collect. Previously, I had already spray9 cleaned this starboard bilge from the cabin/front with a swobbit 80% of the way back (up to the wire blockage). Given this new aft acces, I spray9 cleaned the back 3 feet, including the wires. Another intersting thing given new access: Some wires were bundled in split/black sheathing. If I opened the split, in just the lower inch or so, slight wetness with slight mildew smell. I let the wire(s) slightly out to wedge the split open for airing. I also wet vac'd every nook and cranny I could get to / snake the hose. With the wife and son we took a test/sniff ride. I had all the cabin acces point open (cooler removed (large opening port side), storage compartments, inspection plates). Only moving passed 10mph could we just begin to get the odor awake. If we slowed down, it would subside. Just above and below this speed could turn the slight smell on and off. This initial odor: >coming from the starboard side. >could smell it at the gunnels forward thru rod holder before any where else. Defintly no port side smells. As we went faster, it then began to come into the cabin, and stronger. However, slightly less strength then it was on my last outing. And even after a faster ride back, and slowing down, it did seem to mellow out sonner. During the inital test, did not smell it from any of the open transom deck plates. In fact at certain speeds my wife commented she could smell the outboard fumes. And so I guess it's safe to say the air during the slower test flowed aft>forward. This would put the source on the starboard side, anywhere from the transom up to those rod holders (about mid ship). Unless it's coming from mid ship and somehow pushing only up starboard side? Hummm, now I'm noting, perhaps I need to do a turn/bank test? Very interesting observation: although when we left the dock all accessable bilge sections were dry, upon return, I discovered perhaps a pint of water in the center bilge, just slightly forward of mid ship. This water had a very diluted smell of my dreaded low_tide/rotten eggs. Perhaps residual run off from that starboard area? Or is the source somehow mid bilge? What next... I made about a gallon of 1:10 solution of KO:water in a pressure tank sprayer and shot all acceessable bilge areas (starboard, center and port). Heaviest on the starbosrd side. Including the inside walls so it would flow under that transon shower hose and wires. Left the cabin windows / hatch vent open, and all thos cabin access points open to allow the KO to activate. I undertsand it might take a couple of days for this "good bacteria" process to work. Should I be taking a ride for the next couple of days to keep moving the solution around? Does KO keep working after it dries? Peggy, you previously asked if I cleaned unaccessable area with "detergent". Would you recommed such a detergent flush after a couple/few days of KO. If yes, please advise on what interval/material/product/solution? Again, thanks in advance for your expert help. Still stinkin and thinkin. Timing. ps Just amazed at how something that smells so nasty upon stiring/moving, has no impact at rest - somewhat of a sleeping giant!
Peggy, I took the day off work to dig into the odor problem on the boat.... Not yet fixed, but... Installed the deck plate on the transom platform for inspection. Nothing conclusive. Just a few areas of slight wetness, with a slight mildew. This includes the wires that exited the PVC rigging tube and ran accross to the aft-center bilge. Interesting find: there's a hose that feeds the transom shower that runs the length of this starboard bilge, under the PVC rigging tube, and fastened with plastic loops screwed into the ribes every 2 feet. This is just about off the floor at the inside chine corner. From that new inspection plate, I felt some wetness and in just one 4" section a sligh gooyness. However it just smelt like slightly mildewy water. Again noting slight water build did occur in this last 20% of the inside chine. BTW, the boat has a reverse chine, so this does leave a slight pitch down & out to collect. Previously, I had already spray9 cleaned this starboard bilge from the cabin/front with a swobbit 80% of the way back (up to the wire blockage). Given this new aft acces, I spray9 cleaned the back 3 feet, including the wires. Another intersting thing given new access: Some wires were bundled in split/black sheathing. If I opened the split, in just the lower inch or so, slight wetness with slight mildew smell. I let the wire(s) slightly out to wedge the split open for airing. I also wet vac'd every nook and cranny I could get to / snake the hose. With the wife and son we took a test/sniff ride. I had all the cabin acces point open (cooler removed (large opening port side), storage compartments, inspection plates). Only moving passed 10mph could we just begin to get the odor awake. If we slowed down, it would subside. Just above and below this speed could turn the slight smell on and off. This initial odor: >coming from the starboard side. >could smell it at the gunnels forward thru rod holder before any where else. Defintly no port side smells. As we went faster, it then began to come into the cabin, and stronger. However, slightly less strength then it was on my last outing. And even after a faster ride back, and slowing down, it did seem to mellow out sonner. During the inital test, did not smell it from any of the open transom deck plates. In fact at certain speeds my wife commented she could smell the outboard fumes. And so I guess it's safe to say the air during the slower test flowed aft>forward. This would put the source on the starboard side, anywhere from the transom up to those rod holders (about mid ship). Unless it's coming from mid ship and somehow pushing only up starboard side? Hummm, now I'm noting, perhaps I need to do a turn/bank test? Very interesting observation: although when we left the dock all accessable bilge sections were dry, upon return, I discovered perhaps a pint of water in the center bilge, just slightly forward of mid ship. This water had a very diluted smell of my dreaded low_tide/rotten eggs. Perhaps residual run off from that starboard area? Or is the source somehow mid bilge? What next... I made about a gallon of 1:10 solution of KO:water in a pressure tank sprayer and shot all acceessable bilge areas (starboard, center and port). Heaviest on the starbosrd side. Including the inside walls so it would flow under that transon shower hose and wires. Left the cabin windows / hatch vent open, and all thos cabin access points open to allow the KO to activate. I undertsand it might take a couple of days for this "good bacteria" process to work. Should I be taking a ride for the next couple of days to keep moving the solution around? Does KO keep working after it dries? Peggy, you previously asked if I cleaned unaccessable area with "detergent". Would you recommed such a detergent flush after a couple/few days of KO. If yes, please advise on what interval/material/product/solution? Again, thanks in advance for your expert help. Still stinkin and thinkin. Timing. ps Just amazed at how something that smells so nasty upon stiring/moving, has no impact at rest - somewhat of a sleeping giant!
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