LaptopNav. Anybody fool with this yet?

Jackdaw · Jan 23, 2014

It depends on what you mean by NAVIGATION.

When people say that on this board, 99% of the time they really mean Piloting. It's how most sailors use their plotters, usually mounted at the helm. And for that, a PC Nav app is overkill.

For true blue-water navigation, a PC-based system brings much more capability than plotters posses. The apps can take advantage of the extra processing power and storage, and communications networks. Dynamic routing based on the boat polars, factoring in real-time wind, currents, and tides are one of the results.

Most of the cheap apps are just that, a copy of basic plotter capabilities. To see a real app in action, check out Nobletech's Trident.

http://cms.nobeltec.com/cms/Products/NavigationSoftware/TimeZeroTrident.aspx

For just looking at charts, PC apps can be useful to gain situational awareness of a new area.

kloudie1 · Jan 23, 2014

I am in the cheap seats on this one.. I use Seaclear and the free NOAA downloads for planning and stuff. It will work with a USB GPS puck to do tracking and piloting. It can get tedious to keep charts current but works well for coastal stuff .

shemandr · Jan 23, 2014

On my last computer I had Seaclear and another program (That word even sounds dated) but were never able to employ them aboard due to the antenna issue. That is the hockey puck couldn't acquire GPS from the cabin. I already had a chart plotter in the cockpit so didn't need it there.
I tried a droid version of the apt. Active Captain had. I couldn't as a rule connect on 4G and don't have internet capability aboard so it never really worked.
Basically, I would rather sail than dick around with my electronics. It seems to me that in an effort to pursue a digital reality you're in danger of missing reality itself. Want to know where you are? Take a look.

Delezynski · Jan 23, 2014

Chris,

A quick one. When we were cruising the Sea of Cortez we were in a nice anchorage. But, the wind was changing to the apposite direction and we wanted protection. The cruising guide talked about another anchorage on the other side of the bay we were in. Our chart plotter showed it as an easy move about a mile directly across the area. Nothing but nice clear water between the spot I was in and the new place. No problem, right?

Earlier I had downloaded a large amount of data from Google Earth, just to play with. Before the move, I zoomed in on our area. GUESS WHAT! Directly between my spot and the new one was a long dark spot in the water. An underwater rock/reef!!!!!

As it turned out, as we moved and I made our way around the submerged danger, I could make it out and saw it was inches below sea level!!!!

As a matter of fact, I saw a couple of birds standing on it. I had to go about 1/4 mile out of the way to get around it.

We use a low cost laptop (now trying a windows 10 inch tablet) and the free OpenCPN (it's still being worked on and it has a utility to include Google Earth in it as an overlay) and the free CM93 world chart pack.

MY point of view - I have used both Seaclear and OpenCPN (both free) and find OpenCPN WAY better!

Greg

justsomeguy · Jan 23, 2014

Delezynski said:
Chris,

A quick one. When we were cruising the Sea of Cortez we were in a nice anchorage. But, the wind was changing to the apposite direction and we wanted protection. The cruising guide talked about another anchorage on the other side of the bay we were in. Our chart plotter showed it as an easy move about a mile directly across the area. Nothing but nice clear water between the spot I was in and the new place. No problem, right?

Earlier I had downloaded a large amount of data from Google Earth, just to play with. Before the move, I zoomed in on our area. GUESS WHAT! Directly between my spot and the new one was a long dark spot in the water. An underwater rock/reef!!!!!

As it turned out, as we moved and I made our way around the submerged danger, I could make it out and saw it was inches below sea level!!!! As a matter of fact, I saw a couple of birds standing on it. I had to go about 1/4 mile out of the way to get around it.

We use a low cost laptop (now trying a windows 10 inch tablet) and the free OpenCPN (it's still being worked on and it has a utility to include Google Earth in it as an overlay) and the free CM93 world chart pack.

MY point of view - I have used both Seaclear and OpenCPN (both free) and find OpenCPN WAY better!

Greg

What OS is on your laptop?

Delezynski · Jan 23, 2014

justsomeguy said:
What OS is on your laptop?

Windows 8

Greg

justsomeguy · Jan 23, 2014

Delezynski said:
Windows 8

Greg

Excellent. I've heard scuttlebutt about how W8 doesn't work with a GPS dongle, and have been putting off incorporating my cheap laptop into the nav application.

OpenCPN already installed, just wish more charts of Mexican waters were made available through NOAA.

Thanks!

Jackdaw · Jan 23, 2014

Chris Patterson said:
Yeah Jack, I guess I used that term a little more loosely than I intended. More of a toy I guess, for sitting below. The TV is decoration, it makes me violently angry to even attempt to watch it, and this would suit me I think. I'll probably move a Hardin 47' from Miami to Connecticut shortly, and I might carry something of this ilk with me, seeing as how the laptop goes anyway. And no, I would never depend on this garbage to actually get me around a dark harbor whatever, but I liked how it kept the vessel centered, as opposed to just looking at online charts. (I keep paper for these adventures, as it should be)..

Yep... I agree that one of the best uses of PC (and tablet) apps is taking advantage of the big screen to get a great feel of a location before you go. Noting hazards, approaches, and marks before entering unknown water is good seamanship.

One of the advantages of some of new apps is that they take advantage of very recent imagery. The free ipad 'skipper' app over-lays Google imagery on top of NOAA rasters to give a very impressive view. With the clear water of Lake Superior, you can see the bottom. A great help when planning.

Delezynski · Jan 23, 2014

justsomeguy said:
Excellent. I've heard scuttlebutt about how W8 doesn't work with a GPS dongle, and have been putting off incorporating my cheap laptop into the nav application.

OpenCPN already installed, just wish more charts of Mexican waters were made available through NOAA.

Thanks!

Not sure about that scuttlebut. One of the first things I did was to load OpenCPN, and found it would not work off of the internal GPS. Sooo I plugged in my $25.00 GPS puck and it worked first try!

I then found a small bit of code that allows Open to read the internal GPS so it's good to go! AND, as it's still supported, I think the newest version will read the internal Windows GPS without the patch?

And I am far happier with the battery life of my tablet than my old laptops! And the almost instant on makes for longer life as I do not have it running all times, just hit the button and it's less than 30 seconds till I am up and running.

Greg

Maine Sail · Jan 23, 2014

Delezynski said:
And I am far happier with the battery life of my tablet than my old laptops! And the almost instant on makes for longer life as I do not have it running all times, just hit the button and it's less than 30 seconds till I am up and running.

Greg

Amen to that! I have many customers who say: "It's only a laptop, can't draw that much." Some laptops draw as much as refrigeration per day, especially when run through an inefficient inverter rather than 12V....

I have one customer with a Saga 43 that was using 30-35Ah's per day for his refrigeration and averaging 45 - 60 Ah's per day to run his 17" laptop......

He could not figure out why, on long passages, he was using so much power. He thought his refrigeration was faulty and burning more current than normal. Turned out the laptop was a HOG. Even a plugged in iPad draws about 1A when charging but still a lot less than 45 - 60Ah's per day......

WayneH · Jan 23, 2014

Redundancy: Gamin chartplotter that came with the boat. Dell Inspiron 1200 running XP and OpenCPN. Ipad running Navimatics. Android smartphone running Jeppesen Plan2Nav.

I can be lost with GREAT precision.

And I have seen how high the amp meter jumps when I plug in the laptop to its 12v source. It sucks as much juice as the refrigerator does while recharging the battery. It does drop back down once the battery is charged but the solar panels can not quite keep up with the refrigerator running and the laptop charging.

Stu Jackson · Jan 23, 2014

justsomeguy said:
1. I've heard scuttlebutt about how W8 doesn't work with a GPS dongle, and have been putting off incorporating my cheap laptop into the nav application.

2. OpenCPN already installed, just wish more charts of Mexican waters were made available through NOAA.

1. www.cruisersforum.com has some discussions about this. The issue appears to be Microsoft's stupidity (only way to describe it!!!) for "hiding' the COM ports in what used to be called "DEVICE MANAGER." Wander around there on the the OpenCPN and "navigation" sections.

2. C'mon...really.

NOAA is a USA government program. They don't "do" waters outside the USA because those waters are, uhm, outside the USA. That's why they make chart books and other material, like Captain Raines' and others, dare I say, BOOKS.

Not meaning to be so hard, but really... NOAA doesn't "do" Thailand, either....

justsomeguy · Jan 23, 2014

I wonder who makes the US navy's electronic charts?

Quick google: National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency

Maybe they could sell their digital charts...

Heck, we've already paid for 'em.

KristinKaye · Jan 23, 2014

justsomeguy said:
I wonder who makes the US navy's electronic charts?

Quick google: National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency

Maybe they could sell their digital charts...

I heard that there's a guy in Russia named Snowden that might have some of those charts

justsomeguy · Jan 23, 2014

KristinKaye said:
I heard that there's a guy in Russia named Snowden that might have some of those charts

For the people.

shemandr · Jan 24, 2014

Does anyone know if Seaclear can be used on a Mac? I think OpenCPN can but am not sure about Seaclear.

Delezynski · Jan 24, 2014

shemandr said:
Does anyone know if Seaclear can be used on a Mac? I think OpenCPN can but am not sure about Seaclear.

I have a friend who runs Mac,I do not. He used to run Seaclear in a windows emulator program on his Mac. BUT, once he used OpenCPN, he, like me, dumped Seaclear. It USED to be fine as a free nav program for some time. But it has not been updated in YEARS! Both
Seaclear and OpenCPN are FREE. I do not understand why any one would run Seaclear??

I used it for quite some time, but it's so old now!! Once, we were sailing in the south pacific and in ONE day we made tens of thousands of miles!

Turns out Seaclear can NOT plot across the date line.

TOO BAD, my Nor'Sea 27 would sure hold a world record for that.

Greg

25yearslater · Jan 24, 2014

I am using OpenCPN with an Insperon 1520 and get this, Windows Vista. NOAA Raster charts and a GPS puck I got from Amazon for 35.00. Fast, easy, cheap and accurate. My harbor has an extremely narrow channel, about the width of a few runways I've landed on, and the thing can display the boat position in that channel with spooky accuracy. I do turn it off to conserve power except for an occasional position check since it powers up and aquires a fix in less than a minute.