Is my Fischer Panda 4200 trash?

[flightlead404]

I think the cylinder head, specifically the seats, on my Fischer Panda 4200 are trashed. Its low hours (like under 200), and the electrical side of it works great. Last year it started getting harder and harder to start, to the point where I have to readjust the exhaust valve clearance every time I run it. Now when I do run it, it puts out some filthy black water out the exhaust. I mean, I leave a black cloud of water behind me. Its not oil, must be soot.

Parts are NLA. Does anyone know if a diesel shop would be able to machine the head, put in new seats or anything?

Otherwise, is this thing trash now?

I'd like to keep it, but my 400AHr LiFePO4 upgrade, + 30A DC-DC charger + 630W solar reduces our need for it greatly except mid-winter. If its trash, I'll probably add an additional 200AHr battery and maybe upgrade my alternator and repurpose that space for a 12v water maker.

 

[kloudie1]

A good machine shop that might specialize in cylinder head rebuilding maybe for performance modifications can fix the valve seats .. I had a VW that need excess valve adjustment .. it dropped a valve head a little while later and totaled the engine.. if you pull the head yourself and take it to a shop, they most likely could replace the seats and re-grind them.. you probably will need new valves.. 200 hours is extremely low time to have a problem like that!!

 

[flightlead404]

A good machine shop that might specialize in cylinder head rebuilding maybe for performance modifications can fix the valve seats .. I had a VW that need excess valve adjustment .. it dropped a valve head a little while later and totaled the engine.. if you pull the head yourself and take it to a shop, they most likely could replace the seats and re-grind them.. you probably will need new valves.. 200 hours is extremely low time to have a problem like that!!

Thanks. I'm honestly not sure what the issue is. Maybe the seat is sinking into the head possibly from an over heat issue although heat seems fine and no alarms. Maybe the seat is disintegrating, maybe the valve is tuliping.

Just need to figure out how to get the head off.

Yes I agree. Less than 200 hours, but 16 years. Seems to not be an uncommon problem with these Farryman diesel engines.

 

[Ted]

If the issue with your generator engine is a burnt valve or bad valve seat it can be repaired. If the damage to the seat is minimal its an easy fix. If the seat is severely damaged you're need to cut the head to have a valve seat installed. Finding a machine shop that has a small cutter to install a new seat might be difficult depending on where you're located. These valves are small and not many shops have the proper cutter. If you end up going that route, make sure you provide the machinist the specifications for your particular engine. It's important that the proper tolerances are followed. You might want to consider replacing the valves while the engine is apart. They're relatively inexpensive.

 

[flightlead404]

If the issue with your generator engine is a burnt valve or bad valve seat it can be repaired. If the damage to the seat is minimal its an easy fix. If the seat is severely damaged you're need to cut the head to have a valve seat installed. Finding a machine shop that has a small cutter to install a new seat might be difficult depending on where you're located. These valves are small and not many shops have the proper cutter. If you end up going that route, make sure you provide the machinist the specifications for your particular engine. It's important that the proper tolerances are followed. You might want to consider replacing the valves while the engine is apart. They're relatively inexpensive.

do you have a parts source for these engines? or are there generic parts that would work. Farryman says parts are nla

 

[Ted]

I don't have a specific source but the internet and ebay are your friends.

 

[Rick486]

I think the cylinder head, specifically the seats, on my Fischer Panda 4200 are trashed. Its low hours (like under 200), and the electrical side of it works great. Last year it started getting harder and harder to start, to the point where I have to readjust the exhaust valve clearance every time I run it. Now when I do run it, it puts out some filthy black water out the exhaust. I mean, I leave a black cloud of water behind me. Its not oil, must be soot.

Parts are NLA. Does anyone know if a diesel shop would be able to machine the head, put in new seats or anything?

Otherwise, is this thing trash now?

I'd like to keep it, but my 400AHr LiFePO4 upgrade, + 30A DC-DC charger + 630W solar reduces our need for it greatly except mid-winter. If its trash, I'll probably add an additional 200AHr battery and maybe upgrade my alternator and repurpose that space for a 12v water maker.

Have you considered having a professional mechanic examine the engine? As a last resort....

 

[jviss]

I have heard that this happens with FP generators, that the engines don't last and are basically disposable. Too bad you can't retrofit one of those small Kubota diesels as are used for refrigerated trailers.

 

[Ted]

I have heard that this happens with FP generators, that the engines don't last and are basically disposable. Too bad you can't retrofit one of those small Kubota diesels as are used for refrigerated trailers.

The Fischer Panda 4200 has had more than their fair share of problems. Small Mastervolt generators, now marketed under the Whisper Power brand, use Kubota diesel engines and are very reliable units.

 

[dlochner]

Recently researched generators. All the brands are now using Kubota blocks. The most reasonable one was a Phasor. Prices vary considerably across brands.

 

[flightlead404]

meh, I'm not putting another generator in. I don't see a purpose with the advances in lithium. I'm planning on putting in an additional 200 AHr to bring me to 600 AHr or LiFePO4 and I have a DC-DC charger and 630W solar. At worst I'd upgrade the stock Hitachi internally regulated 85A alternator and maybe add a little solar.

 

[kbgunn]

meh, I'm not putting another generator in. I don't see a purpose with the advances in lithium. I'm planning on putting in an additional 200 AHr to bring me to 600 AHr or LiFePO4 and I have a DC-DC charger and 630W solar. At worst I'd upgrade the stock Hitachi internally regulated 85A alternator and maybe add a little solar.

Agree with you. The diesel genset is yet another maintenance workload and source of fuel, lube oil and water leaks into the bilge. The only time it redeems itself is when you need the 16K BTU air conditioner at anchor. There are some low power DC A/C units rated around 4K BTU that can cool the aft cabin or v-berth for those nights when the swelter is unrelenting. You can also look at getting a portable gas powered genset for those nights. The one in the link fits nicely in the locker under the seat in front of the sink on the H38 and can run the battery charger and 16K BTU for the salon/vberth or the 8K BTU for the aft cabin but not both.

KBG

 

[flightlead404]

Well, I don't have oil or diesel leaking into the bilge! That's what I'd consider a major problem. But its big, heavy, expensive, and the only reason for it is, as you say, running the AC. In the keys and Bahamas where we'll be over the winter that's not an issue.

Thought about the portable gas ones, if I'm forced to I will. I'd rather use the space for a water maker though. But, I still need to do the power calculations. A water maker with sufficient L/hr might put be back into needing a generator again lol

wrt to cooling for sleep, there are a number of options for cooled mattress covers. I think one I saw uses Peltier units and another is sort of a mini "swamp cooler" if you know what that is. They seem intriguing.

 

[capta]

I can't believe FP is still in business. I've known literally hundreds of unhappy FP owners. In fact, I cannot remember anyone I've met with a FP that didn't have serious problems. I'm sorry I haven't got any good news to help you out.

 

[dlochner]

I can't believe FP is still in business. I've known literally hundreds of unhappy FP owners. In fact, I cannot remember anyone I've met with a FP that didn't have serious problems. I'm sorry I haven't got any good news to help you out.

FP has followed the crowd and now uses Kubota blocks.

 

[Screen Saver]

I have FP PMS 12. Its done just over 3000 hours. had 1 re-occurring problem with the exhaust water mixer elbow. Took some time and a few elbows to solve and in the end I made a stainless one. That seems to have resolved that. The only other problem was nearly every hose clip has been replaced, and yet on my Yanmar maybe 10% have been replaced. Other than that its 14-year-old so far done pretty well with no other problems that you don't normaly get on any marine type diesel. Its fine having lots of LiPo4, but sooner or later you need to put it back, and even with nearly a KW of solar, if you dont stay at marina's and its your home then yep a genset is pretty handy.