Is my 34 Citation a blue water boat?

Odelia

.
Dec 19, 2015
2
IRWIN 34 Los Angeles
Hi.
I am a new owner of a 1982 Irwin 34 Citation. I am the 4th owner of this delightful cruiser. I have crossed few oceans with another boat I owned in the past. Now my question is, does anyone know if this particular model was designed and built to be a blue water boat as I'd like to take it to Tahiti from California. Thanks in advance for your reply.
 
Mar 20, 2012
3,983
Cal 34-III, MacGregor 25 Salem, Oregon
it was not manufactured as a bluewater boat, and without a general survey, no one could say for sure if it has been rigged for bluewater sailing.....
it was manufactured as a coastal cruiser, which is about as far as 99.7% of boat owners will ever go.
but its also true that almost any production sailboat can cross an ocean if it doesnt run into weather issues....

but if you have experience in crossing oceans in a sailboat, you should already know what you have and what you will need.... there have been people that have successfully crossed the ocean in very small and un-seaworthy boats, and there have been very seaworthy, well rigged boats and experienced sailors lost at sea due to various reasons.... in my opinion, in addition to a well prepared boat, you need a good measure of luck..
 
Feb 6, 1998
11,665
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
Almost any boat can be made offshore capable. It is more often the sailors who are not.

My buddy Bruce sailed around the world twice, solo, on an ultralight race boat. He sailed through the roaring 40's on an ultralight boat with a 10+ foot fin keel with bulb & a spade rudder. He technically sailed for 109 days straight of "blue water sailing". How many cruisers do 109 day blue water passages or intentionally sail trough the roaring 40's carrying as much sail is as humanly possible.

Saltier types will tell you it can't be done, but has been, likely even on some Irwin's. Bruce also kept way more sail up than most would consider prudent for the conditions yet he and his ultra light race boat survived just fine, twice...





Blue water? This boat has more true blue water miles than most blue water built boats ever will, and goes to show that it really boils down to the person sailing the boat.


That all said I have worked on a number of Irwin's and the construction techniques vary tremendously over the years so it is really hard to say were your Citation landed. With some modifications almost anything is possible. Would it be my first choice? No, but this is not to say it can't be done...



Watch at 1:43 + seconds. Again this is why I say the sailor is often more important than the boat...
 
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Jul 27, 2011
4,988
Bavaria 38E Alamitos Bay
Hi.
I am a new owner of a 1982 Irwin 34 Citation. I am the 4th owner of this delightful cruiser. I have crossed few oceans with another boat I owned in the past. Now my question is, does anyone know if this particular model was designed and built to be a blue water boat as I'd like to take it to Tahiti from California. Thanks in advance for your reply.
The best way to answer the question is for you to run down the stats on the Irwin and compare them with accepted "standards" for "blue-water" cruisers. Try starting with the article by Calder below; you can get basic stats at sailboatdata.com. After that or even before, you might wish to read reviews about the intended market at production, quality of workmanship, and how well the boat has held up over the last > 30 yr. Here's the title line from the review at PS link below:
"Irwin Citation 34
A mainstream coastal cruiser from an economy builder still managing to survive"
The final thing might be to run down the equipment you might need; how much of it is aboard and in what conditions. These forums contain all the info you'd ever need; just scan the archives--forums and threads. Good reading!

http://www.yachtingmonthly.com/yacht-reviews/understand-boat-statistics-30154
http://sailboatdata.com/viewrecord.asp?class_id=1582
http://www.practical-sailor.com/reviews/boatreview/Irwin_Citation_34-1194-1.html
 
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weinie

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Sep 6, 2010
1,297
Jeanneau 349 port washington, ny
I have no idea if your boat is a bluewater boat or not. However, I can predict with absolute certainty that this thread will run at least 20 pages.:biggrin:
 
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Jul 27, 2011
4,988
Bavaria 38E Alamitos Bay
I have no idea if your boat is a bluewater boat or not. However, I can predict with absolute certainty that this thread will run at least 20 pages.:biggrin:
I'm astonished the number of folks who buy a sailboat on some kind of impulse, and then wonder if it can be sailed half-way around the world, or farther. "Humm--now I have this boat, I wonder what I can use it for?" If those folks knew much about ocean cruising, then they'd probably know what boat to buy in the first place, IMHO!! So, the answer to the above is likely No x No = No-squared.:deadhorse:
 
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Mar 20, 2012
3,983
Cal 34-III, MacGregor 25 Salem, Oregon
i would suspect that your luck is created and acquired through practice and training and you ability to perform when the going gets rough
"practice and training and your ability to perform when the going gets rough" only enhances the luck that comes your way.... it has been proven numerous times that when your "out there", and without some measure of luck, all the preparedness in the world wont save you.... (yet, with a large amount of luck, even the most untrained, unpracticed, and unseaworthy voyages have made passages without incident)
as Bernard Moitessier has alluded to many times in his books, if you can keep the seas and the gods happy, you will be fine, otherwise you will be in trouble. this is not an exactly worded quote from him, but there are several other ocean cruisers that believe the same way and have written as much.
IMHO, one should read a few books and learn what it takes to please the gods and sea, so that they may allow you a little more luck when the going gets rough....
 
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Sep 23, 2009
1,475
O'Day 34-At Last Rock Hall, Md
I'm astonished the number of folks who buy a sailboat on some kind of impulse, and then wonder if it can be sailed half-way around the world, or farther. "Humm--now I have this boat, I wonder what I can use it for?" If those folks knew much about ocean cruising, then they'd probably know what boat to buy in the first place, IMHO!! So, the answer to the above is likely No x No = No-squared.


:deadhorse:

Mega Dittos! *:deadhorse:
 
Feb 6, 1998
11,665
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
I suspect the real answer to the question is:

"If you have to ask that question, then the answer is a big fat NO."...
 
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Feb 6, 1998
11,665
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
Yeah, I couldn't do that!
This is why the sailor often matters more than the boat. Heck just look at all the abandoned boats that survive storms to wash up on a beach some where after the owners were pulled off by helicopter. Owners often bail on their boats before their boats bail on them.

Bruce did that alone, while under sail in the middle of the ROARING 40's.....
 
Mar 20, 2012
3,983
Cal 34-III, MacGregor 25 Salem, Oregon
A lot of "wanna be" ocean cruisers underestimate the endless hours of constant motion, the thrashing and beating their body will be taking, along with the extremely high risk of injury during a single moment of carelessness..... nowhere to escape, nowhere to run, and no chance of any immediate relief.... all this and still having to work the boat just to attain the best chance for survival.... and did I mention this can go on for many days at a time without let up. and then there are storms that make it worse. it can sometimes be overwhelming to an experienced sailor, so how do you think you would do?...

I have worked on the crab boats here in the PNW and have been out there in it, so I know first hand what a persons body goes thru, and even though its difficult for someone who has never been there to understand how bad it can be out there, to underestimate the power of the sea and its endless motion is to set yourself up for failure before you ever leave the harbor.
 
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Odelia

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Dec 19, 2015
2
IRWIN 34 Los Angeles
Thanks to you all for your interesting comments. In particular thanks to Kings Gambit who comes close to the answer I was hoping for.
Originally I bought this boat as a live aboard not with the intention to cross an ocean with it. I have some knowledge about sailboats but not enough to evaluate the strength of the construction. Indeed, any vessels could do the crossing, I have seen it all during different passages I have done. Am I willing to put myself in a dangerous or uncomfortable situation, absolutely not! I was wondering if the Citation is worth my time and money to refit it to ocean crossing. Just in case I decide to sail to the South Pacific once more. By the way my 24 days passage from Panama to Marquesas was a delight as a result I named it "my Clubmed" passage.
Happy New Year!