Interlux "Perfection" - Has Anyone had success with a mast application (exterior)?

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Mar 6, 2006
49
Catalina 34 Eastern Passage, N.S., Canada
What was to be the last major project before sailing has turned into a nightmare...painting my mast with "Perfection". The "saga" began more than a week ago...
Using what remained of a quart that I had bought last summer and used on the boom as a test case, which came out beautifully. Using the same can, I mixed up a fresh batch from the same cans this year to paint the mast. The first coat of perfection on the mast was applied over the appropriate Prime Coat. At 14:00 Hrs I started painting the first coat of Perfection; Finished rolling / tipping at approx. 15:30 Hrs. Conditions were clear with partial sun, temperature 19 degrees Celsius RH approx. 70 %. The results were impressive, and I took pictures the next morning. As two coats are recommended, two days later, at approximately 14:00 hrs., the weather looked promising, with sun and predominately blue skies through the afternoon, so I began mixing a new batch of “Perfection” from a new can just purchased a few days before. The mix was done in graduated containers to ensure a 2:1 ratio and applied, finishing at around 15:45 hrs. There was no precipitation afterwards or overnight, but on the morning of the 5th of June, I arrived to find the mast dry but with a dull finish, and the remnants of the last batch which I left uncovered in the bucket was still as fluid as when I had finished applying it to the mast the previous afternoon. It dried on the mast, but didn’t even “skim over” in the mixing container after more than 20 hours! I am certain of the ratio of paint to hardner, and concluded that there was something wrong with the paint. The dull coat seems well-adhered and doesn’t seem “chalky” (except in appearance).

The local chandlery replaced the paint with a can from a different batch, and I completed the application of the new can of Perfection at 13:00 hrs, (which went on like the others). I returned to check on it at 18:30 hours, to find it was dry to the touch, and had a brilliant high gloss finish. I thought "problem solved!" The overnight conditions - clear, no precipitation. The next morning I arrived at around 10 a.m. to once again find the finish matted and splotchy. The day of application it was sunny all day with highs around 80 degrees F. Why would the mast finish deteriorate after having a dry to touch level of hardness at 5 to 6 hours after application. I am now completely frustrated with this product. I chose it for it's purported hardness, durability and high gloss. While I appreciate that paints don't like water when they aren't dry, (but most will tolerate a little humidity after curing). I was wondering if a tarp laid on the mast for overnight (after drying to the touch) would help. Anyone have similar experience,... ideas?
Cheers, Barry :cry:
 

RECESS

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Dec 20, 2003
1,505
Pearson 323 . St. Mary's Georgia
Call Yacht Paint the makers of Perfection immediately. Two years ago when I painted my boat they had a recall of several lots of paint. I was not effected. The mark of a good company is what happens when something goes wrong. I have heard of people getting orange peel and they sent someone out immediately to fix it.

There is a member here that painted his mast with it, check the archives, I remember his posts and he created a web page that is linked in his posts.
 

RichH

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Feb 14, 2005
4,773
Tayana 37 cutter; I20/M20 SCOWS Worton Creek, MD
Had similar experience with Perfection when painting a mast. The dullness comes when the dewpoint is increasing (temperature decreasing & humidity rapidly increasing) and the mast is cooling .... causing a satin effect. Same thing can happen to other '2-part' finishes and even varnish.
The remedy is to NOT paint at near the end of the day especially when there is high humidity.
 

RECESS

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Dec 20, 2003
1,505
Pearson 323 . St. Mary's Georgia
I read about staying away from the cooling off hours. I never painted after 3pm and avoided high humidity days.
 
Oct 2, 2006
1,517
Jboat J24 commack


I wanted to freaking kill them when mine was recalled and to make things worse they gave me More BAD and the recall got bigger as thee were different problems with fisheye and unfiltered particles




Freaking cans that you cant open



I found precision mixing was a must and what did you use for thinner as it sounds to slow :confused:



 

Tim R.

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May 27, 2004
3,626
Caliber 40 Long Range Cruiser Portland, Maine
I did mine 3 years ago so I did not run into any "bad" paint. I also did it indoors to avoid the humidity and the problems associated with it.

http://www.treilley.myphotoalbum.com/view_album.php?set_albumName=album36

Here is a guy who did his with Awlgrip and had similar problems to yours.

http://www.triton381.com/projects/maintenance/mastpaint1.htm

You really need to have more control over the environmental conditions to get great results. Even the slightest amount of dew overnight will dull the finish. Move it inside if you can.
 
Mar 6, 2006
49
Catalina 34 Eastern Passage, N.S., Canada
Thanks very much for all of your feedback. I was holding off responding as I had painted (once again) the day before yesterday, and wanted to see if it survived the overnight, .. It did, so the first and fourth coat were both good. I checked to overnight hour by hour conditions on the last night, and they were favorable with respect to RH, dew point, and overnight temperature lows. Conditions on the first night were not nearly as good, and yet I had great results, whereas, on the previous coat (No. 3), conditions were better than for the first coat. It suggests to me that one of the variables was "Batch Quality".

In answer to some of the points raised I will respond (in no particular order) as follows:

Rich, I agree that earlier in the day is better to a point, however, Interlux cautions against too early as well, and given that it is a 1-1/2 to 2 hour job, it backs you up...note that successful coats were both early and later finishes, as were the two unsuccessful attempts.

Both the Interlux Rep from Maine who was in town and met with me to discuss my problem, and the local Chandlery (The Binnacle here in Halifax) participated in the exercise, and have made reasonable efforts to assist, both in refunding the cost of the two unsuccessful attempts, and with offers of bottom paint for next season.

Tommays asked about what thinner I used. The temp was such that I didn't use any as the flow seemed about right.

I didn't really have an option to move it indoors; it is 52 feet long and the logistics of taking it anywhere would have been a "bear".

Thanks again,

Barry
 
Oct 2, 2006
1,517
Jboat J24 commack


That is what pickup trucks are for :)



I found it be fickle stuff compared to other paints i have sprayed even being off i tiny bit on wet sanding screwed it up



And i have built and sprayed a lot OF STUFF
 
Jun 5, 2010
1,123
Hunter 25 Burlington NJ
I prefer Awlgrip for a spar-- it's nice to work with and lends a really good finish. At CY they spray everything in the morning, outdoors, or in the evening, indoors, depending on the available facilities at the time. One spar sat outside all day. 'That's wet!' they said; but it was dry to the touch in 20 minutes or so and looked great.

They are going to do mine in another week or two.

I need to do my hull and deck with Brightside (as I am just not going to spring for double the cost and Perfection) and will appreciate tips for using that.
 

RichH

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Feb 14, 2005
4,773
Tayana 37 cutter; I20/M20 SCOWS Worton Creek, MD
I need to do my hull and deck with Brightside (as I am just not going to spring for double the cost and Perfection) and will appreciate tips for using that.
Brightsides may have been 'improved' over the years, but the last time I sprayed Brightsides on deck and topsides ..... all the 'horizontal surfaces' dulled and chalked after 3 years of sun exposure. Perfection (and old "Interthane") seem to be quite impervious to and much longer lasting versus UV. Perfection is easy to spray; but unfortunately, you need a full 'bunny suit' complete with self contained breathing apparatus .... not a good idea to use in 'summer heat'.
.... and there are 'better' coatings available from Interlux that are only available to the 'pros' - obscenely expensive.

Id suggest that the few ¢ saved with Brightsides, doesnt compare with the longevity of Perfection, especially if those who are painting your boat can spray Perfection or other 2-part urethane or acrylic-urethane.

Cherubini???? ... that name has always been associated with 'perfection' boats.
 

RECESS

.
Dec 20, 2003
1,505
Pearson 323 . St. Mary's Georgia
We came into a friend's dock yesterday and the wind pushed the boat at an odd angle. We caught the corner of his wood dock in between the fenders. My wife was a little pissed that it left a nice row of 6 inches high by 2 feet of scratches on the side of the boat. After we tied off, she gave the area a good rub. No scratching at all, it all wiped away. I was a little perplexed at how it did not leave any scratches but happy all the same. It has been two seasons since I painted with Perfection, but it has been worth the extra money for me. The paint is tough and does no fade.
 
Jan 3, 2009
821
Marine Trader 34 Where Ever I am
Your problem was not bad paint but painting too late. I have been doing this for decades and if you are painting outdoors and don't get it done early and if the humidity levels, dew points, etc. are too high it will flatten. 2 in the afternoon is too late unless you get lucky. I always try and get the paint on with 12 hours before sunset if at all possible. Chuck
 
Jan 3, 2009
821
Marine Trader 34 Where Ever I am
Thanks very much for all of your feedback. I was holding off responding as I had painted (once again) the day before yesterday, and wanted to see if it survived the overnight, .. It did, so the first and fourth coat were both good. I checked to overnight hour by hour conditions on the last night, and they were favorable with respect to RH, dew point, and overnight temperature lows. Conditions on the first night were not nearly as good, and yet I had great results, whereas, on the previous coat (No. 3), conditions were better than for the first coat. It suggests to me that one of the variables was "Batch Quality".

In answer to some of the points raised I will respond (in no particular order) as follows:

Rich, I agree that earlier in the day is better to a point, however, Interlux cautions against too early as well, and given that it is a 1-1/2 to 2 hour job, it backs you up...note that successful coats were both early and later finishes, as were the two unsuccessful attempts.

Both the Interlux Rep from Maine who was in town and met with me to discuss my problem, and the local Chandlery (The Binnacle here in Halifax) participated in the exercise, and have made reasonable efforts to assist, both in refunding the cost of the two unsuccessful attempts, and with offers of bottom paint for next season.

Tommays asked about what thinner I used. The temp was such that I didn't use any as the flow seemed about right.

I didn't really have an option to move it indoors; it is 52 feet long and the logistics of taking it anywhere would have been a "bear".

Thanks again,

Barry
Barry, I have to wonder where you got the measurements for the relative humidity, dew points, etc. Did you have a calibrated weather station set up on site near the mast? Anything other than this will not tell you what the conditions are where you are painting. The reports from your local airport or TV station will not reflect what is on the ground at your yard or marina. Chuck
 
Feb 6, 1998
11,701
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
They are going to do mine in another week or two.

I need to do my hull and deck with Brightside (as I am just not going to spring for double the cost and Perfection) and will appreciate tips for using that.
I am with Rich H. on this one. The real cost is the prep in any of these jobs. The price difference vs. longevity vs. labor involved always leads me to a two part paint. I have used single part "marine" paints and while decent, the longevity and durability is just not there with a single part on gelcoat. Mooring balls, fenders etc. will void the surface of a single part paint far easier. Interlux Perfection or System Three WR LPU are two DIY paints that should hold up quite well. I have seen Brightsides not even last three seasons in Maine without significant flattening and dulling of the finish and I have seen two part paints still very shiny at 18+ years.


Jamestown Dist.

Two Part:

Epiphanes Two Part Polyurethane = $56.99
Interlux Perfection (two part) = $54.99 Qt
System Three WR LPU (water based) = 56.45

Single Part:

Toplac = 43.42 Qt
Brightsides = $27.99 Qt
Easy Poxy = $29.99 Qt
Epiphanes Mopnourethane = $35.99

For the price vs. durability issues I'll take the $27.00 difference between Perfection & Brightsides every time, perhaps $100.00 more on the entire job. You'll likely spend more than that in sand paper alone. Single parts are good paints but two part paints are significantly more durable. Perhaps once you get done with the prep you'll re-evaluate the cost difference of the paint? Single part paints, in my experience, are a false economy. Plus I am sure you are buying at wholesale so the perfection should be slightly less.

Why not just re-condition your existing gelcoat? I would personally choose gelcoat over a two part paint, if I had the choice..
 
Mar 6, 2006
49
Catalina 34 Eastern Passage, N.S., Canada
Response to Chuckbear re weather conditions: Environment Canada has a weather link that records historical data that you can access for a wide number of geographic areas; and these give hourly readings of dew point, temperature, RH, etc. The site I used is for Bedford Basin (actually at the Bedford Institute of Oceanography, located within 1/2 mile of our yacht club where our mast was located), so I didn't have to set up a weather station for the info I quoted.

Cheers,

Barry
 
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