Interior partitions 1981 Hunter 27'

[Campbell Sloop]

I am removing the two interior partitions that run port to starboard and laterally section off the v-berth from the potty/lavatory and the potty/lavatory from the bench sitting area. They are both dry rotted across the bottom 4 to 5".

Since they both have leather piping trim at the top and are not secured to the cabin roof, I am wondering if they serve any structural purpose or whether I can just leave them out? I plan to replace original potty with portable one as well.

Alternatively, could a header arrangement replace the plywood wall partitions?

Thanks for any suggestions

 

[Benny17441]

You are going to find the mast compression post in the starboard partition. If badly bent or rotten that would need to be replaced. The partitions add stiffness and support to the cabin top and hull so would recommend replacing too.

 

[Ed Schenck]

If compression post is good or repaired maybe just another post on port. Guess you are going for the open look.

 

[pvtpotter]

I was looking at mine this weekend because it is off the track something terrible. Upon looking more closely, I see (facing aft) the port side is screwed into the main bulkhead, but the starboard side is not. I'm figuring they forgot to screw it at the factory. I can press the frame it is attached to at the top a good 1/2 inch toward the bulkhead. The wood is old, but not rotted. I'm thinking I'll put a long screw in there to see if the sliding door behaves.
I too have though of simply removing the sliding doors and replacing it with canvas using snaps.

 

[txmilke]

I too have though of simply removing the sliding doors and replacing it with canvas using snaps.[/quote]

I was told by a surveyor that the bulkhead on my 1980 H27was in fact a structural part of the boat and that mine needed to be replaced in order to be insurable. I don't think it looks that bad, but there you go.
fwiw,
Tom

 

[Campbell Sloop]

Thanks for feedback and interested in more, please.

A couple of quick comments.

1) The doors could not be a part of the structural nature of the boat because they are loosely fitted to slide open on tracks, and certainly would not impede water entry.

2) There is a header at the top (against the cabin roof) which may indicate some structural reinforcement to the cabin roof, however it would seem to me that if they were "really" structural, the headers would be screwed or fiberglassed into the ceiling, which they are not.

Also, there is a decorative piping where the header meets the cabin roof which allows for a 1/8" to 1/4" gap between the header top and the cabin roof. That doesn't seem structural.

3) The only place where I find a tight fit is to the hull on both left and right sides.

It might be reasonable to maintain a 2' wide plywood "stiffener" abutting the hull on each side and to fashion vertical posts (in which to terminate the plywood) which would allow the header to play a structural role. Beyond that it seems an open middle may not pose any structural problems?

 

[pvtpotter]

That door plays no structural role in the main bulkhead. It is simply hung and is not fixed to the hull or a bulkhead and therefore has no structural bearing.

 

[kito]

I guess H27's are a bit different than my H30. My top shroud chainplates are bolted to the main bulkhead. I was considering cutting a portion out of my port bulkhead between the chainplate and compression post. But found it best for everyone that my head was enclosed

 

[DianaOfBurlington]

Campbell Sloop

The bulkheads are there to stiffen the hull. Everything that touches the hull, and is not movable, should be 'glassed to the hull. When my H25 got moved recently, the yard guys put one of the hydraulic-lift pads on the side of the hull, at the V-berth. I rolled my eyes and waited to find the shelf and all my nifty new cabinetry had shattered and popped off. None of it had. It was all 'glassed to the hull, adding a degree of stiffness that kept the boat structurally sound (even the shelf along the V-berth; that's why it's there. Sure not for convenience!). This is vital to stressed-skin structures like our fiberglass boats; and I don't recommend circumventing it in any way.

When the Hunter 25 was new my dad conceived of a 'racing model' (he was always coming up with 'racing models') in which the whole inside was wide-open: compression post in the middle and just a bunklike shelf all the way around the hull at about the waterline, which we would then cover in carpet (it was 1974. I recommended playing Jeff Beck tapes when we exhibited it at the boat show). The problem with this idea, which is very cool to look at, is that structurally it's a nightmare. Some old-time Hunter aficionados here may recall the original H54 racing cutter of Warren Luhrs appearing at Annapolis in 1977. The boat had an internal 'roll cage' connecting all the stress points. 'What is the pipe for?' people asked.
My dad said, 'To hold the boat together.'
'Then what is the hull for?'
'To keep the water out.'

If you're doing without the structural integrity of bulkheads-- any bulkheads-- you will have to determine where else the stress loads can be transferred. On the Cherubini 44 we did without the annoying little cribbing bulkheads to support chainplates and created a massively-strong fiberglass web system transferring much of that load from the flange to the hull. This allowed us to use plain SS U-bolts for shroud attachments, a design I still recommend (being as I sort of thought of it).

The main bulkhead in your H27 is there to support the compression post and to tie together the sides of the hull-- both in compression (hull crushing inwards) and in tensile (hull spreading outwards). Any other bulkhead in the boat is more expendable than this one. Even though you have a large doorway cut in it, believe me that the little bit of bulkhead to port is still doing lots. The ones at the forward end of the head compartment do just as much. Yes; they do not seem to be fastened to the deck, having just teak facia boards up there. But they do maintain the vital shape of the boat, once hull and deck are fastened at the flange. Like a cylinder, if you hold any part of it from moving, the rest cannot move either.

You might look into some of the newer 'daysailers' out there, such as the Hinckley or the Morris, to see the arched openings they use at this crucial area. These elegant curves and ovals are meant to carry loads, not for aesthetics (curves being stronger than corners). Consider doing something like this, with good plywood, adequately 'glassed to the hull and deck, stiffened with some good-looking molding of teak or other wood along the edges, before you just eliminate what was meant to be there, for very good reasons, in the first place.

BTW it's not difficult to mend the rot, even with the bulkheads in place. I have done this many times, including in my own boat. Where there's plywood in the bilge, on Diana it's pretty much solid epoxy and 'glass now.

 

[pvtpotter]

To clarify. You can't remove a bulkhead and not replace it (tabbed by glass to the hull).
My answers were specifically about the sliding door. Under no circumstances should the bulkhead (referred to as "partition?" in the original post) be removed and not replaced. It is one of the major components of strength in the vessel.