Installing a macerator

[Phiggins]

Malcolm...

My home port is on Lake Ontario and I'm well aware of the law regarding macerators. I don't currently have one installed but as I will be taking the boat to the Caribbean in the fall I have been thinking about installing one. When I saw the article in DIY and read about the problems the author (who evidently does a lot of offshore cruisng) had with plugged macerators, I thought he had a good idea. So I decided to share it with the other forum members. I still think his idea is better than the Y valve method and will more than likely install one his way in the spring. The author in DIY also pointed out that having a macerator installed can get you a fine, even if its locked off, in certain places like Lake Champlain. So when he goes there he actually removes the macerator. I believe having one installed in Lake Ontario under Canadian law is also illegal but the authorites don't seem to be enforcing it. But just in case I will have the macerator removed until I get to the Caribbean.

 

[Malcolm Young]

Off topic - Regulations for Ontario/NY

PHiggins - Your reply makes me happy. I did a little googling and came up with what appears to be the current Regulations for Ontario waters. See http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/DBLaws/Regs/English/900343_e.htmFrom this and what I was told by the dealer there must be no piped in way for an overboard discharge - a locked valve does not qualify (after all you could unlock it easily). You must physically disconnect and plug any overboard line. This cannot easily be reversed and thus can be enforced ie. you are not going to be able to quickly disconnect and plug if an enforcement officer comes aboard. Thus having a macerator that is physically disconnected from your holding tank or toilet appears to meet Ontario Laws. In my system the line that goes to the holding tank to the macerator is physically cut and both ends plugged.I did find some stuff regarding Lake Champlain that seems to say the same thing. See http://www.nyss.com/NYS.html#p33D - although interpretation might be that the hose from the holding tank to the macerator might also be removed although I don't think this is much different than cutting and plugging. Thus it appears that you can certainly install a macerator but not tie it into your holding tank until you are in waters that allow it.I note that in some other waterways of New York that locking a Y Valve or closing a discharge valve and removing the handle looks to be OK (section 33e). Perhaps this is not up to date - and I could not tell if it applied to the Great Lakes - it appears to be all waters that are not specifically mentioned.By the way, I do know that Peggy is very experienced and expert - she (and her book) helped me a lot when I was putting in a second holding tank.

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

Clarification of the laws

Federal regulations haven't changed...33 CFR 159.7 is still the applicable law pertaining to "securing" a system from overboard discharge. However, several states have gone a bit further in some waters (Champlain is one example), enacting laws that require all overboard plumbing to be completely disconnected. Some states have even gone so far as to require complete removal of any y-valves and/or overboard discharge pumps on their non-navigable instra-state lakes on which there cannot be any transient traffic as there is on the Great Lakes and Champlain. GA is one...in GA coastal waters it's only necessary to secure the system as prescribed by federal law...but on the inland lakes, any plumbing or equipment that could allow a tank to be emptied by any means other than pumpout must be removed.For the bay and river sailors here: the "3 mile limit" does NOT mean 3 miles from the nearest shore...it means out to sea in open ocean at 3 miles from the nearest point on the whole US coastline, including any islands (for instance, Catalina, which is 26 miles offshore...you can't dump a tank within 3 miles of it either...but you can in the 20 miles between the "3 mile limits" from the mainland and the island). Which means there's nowhere in Galveston Bay...the Chesapeake Bay...or any other body of water in the US in which it's legal to dump a tank.It's also important to understand the definition of "no discharge." "Can't flush a toilet directly overboard or dump a tank" is NOT the same thing as "no discharge." Except in waters specifically designated "no discharge"--which are only about 10% of US coastal waters--the discharge of treated waste from a CG certified Type I or II MSD (treatment device) is legal. However, "treatment" does not include any holding tank chemicals...there is nothing that can be added to a tank to make it legal to dump it in any US waters.

 

[Dana M26D]

Thunderbox

Here on Canada's East Coast we can dump each use directly overboard. But if we save two uses or more to a tank we must hold for pumpout or dump at sea.The link is to a pic of a fancy thunderbox. In Southwest Asia I saw many Dhows with anything from this to just a couple boards sticking out the stern. Some had very ornate lattice enclosed thunderboxes.I wonder what the CG would say if I hung a colourful thunderbox off the stern of my MacGregor?...

 

[jfgy]

Boat with marine head without holding tank

Dear Peggy et al.,I recently looked at a used boat that had a marine head installed with direct thru-hull connection but without a Y-valve or holding tank. I assume that this is not a legal configuration. My question is, what would have to be done to bring the boat up to specs, and about how much would it cost.Thanks in advance for your help.Jess

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

You'd have to add a holding tank

And, unless there's already one installed, a deck pumpout fitting and a vent thru-hull...plus the hose to connect the toilet to the tank. Whether to also add a y-valve and macerator to allow you to dump the tank at sea depends on where you'll be using the boat. Depending upon the make/model/age of the toilet and when (if ever) it was last serviced, you may want to replace it too. Cost including labor should be about $500, plus the price of a new toilet. If you're seriously interested in the boat, I'd include a clause in your offer that the seller must have a tank installed at his expense as a condition of sale.

 

[jfgy]

Thanks!

Thanks for the quick and helpful response!