Info on a 1975 O'day 22

[mstrud]

Well i was thinking of buying a bottom of the barrel catalina 22, but the thought of refinishing the keel kind of turned me off to it, and it needed some glass work as well. I'm glad i wasnt rash about it as i found an O'day 22 for the same asking price as the catalina.
I like the thought of the Oday as it had a fixed shoal keel and will trailer easy. I'm really unable to find much info about O'days though, catalina has a plethera of info out there on them but i cant seem to find much more than for sale ads in regards the the oday 22.
Id imagine only drafting 23 inches that any beam wind over 10 knots you'd have to reef. I read that O'days quality (in the only book i found so far that bothers to mention them) is likened to that of a ford or chevy adaquate, and not much more.
Does anyone have any opinions from experience? I've never sailed a day in my life and Im just looking for a casual trailerable vacation cruiser for my girlfriend the dog and I, so top performance isn't of concern to me. But before i go and look at this boat (tomorrow) Itd be nice to hear for things to watch out for. Of course im going to tap the entire deck and listen for thuds, and look for water marks, check for a fair hull, straight rubrails, bonded bulkheads, good sails, rigging reinforcments, etc... but are there any horror stories common among Oday sailers? Id sure like to be able prioritze my examination.
Also this may be a stupid question, but were the keels glassed in/on, or bolted on? Id have thought only steel keels would be bolted on, but i'm new to all of this. From the photos i've seen it doesnt appear there's much access to the bildge from the cabin floor, so if it's glassed in or poured in ill be content, but if its bolted on with no access to the bolts... hmmm... Either way there should be sufficient access to the bildge, but ill be very uneasy if a refinished floor is hidding corroded keel bolts.
Thanks in advance for your time, i look foreward to hearing your opinions.
-mike

 

[HukilauMike]

I agree with the statement that Oday's were "Chevy" quality; good but not great. Remember, the boat you will be looking at is over 30 years old; it was not made to last that long in the first place, so if it hasn't had regular maintenance, it will show. The deck fittings will likely need to be rebedded, the winches will need to be greased, the gelcoat may be chalky, the windows will probably leak, etc. None of this will make much difference for the casual sailor. As long as the deck is in good shape, the hull doesn't leak and the standing rigging is sound, you will be safe.

Some things to look for in that model: the mast is deck-stepped, so make sure the cabin roof is sound. Check the bulkheads for rot where the chainplates attach inside the cabin. The chainplates are a common spot where the deck leaks. If there was leaking, the bulkheads could be rotten. Replacing bulkheads is doable, but only if you are willing to do it yourself; it certainly won't pay to have someone else do it for you. The condition of the outboard is also key; if its old, figure in the cost of replacement. This is actually more complicated than it sounds because you will have to get a four stroke outboard (they don't make small two strokes anymore), which will mean a new bracket, and new mounting wedge (that angled hunk of fiberglass between the transom and the bracket) as well. You can buy a new bracket rated for a four stroke, but the existing mounting wedge will not accomodate the wider four stroke bracket. You will have to fabricate a new one. Lots of ideas on how to do so in the archives of this site. Also, check the pintles and gudgeons. Oday used undersized hardware originally, so check for stress cracks. In addition, the rudder on the 22 is deeper than the keel. If the boat grounded, there may be damage to the rudder, pintles/gudgeons, and the transom. Check carefully.

The keels on the Oday trailer sailers are molded as part of the hull; ballast is completely encapsulated within the fiberglass keel. No need to worry about keel bolts. The flip side is that if the fiberglass on the outside of the keel is compromised, the internal ballast will rust if you get one of the models with iron ballast. I know that Oday switched from lead to iron and back several times over the years, but I don't know the details by year.

 

[mstrud]

thanks mike

Im schedualed to go look at the boat around 6pm tonight, your reply was very helpfull. The boat appears to be in great shape from the pictures i've seen, it was "restored" two years ago, with new top/bottom paint, and halyards it's pretty slick looking that's what attracted me to it in the first place. It does not come with "running" outboard, according to the guy it needs a lower unit rebuild... for a 91 evinrude, i think i'd just be better off buying a used motor for it. Which brings me to one of my questions, if i was only planning on equiping it with a 4-6 hp would a fourstroke really make that much difference? Suzikis and nissans only weight in at around 60 lbs, would this overload that motor bracket? Of course i could always go with a two stroke (what do those weigh anyway???), but i'd really prefer a 4 for efficientcy's sake. In the event that 60lbs is too heavy would a 2.5hp fourstroke be enough to push it in any kind of current? Most of my planned trips would be on Florida's intracoastal and i'd hate to get swept out with the tide or have to anchor for 3 hours at a time if the wind is unfavorable.

On the subject of not having a running motor and i dont happen to have one that small lying around so i wouldn't be able to 'try before i buy', this makes me a little apprehensive as the last time i bought a boat (be it a power boat) i bought it without a sea trial, and sure enough after I paid out, i found i didnt buy the boat i thought i did, live and learn... but how crucial would that sea trial be for a sailboat? How well it rides probably will have little effect on my decision to buy it unless it heels 35 degrees in a 3kt breeze, but if the rigging works, and there arent any holes in the boat, would a trial benefit my interests all that much.

Yeah it probably would... i think ill just put a conditional deposit on it, find a bigass trolling motor, and get my lifelong sailor friend to take it out with me, god its so hard to be rational with all this anxiousness!!!!! i need a valium.

Keep checking the thread if you could, I'm sure ill be on here later tonight after i've seen the boat with a million and one questions. Thanks guys
-mike

 

[HukilauMike]

Re: thanks mike

Great questions Mike. It's not just the weight of the outboard that is an issue. Four strokes generate more torque than two's; the brackets in question are designed to handle the higher loads from the propeller, not just the increased weight of a four stroke. If the bracket on the boat is new, it might be rated for four strokes; you can call the manufacturer or check his website. If its more than a few years old, its probably not made for four strokes.

As for the size of the outboard you need, a four or six horse two stroke will push you at hull speed. The six will have juice to spare. A four stroke of that size will have even more power. I have a two stroke 8hp on my Oday 23, and it is more than enough power. I bought my engine about four years ago, and it turns out that it was one of if not the last year that they made small two stroke engines. The biggest reason I went with the two stroke was the hassle involved in making a bigger mounting block; I just didn't want to deal with it. Whatever you buy, make sure its a "long shaft" model. If possible, buy one with an "extra-long" shaft. In any sort of weather, your prop will occasionally come out of the water as the boat pitches, and the longer the shaft, the less this will happen.

Do you need a test sail? If you don't have a lot of sailing experience, then a test sail loses some of its value. You won't have any frame of reference to evaluate the sailing performance of the boat. However, a test sail will show you if the mast bends too much, if the rudder has too much play, if the fittings leak, if the hull "oil cans" in rough water. If you don't do a test sail prior to purchase (I didn't on my boat), make sure you cover yourself on these safety issues with a real boat survey. Hire a surveyor to look the boat over for you. He works for you, and will find things that you may be able to use to negotiate a lower price. At the very least, you will learn many things about the boat that will help you plan upgrades and maintenance work. It would probably cost you a few hundred dollars for an Oday 22. A worthy investment.

 

[TimCup]

Mike, I have an Oday 22-

they are good, cheap boats. Check the bilge for no water. If there is water, you can't know if it's fresh (rain) or salt (leak), so stay away. It sounds like you know how to check for waterlogged core, so you're ahead of the game there.

As for how they sail? Assuming the rigging is tuned correctly (the cables holding the mast in correct position), they sail very well, will sail as close to the wind as most others, and there'e a level of civility in the Oday22- the head is actually behind a door!

Odays were one of the more popular production boats for many years. This website has a separate site for Oday owners- it's one of the larger owner groups (behind Hunter and Catalina for sure). Small keels make for easy towing, too. Even with the small keel, I think you'll be happy with it's sailing ability.


cup

 

[Landlocked Sailor]

Refit of a 22 foot Day

If it is any comfort I am in refit mode of an O'Day 22

http://landlockedvasailor.blogspot.com/

Of the ones done in the past, thusfar it has been straightforward. One thing about older boats, as long as you take your time, know what you are getting into, and able to spend some time and money, it not really a big deal. I have to disagree with the fiberglass comment. You will not find alot on blisters below the line, if you do, grind them out, back to to where is gets soild, dry out for six weeks, use some good glass (believe me there is a different, wet layers in with West and sand it out. If he core is bad, there is no need to rip it all our. It is going to be mush made of fibers. Last year helped a friend redo an Irvin. The core was rotten, but the glass decks were in good shape, soft though. We injected 6 gallons of epoxy resin/epoxy hardener by drilling 1/8 holes in the deck, five inches apart. Afterwards, we sanded the deck down .01 mm and laid on barrier coat, sanded again, and sprayed painted three coats. The deck is bullet proof. I weight 250 and there is not movement underfoot. I have screwed up many times, but there is always a fix, just need to be positive and move forward. If you need to redo the wood inside, which I would recommend, use marime plywood or hydrocore. When you want to find the leaks on deck. Get three good size fans, seal every single opening. Turn the fans on, by the way DO NOT say below, take either a good glass foam or joy dishwashing in a spraybottle, taking your time (on my OI 416 took 8 days) and you will find every opening. The keel from 1974 on are iron, but don't trust. No need to panic. The Irvin was sunk on land, we cut a center line in the sole, cleaned out the bilge, West and glassed. It was water tight. On the hull, grinded back to soild glass, again laid in West with layers, sanded, barrier coated. It is better than when it was laid up. Finally, forget the motor, buy a new one in the winter on a Saturday night at the end of a month. You can figure the vendor has 12% to 15% margin to work with. If you catch him on inventory for taxes, he would rather sale for loss than have to pay taxes and interest if he is floorplanning his inventory with a bank. Out of time, but...

Good luck. Any questions that I can help with, just find me on sailnet under Landlockvasailor or twmorr@gmail.com.

 

[tasdevil]

I bought a '75 O'Day 22 early this year for me and my dog - and it's terrific !
I spent three months going over it and rigging it for solo sailing from the cockpit and didn't find much wrong .There was some core rot in deck from leaky fittings;opened it up , refilled with epoxy wood stabiliser , refitted.

The running rigging was original and bloody dangerous ! The eye splices were done the shortcut method and broke when lowering the mast. So all new lines and splice it myself ( good books available and it's fun to do ).

The other thing is that you say you haven't sailed before ? Well I was fifty years out of date so I took a weeks sailing course and it's really worth while.Afterwards you feel confident that you have the basics and then it's fun practicing what you have learnt so you can gradually extend the range and demands of what you go out in.......for a knockabout, fun boat . ODay 22 s are great .

 

[Barnacle Bill]

At one time, in their hey day, the O'Day sailboats were possibly the most popular sailboats of their time. Someone mentioned that they were Chevy quality boats, well, I think they are consistent with Catalina quality too, but you don't need a boat built for the North Sea to enjoy on an inland lake or coastal waters. O'Day, created by Olympic Gold Medal winner George O'Day (among other things), built boats from very small day sailors to large cruisers, so they had models that an owner could grow up with - a good marketing tool. One of the most popular O'Days that were built by many other builders, was the DS (day sailor) 16 - a Uffa Fox design (the original had no cuddy and was capable of planing, but George wanted a cuddy and so that added weight and a little less performance, but a place to put stuff out of the weather. The boat was beamy, stiff and fun to sail on. Many of the cabin boats had a similar look to them (as do most manufactures) and so an O'Day 22 looked like an O'Day 23. The 22 had a shoal keel while some of the 23's had a shoal keel with centerboard which has a lot of advantages in a trailerable boat (stability whether the keel is up or down - some are only self righting when the keel is down - the centerboard is lighter and so easier to raise and lower without a winch - unlike a swing keel boat - no centerboard trunk taking up space in the interior, maintenance is easier, etc.). BTW, the only trailerable boat made today that has that shoal keel/centerboard configuration is Precision. Too bad, it is, in my opinion, the best keel configuration for trailerable boats. Anyway, each boat is different in how she was taken care of and so each boat must be carefully looked over for any ailments that will be problematic or expensive down the line (or unsafe). O'Day boats went through several manufactures such as Bangor Punta and Lier Zieglar (sp?) during the various generations of boats. But good ol' George got her off the ground. They were built in Fall Rivers MA and also were built on the West coast. The popularity of the boats justified the two manufacture facilities and that also aided in shipping the vessels across the country. C. Raymond Hunt & Associates were designers of many of their designs (another luminary in the sailing biz).

 

[sailingdog]

Not a big fan of epoxy injection as a solution for a wet core. It tends to add a lot of weight, and doesn't really fix the problem in most cases. It also makes doing a proper repair much more difficult.

If it is any comfort I am in refit mode of an O'Day 22

http://landlockedvasailor.blogspot.com/

Of the ones done in the past, thusfar it has been straightforward. One thing about older boats, as long as you take your time, know what you are getting into, and able to spend some time and money, it not really a big deal. I have to disagree with the fiberglass comment. You will not find alot on blisters below the line, if you do, grind them out, back to to where is gets soild, dry out for six weeks, use some good glass (believe me there is a different, wet layers in with West and sand it out. If he core is bad, there is no need to rip it all our. It is going to be mush made of fibers. Last year helped a friend redo an Irvin. The core was rotten, but the glass decks were in good shape, soft though. We injected 6 gallons of epoxy resin/epoxy hardener by drilling 1/8 holes in the deck, five inches apart. Afterwards, we sanded the deck down .01 mm and laid on barrier coat, sanded again, and sprayed painted three coats. The deck is bullet proof. I weight 250 and there is not movement underfoot. I have screwed up many times, but there is always a fix, just need to be positive and move forward. If you need to redo the wood inside, which I would recommend, use marime plywood or hydrocore. When you want to find the leaks on deck. Get three good size fans, seal every single opening. Turn the fans on, by the way DO NOT say below, take either a good glass foam or joy dishwashing in a spraybottle, taking your time (on my OI 416 took 8 days) and you will find every opening. The keel from 1974 on are iron, but don't trust. No need to panic. The Irvin was sunk on land, we cut a center line in the sole, cleaned out the bilge, West and glassed. It was water tight. On the hull, grinded back to soild glass, again laid in West with layers, sanded, barrier coated. It is better than when it was laid up. Finally, forget the motor, buy a new one in the winter on a Saturday night at the end of a month. You can figure the vendor has 12% to 15% margin to work with. If you catch him on inventory for taxes, he would rather sale for loss than have to pay taxes and interest if he is floorplanning his inventory with a bank. Out of time, but...

Good luck. Any questions that I can help with, just find me on sailnet under Landlockvasailor or twmorr@gmail.com.

 

[Florida sail]

There is another shoal keel with centerboard

At one time, in their hey day, the O'Day sailboats were possibly the most popular sailboats of their time. Someone mentioned that they were Chevy quality boats, well, I think they are consistent with Catalina quality too, but you don't need a boat built for the North Sea to enjoy on an inland lake or coastal waters. O'Day, created by Olympic Gold Medal winner George O'Day (among other things), built boats from very small day sailors to large cruisers, so they had models that an owner could grow up with - a good marketing tool. One of the most popular O'Days that were built by many other builders, was the DS (day sailor) 16 - a Uffa Fox design (the original had no cuddy and was capable of planing, but George wanted a cuddy and so that added weight and a little less performance, but a place to put stuff out of the weather. The boat was beamy, stiff and fun to sail on. Many of the cabin boats had a similar look to them (as do most manufactures) and so an O'Day 22 looked like an O'Day 23. The 22 had a shoal keel while some of the 23's had a shoal keel with centerboard which has a lot of advantages in a trailerable boat (stability whether the keel is up or down - some are only self righting when the keel is down - the centerboard is lighter and so easier to raise and lower without a winch - unlike a swing keel boat - no centerboard trunk taking up space in the interior, maintenance is easier, etc.). BTW, the only trailerable boat made today that has that shoal keel/centerboard configuration is Precision. Too bad, it is, in my opinion, the best keel configuration for trailerable boats. Anyway, each boat is different in how she was taken care of and so each boat must be carefully looked over for any ailments that will be problematic or expensive down the line (or unsafe). O'Day boats went through several manufactures such as Bangor Punta and Lier Zieglar (sp?) during the various generations of boats. But good ol' George got her off the ground. They were built in Fall Rivers MA and also were built on the West coast. The popularity of the boats justified the two manufacture facilities and that also aided in shipping the vessels across the country. C. Raymond Hunt & Associates were designers of many of their designs (another luminary in the sailing biz).

Bill,

Sorry to disagree with you but the Rhodes-22 fills the bill as a boat that has a CB and shoal keel See www.rhodes22.com .

>>ron<<
S/V Serenty