I have an Islander 30 MII currently sitting on the hard in La Paz. It is not the prettiest boat to grace the sea, nor the largest, but it has been a good way to check out the cruising lifestyle before getting in too deep. We will be keeping it in the Sea of Cortez for the next few years doing a little cruising and kicking around for 5 ot 6 weeks each year, with probably more use by other friends and family members. I'm thinking of picking up an inflatable kayak, possibly a 2 person unit, something like Advanced Elements Dragonfly 2 and was wondering what other peoples experiences have been. Will use it to get around a little, poke around some bays, etc. Might even consider using it as a replacement for our dinghy. Takes less space, easier to row or paddle, and no kicker to store either. Any suggestions on what to pick up, maybe what to avoid, good experiences, bad experiences, etc. All info and suggestions would be welcome. Thanks, Rick
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I was gonna say Goerge has one, and it comes with
a free dog you can name Benji! George is my mentor. Because of him I am always careful launching and pulling my H23.5.....
a free dog you can name Benji! George is my mentor. Because of him I am always careful launching and pulling my H23.5.....
Dragonfly is Excellent
Rick, I just bought my wife a Dragonfly (one-man) for her birthday after much research. Best prices are out of Austin Kayak in Austin, Texas. Free express freight and excellent prices. Nice shop and staff. They gave us a coupon for a discount for the paddel or accessories. Although not intended for whitewater, they are very well made, are very tough and have great features including the grounding and skeg components built in and even an attached waterproof compass. The material is as tough as any Zodiac dinghy, easy to inflate and very comfortable. Look up AdvancedElements on the web for a brochure and pictures. A friend is an avid "hard" kayaker who travels the world and thinks these are the best for more tranquil waters. Safe paddling Bob 30 Catalina
Rick, I just bought my wife a Dragonfly (one-man) for her birthday after much research. Best prices are out of Austin Kayak in Austin, Texas. Free express freight and excellent prices. Nice shop and staff. They gave us a coupon for a discount for the paddel or accessories. Although not intended for whitewater, they are very well made, are very tough and have great features including the grounding and skeg components built in and even an attached waterproof compass. The material is as tough as any Zodiac dinghy, easy to inflate and very comfortable. Look up AdvancedElements on the web for a brochure and pictures. A friend is an avid "hard" kayaker who travels the world and thinks these are the best for more tranquil waters. Safe paddling Bob 30 Catalina
Rick, I understand why you would want to
go the route of a two-man inflatable. As for me, I am seriously contemplating buying the one-man folding kayak that is advertised on sailboatowners.com. The pleasure of paddling a good kayak would greatly increase my pleasure of exploring on the water and might be just the thing to get me to spend nights at anchor on my Pearson 30 rather than at the marina as I am in the habit of doing. Also, it would be fun to explore the back-waters of the Tn River after work.
go the route of a two-man inflatable. As for me, I am seriously contemplating buying the one-man folding kayak that is advertised on sailboatowners.com. The pleasure of paddling a good kayak would greatly increase my pleasure of exploring on the water and might be just the thing to get me to spend nights at anchor on my Pearson 30 rather than at the marina as I am in the habit of doing. Also, it would be fun to explore the back-waters of the Tn River after work.
Consider singles
Have you considered single person boats? We rented and borrowed both single and double boats prior to purchaseing. I thought that a double was what we wanted. Only one boat to take care of, find a place to store, two people paddeling, 40% less cost, etc.. Then we went on a long trip in a double up in the pacific north west out with the Orca whales and my wife made me so nervous jerking around pointing at the wildlife that I decided we needed two boats. Each person has different levels of comfort or balance, different paces or different interests along the trip.
Have you considered single person boats? We rented and borrowed both single and double boats prior to purchaseing. I thought that a double was what we wanted. Only one boat to take care of, find a place to store, two people paddeling, 40% less cost, etc.. Then we went on a long trip in a double up in the pacific north west out with the Orca whales and my wife made me so nervous jerking around pointing at the wildlife that I decided we needed two boats. Each person has different levels of comfort or balance, different paces or different interests along the trip.
Try the West Marine version of Advanced Elements
Two seasons ago I bought Advanced Elements most rugged one-person, the "advanceframe" model that has an aluminum nose and stern piece. It makes packing and assembling more troublesome and makes it uncomfortably heavy to carry, but when I used it in rough surf on Long Island Sound I decided it was really the only version to have if you're going to use an inflatable on the ocean. Then West Marine began selling a lighter version of the same design by Advanced Elements (the "skedaddle") without the frame pieces, ten less pounds of weight, and a more standard inflator valve. I found it to be the best of all worlds and like it very much. I would probably use it on the ocean on a nice day, since it is sturdy, but the advanceframe model is really the prudent choice. Both models have their 2-seater version, but the skedaddle doesn't give the option of converting to a long one-seater. I owned a Sterns at one point, and while it's the most fun you can have on the water for under $100, it was too bouncy for serious paddling. The West Marine "skedaddle" is only $50 more, but a much better design...
Two seasons ago I bought Advanced Elements most rugged one-person, the "advanceframe" model that has an aluminum nose and stern piece. It makes packing and assembling more troublesome and makes it uncomfortably heavy to carry, but when I used it in rough surf on Long Island Sound I decided it was really the only version to have if you're going to use an inflatable on the ocean. Then West Marine began selling a lighter version of the same design by Advanced Elements (the "skedaddle") without the frame pieces, ten less pounds of weight, and a more standard inflator valve. I found it to be the best of all worlds and like it very much. I would probably use it on the ocean on a nice day, since it is sturdy, but the advanceframe model is really the prudent choice. Both models have their 2-seater version, but the skedaddle doesn't give the option of converting to a long one-seater. I owned a Sterns at one point, and while it's the most fun you can have on the water for under $100, it was too bouncy for serious paddling. The West Marine "skedaddle" is only $50 more, but a much better design...
Innova Helios Inflatable Kayak
Anyone have any comments or have used the Innova Helios Inflatable Kayak?
Anyone have any comments or have used the Innova Helios Inflatable Kayak?
Singles might be the way to go...
My initial thought was to go for a two seater, but it might be better to go with 2 singles. Gives some room to do differnt things, compensates for different paddling styles, makes for some space when some might be needed. I was thinking that a 2 seater might have an advantage of having a little more space for gear, groceries or whatever...
My initial thought was to go for a two seater, but it might be better to go with 2 singles. Gives some room to do differnt things, compensates for different paddling styles, makes for some space when some might be needed. I was thinking that a 2 seater might have an advantage of having a little more space for gear, groceries or whatever...
We had
our two Advanced Frame kayaks out on Puget Sound today. They are awesome! They track reasonably straight, are easy to inflate, easy to paddle, and easy to fold back up and pack up. The inflated cowling allows us to fasten our spray skirts which in these cold waters is a serious benefit. They have their own carry bags and only weigh 36 lbs. each. We also have a full sized fiberglass Eddyline San Juan double which we love, but it cannot be taken on board our sailboat. The Advanced Frames can. We tried a double Sevylor. Didn't make it through one season before the tubes started to come apart. Friends have the Stearns. Seem strong enough, but don't track as well as the Advanced Frame. Shop around; we found quite a difference in our local shops.
our two Advanced Frame kayaks out on Puget Sound today. They are awesome! They track reasonably straight, are easy to inflate, easy to paddle, and easy to fold back up and pack up. The inflated cowling allows us to fasten our spray skirts which in these cold waters is a serious benefit. They have their own carry bags and only weigh 36 lbs. each. We also have a full sized fiberglass Eddyline San Juan double which we love, but it cannot be taken on board our sailboat. The Advanced Frames can. We tried a double Sevylor. Didn't make it through one season before the tubes started to come apart. Friends have the Stearns. Seem strong enough, but don't track as well as the Advanced Frame. Shop around; we found quite a difference in our local shops.
I know Folbot
My cousin has one and the times I spent on it made me want to build one. Lightweight and framed. Two person, and easy to single hand. It took 30 to 45 minutes to put together (it was a while ago and I should have paid more attention as to how it went together..I bet the time could be lowered). My educated guess is that the blowups are made from the same type material. Tough, durable. But I sure liked the double for hauling stuff.
My cousin has one and the times I spent on it made me want to build one. Lightweight and framed. Two person, and easy to single hand. It took 30 to 45 minutes to put together (it was a while ago and I should have paid more attention as to how it went together..I bet the time could be lowered). My educated guess is that the blowups are made from the same type material. Tough, durable. But I sure liked the double for hauling stuff.
Beautiful wood boats
Lou, Those are good looking boats. How many hours of work do each type take to make? Some winter my goal is to make one. But for now we use Cobra plastic sit on top models. Simple and almost bomb proof. Ed
Lou, Those are good looking boats. How many hours of work do each type take to make? Some winter my goal is to make one. But for now we use Cobra plastic sit on top models. Simple and almost bomb proof. Ed
I never kept track of hours
Thanks Ed. I really can't tell you hours, but I built two of the stitch and glue boats from plans each of two consecutive winters. I figured that each step for two boats would not be much more time than just doing one. Chesapeake Light Craft used to estimate about 100 hours or so, but I think that is from a kit and is very variable depending upon finish and degree of confidence. I tend to go out and do lots of staring at things before each next step. The process is very therapeutic for me and that is part of the appeal! The strip built boat I made also over a winter, but it took somewhat longer. If you want to see some beautiful boats, go to Guillemot's web site and look at the boats that Nick Shade has built. They are museum pieces!
Thanks Ed. I really can't tell you hours, but I built two of the stitch and glue boats from plans each of two consecutive winters. I figured that each step for two boats would not be much more time than just doing one. Chesapeake Light Craft used to estimate about 100 hours or so, but I think that is from a kit and is very variable depending upon finish and degree of confidence. I tend to go out and do lots of staring at things before each next step. The process is very therapeutic for me and that is part of the appeal! The strip built boat I made also over a winter, but it took somewhat longer. If you want to see some beautiful boats, go to Guillemot's web site and look at the boats that Nick Shade has built. They are museum pieces!
Sea Eagle Kayak
I bought a two man Sea Eagle inflatable kayak 3 - 4 years ago and it works like a charm. It came with a foot pump but I bought a small rachargable battery operated compressor from Canadian Tire on the web which pumps it up to about 90% capacity in minutes then I add the last bit with the foot pump. Be sure to sit in the middle when going it alone It's surprisingly sturdy and even performs reasonably in windy conditions. If you have a high freeboard though you need to be fairly spritely to get in and out of the thing however.
I bought a two man Sea Eagle inflatable kayak 3 - 4 years ago and it works like a charm. It came with a foot pump but I bought a small rachargable battery operated compressor from Canadian Tire on the web which pumps it up to about 90% capacity in minutes then I add the last bit with the foot pump. Be sure to sit in the middle when going it alone It's surprisingly sturdy and even performs reasonably in windy conditions. If you have a high freeboard though you need to be fairly spritely to get in and out of the thing however.
Bob - Dragonfly
Bob, I've heard pretty positive comments about Advanced Elements, thier boats in general, and the Dragonfly model. I was looking at the two seater and based on comments here, I think I will opt for 2 singles. It makes a little more sense to give us just a little more room. I stopped in at a local kayak shop to see what they had. Because they focus more on rivers and whitewater, the sales rep could only focus on the advanced frame with little good to say about the other boats. His reference was "not much more thatn a pool toy". From what I am hearing elsewhere, other Advanced Elements products such as the Dragonfly are well built, very durable, just not built for heavy seas or white water. How do your boats handle?
Bob, I've heard pretty positive comments about Advanced Elements, thier boats in general, and the Dragonfly model. I was looking at the two seater and based on comments here, I think I will opt for 2 singles. It makes a little more sense to give us just a little more room. I stopped in at a local kayak shop to see what they had. Because they focus more on rivers and whitewater, the sales rep could only focus on the advanced frame with little good to say about the other boats. His reference was "not much more thatn a pool toy". From what I am hearing elsewhere, other Advanced Elements products such as the Dragonfly are well built, very durable, just not built for heavy seas or white water. How do your boats handle?
Dragonfly
Rick. First, check on line for Austin Kayak as they are currently selling the single seat Dragonfly for $219.00 with free Fed Exp three day shipping. Best price I have found. You'll also get a coupon good for a discount on a decent paddle. Great shop. The Dragonfly is incredibly stable as they are fairly beamy and your snugged in between the two air-chambers, and chambered inflatable floor. You feel secure in it while paddling. The guys at Austin Kayak assured me that you do not need to learn how to roll in these as it will dump you out if flipped. The Dragonfly comes with a stock back support, but they have an inflatable support as well if you are looking for a notch up on the back support on day long trips. What impresses me on these units is the engineering in the design. The front and rear are solid forms, the hull material is really thick and the integration of the mounted skeg and grounding plate is strong. Add the rip-stop nylon upper cover (orange), storage areas and what they claim is the "Boston type" air valve that works well and you have a decent kayak. I recommend a foot pump over the 12 volt filler pump. I do not think you would want to ground on oyster shells or land on a coral reef, but their portability and stability are the strong features. I used to think inflatable kayaks all had Sham-moo or Bozo the Clown logos and were toy boats.......!! Although these are at the lower end of the Advanced Elements production line they are great boats. Bob
Rick. First, check on line for Austin Kayak as they are currently selling the single seat Dragonfly for $219.00 with free Fed Exp three day shipping. Best price I have found. You'll also get a coupon good for a discount on a decent paddle. Great shop. The Dragonfly is incredibly stable as they are fairly beamy and your snugged in between the two air-chambers, and chambered inflatable floor. You feel secure in it while paddling. The guys at Austin Kayak assured me that you do not need to learn how to roll in these as it will dump you out if flipped. The Dragonfly comes with a stock back support, but they have an inflatable support as well if you are looking for a notch up on the back support on day long trips. What impresses me on these units is the engineering in the design. The front and rear are solid forms, the hull material is really thick and the integration of the mounted skeg and grounding plate is strong. Add the rip-stop nylon upper cover (orange), storage areas and what they claim is the "Boston type" air valve that works well and you have a decent kayak. I recommend a foot pump over the 12 volt filler pump. I do not think you would want to ground on oyster shells or land on a coral reef, but their portability and stability are the strong features. I used to think inflatable kayaks all had Sham-moo or Bozo the Clown logos and were toy boats.......!! Although these are at the lower end of the Advanced Elements production line they are great boats. Bob
Rick....Post
Rick, I failed to mention that the Dragonfly model is not intended for white water use or I would think for anything over a class I. We bought ours strictly for lake, waterway, marsh and bay exploration. The next model up in the line is the "Advance Frame" with an optional back-bone unit to provide more regidity. Its also $150 more then the Dragonfly. Two different species. Bob
Rick, I failed to mention that the Dragonfly model is not intended for white water use or I would think for anything over a class I. We bought ours strictly for lake, waterway, marsh and bay exploration. The next model up in the line is the "Advance Frame" with an optional back-bone unit to provide more regidity. Its also $150 more then the Dragonfly. Two different species. Bob
Further info..
Thanks Bob, and all others. I followed up and called checked with a few manufacturers. In the case of Advanced Elements, they tell me that the Dragonfly model is made of the same materials that the Advanced Frame model is, but both have different use in design and construction. The Dragonfly is not designed for white water, but for quiet water and lighter use. From user comments on other sites, it seems to be a pretty good product when used within its design parameters. My use will be poking around little bays and inlets in the Sea of Cortez. Much of which will likely be in relativly quite water but I would want to have enough room for a picnic lunch, maybe a few beers, fins, and a diving mask. Some comments indicate that storage maybe an issue on some boats. Time for me to go back to a dealer and have both models inflated and check them out. I
Thanks Bob, and all others. I followed up and called checked with a few manufacturers. In the case of Advanced Elements, they tell me that the Dragonfly model is made of the same materials that the Advanced Frame model is, but both have different use in design and construction. The Dragonfly is not designed for white water, but for quiet water and lighter use. From user comments on other sites, it seems to be a pretty good product when used within its design parameters. My use will be poking around little bays and inlets in the Sea of Cortez. Much of which will likely be in relativly quite water but I would want to have enough room for a picnic lunch, maybe a few beers, fins, and a diving mask. Some comments indicate that storage maybe an issue on some boats. Time for me to go back to a dealer and have both models inflated and check them out. I
Good Storage on the Dragonfly
Rick. Get a hold of the Advanced Elements Catalog and several storage bag options are available. The stock single seat Dragonfly comes with a nylon-mesh bag that hangs just inside the forward end of the cockpit coaming for keys, wallet, and smaller personal items. Nice feature. On deck is a gear bag big enough for a lunch and bottled water that attaches to the laced gear-stow location. It appears several bags can be attached in that area. A large zippered nylon mesh bag with a waterproof attached compass is also up on the forward deck. The paddle can be stowed within a side mounted fore and aft velcro tab. All in all a good bang for the buck! Your fins can be mounted forward and your mask clipped onto the strap that retains the support seat in the rear. If however, you are planning on packing up a scout troop for a weekend, then your going to have to buy a fleet of seakayaks with all those woderful storage compartments! Bob
Rick. Get a hold of the Advanced Elements Catalog and several storage bag options are available. The stock single seat Dragonfly comes with a nylon-mesh bag that hangs just inside the forward end of the cockpit coaming for keys, wallet, and smaller personal items. Nice feature. On deck is a gear bag big enough for a lunch and bottled water that attaches to the laced gear-stow location. It appears several bags can be attached in that area. A large zippered nylon mesh bag with a waterproof attached compass is also up on the forward deck. The paddle can be stowed within a side mounted fore and aft velcro tab. All in all a good bang for the buck! Your fins can be mounted forward and your mask clipped onto the strap that retains the support seat in the rear. If however, you are planning on packing up a scout troop for a weekend, then your going to have to buy a fleet of seakayaks with all those woderful storage compartments! Bob
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