Trusting a broker is always something I have had problems with. I am currently looking at buying a Hunter 34' somewhere between 1984 and 1986 or should I say "affordable". The brokers I have been dealing with (great lakes) have failed to convince me of their integrety or even motivation - maybe they're still hybernating... Are there any suggestions on where I can strike an honest deal or maybe even a private sale? I am motivated to buy within the next few weeks if there is a sound reason. If you have any reason you would encourage me not to buy the above said boat, please let me know this, too.
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Just a reminder
Boats for sale may not be advettised or announced inthe forums. If you're looking for specific boats, Joe, you may want to post your email address so people can contact you offline. Also, don't forget to check out classifieds plus those at yachtworld and Soundings. they always seem to have plenty of boats around.
Boats for sale may not be advettised or announced inthe forums. If you're looking for specific boats, Joe, you may want to post your email address so people can contact you offline. Also, don't forget to check out classifieds plus those at yachtworld and Soundings. they always seem to have plenty of boats around.
My Email
You can email me offline at jemmert@krauss-maffeicorp.com if you have any contacts. Thank you!
You can email me offline at jemmert@krauss-maffeicorp.com if you have any contacts. Thank you!
TMI
Have you tried Torresen Marine at Muskegon, MI? (www.torresen.com) I've used them several times with good results.
Have you tried Torresen Marine at Muskegon, MI? (www.torresen.com) I've used them several times with good results.
Brokers recommended
Bought a Hunter 32 from Sailing Specialties, Mystic, Conn. they are a first class outfit: reliable and know their business: ask for Fletcher Ryan or Bob Morrisson (owner). I also have dealt with Boats-r-fun, Willsboro, N.Y. they are also a very first class broker/marina. They both are Hunter dealers. Good Luck
Bought a Hunter 32 from Sailing Specialties, Mystic, Conn. they are a first class outfit: reliable and know their business: ask for Fletcher Ryan or Bob Morrisson (owner). I also have dealt with Boats-r-fun, Willsboro, N.Y. they are also a very first class broker/marina. They both are Hunter dealers. Good Luck
Brokers
No need to trust you broker although it would be nice. Remember in many cases he'll try to sell you what he has, not what you want or need. Find a vessel that meets your needs, offer what you think it's worth and get a good survey. Don't let the broker steer you to something you don't want or something out of your price range. Ignore the asking price - offer what you think it is worth. I was approached by a broker in my area last week who assured he could get $3k over high book for my h34. These boats are in demand and are a good value. He indicated they are having a "hot season" and demand exceeds supply. Use the web searches, consider an out of town sale. I'm curious why you didn't include 1983 h34 boats. They actually have a few features that were cut as cost savings in later years. (anchor cleat, large mast base, Westerbeke motors on some, properly matched prop pitch, lewmar winches, better price, ...) Good quality older fresh water boats aren't always easy to find and are generally priced higher than their salty sister ships. I purchased mine in August. Sellers are more motivated after mid season, especially up north. Good luck! I'm not upgrading for 2-3 years (unless the stock market goes crazy again) Barry s/v "PER DIEM too"
No need to trust you broker although it would be nice. Remember in many cases he'll try to sell you what he has, not what you want or need. Find a vessel that meets your needs, offer what you think it's worth and get a good survey. Don't let the broker steer you to something you don't want or something out of your price range. Ignore the asking price - offer what you think it is worth. I was approached by a broker in my area last week who assured he could get $3k over high book for my h34. These boats are in demand and are a good value. He indicated they are having a "hot season" and demand exceeds supply. Use the web searches, consider an out of town sale. I'm curious why you didn't include 1983 h34 boats. They actually have a few features that were cut as cost savings in later years. (anchor cleat, large mast base, Westerbeke motors on some, properly matched prop pitch, lewmar winches, better price, ...) Good quality older fresh water boats aren't always easy to find and are generally priced higher than their salty sister ships. I purchased mine in August. Sellers are more motivated after mid season, especially up north. Good luck! I'm not upgrading for 2-3 years (unless the stock market goes crazy again) Barry s/v "PER DIEM too"
Fin keels should be cheap this year.
Joe: Fin keels should be cheap this year. With the water levels in the Great Lakes as low as they are you may be able to find some good deals. If you are looking for a shoal keel you will probably be paying top dollar. Just a word of advise: Even if you are working with a reputable dealer they may not know about hidden things in a boat. Surveyors and dealers can miss things. They usually have not spent more than a few hours aboard the boat. So remember Caveat Emptor (let the purchaser beware).
Joe: Fin keels should be cheap this year. With the water levels in the Great Lakes as low as they are you may be able to find some good deals. If you are looking for a shoal keel you will probably be paying top dollar. Just a word of advise: Even if you are working with a reputable dealer they may not know about hidden things in a boat. Surveyors and dealers can miss things. They usually have not spent more than a few hours aboard the boat. So remember Caveat Emptor (let the purchaser beware).
Seller
Sorry but the broker works for the seller. Why should you trust one as it's their job to sell you a boat for top dollar.
Sorry but the broker works for the seller. Why should you trust one as it's their job to sell you a boat for top dollar.
You don' t need a broker
You don't need a broker to do a transaction, and certainly not one who does not represent you. A broker's job is to put the buyer and seller together, and they may be helpful in finding the boat you're looking for. After you find that dream boat, the most important things are the purchase and sale agreement, a good surveyor, and your own investigation. I would suggest that you be careful before signing a purchase and sale contract and read it carefully. Make sure you can back out of the deal if there is an unsatisfactory survey or sea survey (i.e. test sail). Have the deposit money held by a neutral third party (e.g. title company).
You don't need a broker to do a transaction, and certainly not one who does not represent you. A broker's job is to put the buyer and seller together, and they may be helpful in finding the boat you're looking for. After you find that dream boat, the most important things are the purchase and sale agreement, a good surveyor, and your own investigation. I would suggest that you be careful before signing a purchase and sale contract and read it carefully. Make sure you can back out of the deal if there is an unsatisfactory survey or sea survey (i.e. test sail). Have the deposit money held by a neutral third party (e.g. title company).
Maybe we're splitting hairs
...but in my opinion, the broker works for "the deal." He is paid by the seller, but his loyalty would have to be to the deal. It would be interesting hear a broker's point of view on this.
...but in my opinion, the broker works for "the deal." He is paid by the seller, but his loyalty would have to be to the deal. It would be interesting hear a broker's point of view on this.
Try this Broker
I purchased a h31 from RCR Yachts this past fall. The Broker, Mark Kirby, worked for me not the seller and I have been very pleased with his efforts and follow up after the sale. I have worked with RCR for several years maintaining my previous boat. You can find them at www.rcryachts.com. sv/Kililani
I purchased a h31 from RCR Yachts this past fall. The Broker, Mark Kirby, worked for me not the seller and I have been very pleased with his efforts and follow up after the sale. I have worked with RCR for several years maintaining my previous boat. You can find them at www.rcryachts.com. sv/Kililani
It's better than buying a used car
I bought several used boats, two small ones from owners, the last one from Sun and Sail north of Detroit. I was happy with the boat and the deal they helped me get. The boat was overpriced and the offers and counter offers at arms length worked well and they were very helpful in obtaining minor repairs and information afterwords. As someone stated before, they are interested in the deal, it's how they make their living. It is your responsibility to evaluate both asking price and the boat. That is where a good surveyor helps, the BUC guide and now the internet. And it's more fun than buying a used car. Good Luck!
I bought several used boats, two small ones from owners, the last one from Sun and Sail north of Detroit. I was happy with the boat and the deal they helped me get. The boat was overpriced and the offers and counter offers at arms length worked well and they were very helpful in obtaining minor repairs and information afterwords. As someone stated before, they are interested in the deal, it's how they make their living. It is your responsibility to evaluate both asking price and the boat. That is where a good surveyor helps, the BUC guide and now the internet. And it's more fun than buying a used car. Good Luck!
Honest Broker
I frequently share your concern with dealing with any sales people but I feel quite confident in reccommending Bob Reed of St. Clair Sailboat Center. His office is located at Jefferson Beach Marina in St. Clair Shores. I bought my Hunter 37.5 from him and have had several aquaintances sell their boats through him.
I frequently share your concern with dealing with any sales people but I feel quite confident in reccommending Bob Reed of St. Clair Sailboat Center. His office is located at Jefferson Beach Marina in St. Clair Shores. I bought my Hunter 37.5 from him and have had several aquaintances sell their boats through him.
Broker recommanded
Like Chuck, I've been very empressed by Mark Kirby from RCR Yacht (Buffalo). I bought my 35,5 from him and he's been very helpful, much more in fact than my broker here in Montreal.
Like Chuck, I've been very empressed by Mark Kirby from RCR Yacht (Buffalo). I bought my 35,5 from him and he's been very helpful, much more in fact than my broker here in Montreal.
RCR-Kirby Vote
We got our 37.5 at RCR using Mark Kirby. I have nothing but compliments for his service. Robert Pancza
We got our 37.5 at RCR using Mark Kirby. I have nothing but compliments for his service. Robert Pancza
Agree with most of all
I think a broker is there for the deal, he sell's he wins, period. Now I bought a H34, 83 in Oct. 97, end of the season is the best time to buy. I'm from Montreal area, loked around here, drove few times to Toronto area, and many times on the east coast, from NY City and Long Island to Marblehead, North of Boston where I finalyy found my boat. I looked on the net at Sounding and Yachtworld, this is how I started aimeing toward H34, but the one I now owned had already been sold through the services of John Brady, from Northrop & Johnson, 508-921-6600, the buyer had problems finding the money, and with the seller and the buyer agreement had the opportunity to sell it to me. I wouldn't have found that deal on the Net. Up to me, the distance and the troubles worthed all the money I saved for that boat. The after sale service of John was great. André R. Lachapelle Wind Spirit 3, Lake Champlain, NY
I think a broker is there for the deal, he sell's he wins, period. Now I bought a H34, 83 in Oct. 97, end of the season is the best time to buy. I'm from Montreal area, loked around here, drove few times to Toronto area, and many times on the east coast, from NY City and Long Island to Marblehead, North of Boston where I finalyy found my boat. I looked on the net at Sounding and Yachtworld, this is how I started aimeing toward H34, but the one I now owned had already been sold through the services of John Brady, from Northrop & Johnson, 508-921-6600, the buyer had problems finding the money, and with the seller and the buyer agreement had the opportunity to sell it to me. I wouldn't have found that deal on the Net. Up to me, the distance and the troubles worthed all the money I saved for that boat. The after sale service of John was great. André R. Lachapelle Wind Spirit 3, Lake Champlain, NY
Hunter 34
I owned a 1983 Hunter 34. It was a great boat very sound. Fast in medium air, slow in light air. Pointed real well even with a shoal draft. I rarily used the wisker pole down wind I always deep reached an usually beat the pole users. I sold it because of a job change. I paid $35,000 in 1992 sold it in 96' for $34,500. Do it you will not regret it. Wes
I owned a 1983 Hunter 34. It was a great boat very sound. Fast in medium air, slow in light air. Pointed real well even with a shoal draft. I rarily used the wisker pole down wind I always deep reached an usually beat the pole users. I sold it because of a job change. I paid $35,000 in 1992 sold it in 96' for $34,500. Do it you will not regret it. Wes
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