Hi My Hunter 430 has very exsesive weather helm even in 15 knots of wind with full rig. Yes I know that she goes just as quickly with a reef and the problem goes away BUT as the wind reaches the level neat each reefing level the weather helm is totaly exsesive, two hands on the wheel and still cant hold it! Would altering the mast rake help? and if so what rake is correct? as the fore stay is fixed lenght this is something that I cant just try quickly. This is B and R rig, do all Hunters have the same problem? Roger
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There are lots of really good advice there. The basic cause is that the center of effort of the wind on the sails and hull is too far aft of the center of effort of the water on the keel, rudder, and hull. You may find that these conditions that move the center of wind effort back, leading to excessive weather helm: - The mainsail may be tuned too full. Flattening the main, and easing the traveler reduce weather helm as wind picks up. - The mainsail may be blown out. This was the basic problem on our '77 h27. A new main dramtically reduced weather helm and heel, while increasing drive. - The rig may be raked too far aft as you suggest. This moves the whole sail plan aft, and is easily corrected. By the way, some rake (3-5 degrees) is good, since winds on the water blow slightly down at that angle to the horizontal. - A large headsail (135, or 150) increases weather helm because a significant part of the sail is aft of the wind center of effort. - As you note, in higher winds, reefing the main reduces weather helm by reducing the aft edge of the sail. If the boat is consistently heeling over 15 degrees, and you have tuned the main, reefing is exactly the right next step. I have not heard of a case where addressing these (or similar) issues has not tamed weather helm on any of the boats on this site. Good luck, David Lady Lillie
There are lots of really good advice there. The basic cause is that the center of effort of the wind on the sails and hull is too far aft of the center of effort of the water on the keel, rudder, and hull. You may find that these conditions that move the center of wind effort back, leading to excessive weather helm: - The mainsail may be tuned too full. Flattening the main, and easing the traveler reduce weather helm as wind picks up. - The mainsail may be blown out. This was the basic problem on our '77 h27. A new main dramtically reduced weather helm and heel, while increasing drive. - The rig may be raked too far aft as you suggest. This moves the whole sail plan aft, and is easily corrected. By the way, some rake (3-5 degrees) is good, since winds on the water blow slightly down at that angle to the horizontal. - A large headsail (135, or 150) increases weather helm because a significant part of the sail is aft of the wind center of effort. - As you note, in higher winds, reefing the main reduces weather helm by reducing the aft edge of the sail. If the boat is consistently heeling over 15 degrees, and you have tuned the main, reefing is exactly the right next step. I have not heard of a case where addressing these (or similar) issues has not tamed weather helm on any of the boats on this site. Good luck, David Lady Lillie
Weather Helm on 430s
Rodger, When we first purchased our 430, the mast had considerable rake and significant weather helm. I hired a rigger and reduced the rake to 10 - 12 inches, best $250 I have spent on the boat. The boat is now well balanced (approx 5 degrees weather helm) even at 15 knots and full sail. However, we always aim to have the first reef in before the wind reaches 15 knots - the boat sails flatter and faster. Our highest and most consistent speeds through the water (8 - 9 Kts) have been achieved with either single or double reefs! Peter Milne S/V Blue Heron
Rodger, When we first purchased our 430, the mast had considerable rake and significant weather helm. I hired a rigger and reduced the rake to 10 - 12 inches, best $250 I have spent on the boat. The boat is now well balanced (approx 5 degrees weather helm) even at 15 knots and full sail. However, we always aim to have the first reef in before the wind reaches 15 knots - the boat sails flatter and faster. Our highest and most consistent speeds through the water (8 - 9 Kts) have been achieved with either single or double reefs! Peter Milne S/V Blue Heron
Check you rudder
This is not a logical answer, I know, however, I would check the shape of your rudder. I have a Hunter 380 and when it was new we had a terrible pull to starboard both under sail and power. It turns out we had a rudder that was curved somewhat but enough to want to turn the boat at all speeds. Hunter sent us a new rudder. Several other boats have had this problem. It may not be the cause of your weather helm but I would check the shape of your rudder.
This is not a logical answer, I know, however, I would check the shape of your rudder. I have a Hunter 380 and when it was new we had a terrible pull to starboard both under sail and power. It turns out we had a rudder that was curved somewhat but enough to want to turn the boat at all speeds. Hunter sent us a new rudder. Several other boats have had this problem. It may not be the cause of your weather helm but I would check the shape of your rudder.
Last week I was in Port Madison heading...
toward Agate Pass with 18 knots apparent sailing close hauled with both sails up full doing eight plus knots. Our screechometer (a term coined by my first mate) was reading about 25 to 30 degrees with what I would consider moderate weather helm (I could hold the wheel with one finger). Our P42 has the standard 150 genoa with about six inches of mast bend. Perhaps excessive bend is the culprit as suggested by the previous post. As I recall the P42 and the 430 are pretty close, characteristically. It usually takes over 20 knots of wind before I consider the first tuck in the main. Even in these winds I would still consider it moderate weather helm. Terry
toward Agate Pass with 18 knots apparent sailing close hauled with both sails up full doing eight plus knots. Our screechometer (a term coined by my first mate) was reading about 25 to 30 degrees with what I would consider moderate weather helm (I could hold the wheel with one finger). Our P42 has the standard 150 genoa with about six inches of mast bend. Perhaps excessive bend is the culprit as suggested by the previous post. As I recall the P42 and the 430 are pretty close, characteristically. It usually takes over 20 knots of wind before I consider the first tuck in the main. Even in these winds I would still consider it moderate weather helm. Terry
And you knew that I was home feeding horses. Fred, nah. Say, how close are you to Poulsbo?...
I stayed at the recip dock at the PYC in Poulsbo. Nice group of people. They invited me to their monthly steak fry last Friday. You bring your own and cook it on their BBQ. For $2.50 you get a baked potato, salad, dessert, and all the trimmings. I'm thinking about attending it again next month. John Nantz is a member but he was out of town last Friday. Maybe we can get together at the next one. What do you think? John will have the date. Terry
I stayed at the recip dock at the PYC in Poulsbo. Nice group of people. They invited me to their monthly steak fry last Friday. You bring your own and cook it on their BBQ. For $2.50 you get a baked potato, salad, dessert, and all the trimmings. I'm thinking about attending it again next month. John Nantz is a member but he was out of town last Friday. Maybe we can get together at the next one. What do you think? John will have the date. Terry
Terry
I'm at Brownsville, one hour away by sailboat. (motoring) That sounds great. I have to check my wifes schedule though because she works a 'sliding' shift. And John called me a couple of nights ago. We had never spoken. He sounded just like I would imagine; intelligent. Looking forward to hearing from you,,,
I'm at Brownsville, one hour away by sailboat. (motoring) That sounds great. I have to check my wifes schedule though because she works a 'sliding' shift. And John called me a couple of nights ago. We had never spoken. He sounded just like I would imagine; intelligent. Looking forward to hearing from you,,,
Fred, please e-mail me with your contact...
information at tandpcox@verizon.net. We had quite the blow here today. Temperature dropped about 20 degrees. Brrrr. Terry
information at tandpcox@verizon.net. We had quite the blow here today. Temperature dropped about 20 degrees. Brrrr. Terry
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