How to avoid getting jib sheet jammed on winch

[PotomacDaysailer]

I don't have self-tailers and frequently encounter this problem on tacks: I throw two or three wraps on the winch and pull the sheet in rapidly hand-over-hand; the sheet "walks" its way down the winch drum such that the angle from the fair lead causes the sheet to cross over itself on the drum and jam. I then have to take the turns off the winch counter-clockwise to clear the jam, quite difficult if the sheet is under tension. Annoying, and I have missed stays quite a few times due to luffing up to relieve the tension on the sheet to unjam it.

I tried to illustrate in the accompanying drawing - black shows the proper wrap with the tail coming off on top and the sheet from the fairlead coming in on the bottom; red shows the sheet wrapped over the tail.

How can I avoid doing this?

 

[Ron20324]

On a 26, I'd think you could sheet in about all the way without pre-wraps. . That, or just one wrap. Alot of people on my boat think wrapping on a winch gives them some power advantage - but it does not. It only adds friction and makes it harder to haul in. And, and as you know, you get over-rides.

 

[PotomacDaysailer]

... Alot of people on my boat think wrapping on a winch gives them some power advantage - but it does not. ...

Yes, that's what I thought too, but now that you point that out, I can see that it wouldn't - d'oh!
So is there ever an advantage to more than one turn on the winch?

 

[jssailem]

Yes. As the pressure on the sail increases it may take more turns to permit you to grind the winch while triming. I take the one turn and pull as the sail is crossing the bow. Before the pressure builds I add two turns and crank to finish trimming the sail. With practice you will know when to add the turns. Using a self tailing winch makes this an easier one person task. Never did understand why some sailors would make their wraps then delay till the sail was on the new tack before drawing in the sail and setting it.

Goes with the question why throw the helm over and hold it, not starting to correct once the bow is threw the wind. Waiting just leads to over correction and a slowing of the boat while you hunt for the new heading.

 

[Dalliance]

I've encountered this with both self-trailers and non-self-tailors. Unless you somehow have your fair lead located high in relation to the winch drum, which I doubt, I think the issue is the inherently inconsistent tension on the sheet as you are pulling it hand over hand while the head-sail moves across the fore deck. It allows the multiple wraps around the winch to fall over one another. Try starting with just one wrap around the winch until the sail begins to pick up load, then quickly add two more wraps above the first.

 

[David in Sandusky]

Good advice! We will give the "one wrap then two more" approach a try!

 

[dscribner]

We use the one turn first method. We also have a block at the toe rail that sets the sheet a a good angle to prevent the override. You might try installing one if you haven't already and experimenting with the angle.

 

[kloudie1]

This from the Harken folks:
Line Entry Angle is Important

Winches are further affected by how they are mounted on the boat. The most important factor is to ensure a proper line entry angle. Lines must lead up to a winch at about a 5-to-8-degree angle to prevent overrides of the sheet on the drum. If lead blocks are too high to allow this angle up to the drum, the winch must be raised slightly, or you will have serious problems preventing overrides.

 

[alexco38]

You can either install a fair-lead to lower the entry angle of the line to the winch or put a wedge under the winch to "tilt" it backward. Only need a few degrees. See diagram from kloudie1.
There is another options such as installing a turning block stern of the winch. Most slope with 150% genoa need a turning block and adjustable fair-lead track.

 

[Jackdaw]

Claude called it. Your picture show an impossibly bad angle. If the lead-in comes from ABOVE the winch (even by a few degrees) over-rides will be a constant (and very dangerous) problem.

 

[Ron20324]

A good point about having one wrap on the winch, on my boat without a wrap, people tend to drag the line over the edge of the fiberglass coaming. Having the line on the winch kind of gives the line a fairlead. Other boat desogns may =not have this problem, though.

 

[Benny17441]

The purpose of the wraps is to grab the winch drum and to adjust the loads to the tailer. Too few wraps on a large load can damage a winch by transferring too much load to the self tailer arm. It will also place uneven loads on the bearings. On the other hand too many wraps can cause line jams when trying to unload the winch. There is always a proper number of wraps and with practice you should easily determine the number for each situation. It is also necessary that the winches be properly positioned so as to have a proper line entry angle.

 

[Jackdaw]

The purpose of the wraps is to grab the winch drum and to adjust the loads to the tailer. Too few wraps on a large load can damage a winch by transferring too much load to the self tailer arm.

With modern low-stretch lines on big boats, it can also tear the cover off the line. Wanna see a boat owner get REALLY PISSED?? Under-wrap a sheet or halyard and tear the cover off the middle of a $300 piece of rope.

 

[Dalliance]

Taking a second look at your diagram today, I see that Kloudie and JackDaw are absolutely right. The entry angle from the fairlead is indeed too high and will cause overrides.
I would also add that starting with just one wrap and adding wraps when the sail loads up works best in lighter wind conditions. In heavier winds, everything happens faster and the sheet can load up too quickly to get the added wraps on. You don't want to be grinding the winch, self-tailing or non-self-tailing, with less than three wraps on it.

 

[Benny17441]

I may define light winds as not having to use a winch handle to pull the lines but once a which handle is necessary I will load at least 3 to 4 wraps on the drum.

 

[PotomacDaysailer]

Thanks for all the replies and great advice! I was out today and practiced the one-turn-then-add-wraps technique. A great improvement in tacking, and no overrides. I also might experiment with adding a block to reduce the angle.

 

[SFS]

This may sound silly, but teach yourself the proper way to take the extra wraps without endangering your fingers. There should never be an instant where a digit is between the line and the winch. This is particularly true if the winch handle is already in place - you may be more focused on clearing the end of the handle than on the position of your fingers.

 

[agprice22]

Entry should be low, and haul your tail high by keeping your hand above the winch. Also, only use one hand to wrap the winch. Nice, wide wraps. It is the other hand that gets caught as you try to guide the line on the winch. Practice using one hand.