How is that saildrive treating you?

[Gunni]

The production builders are in a rush to replace the sturdy and simple shaft n strut drive systems with saildrives, and they want me to believe it is an improvement. I'm not buying it. If you have one of these contraptions, and especially if you previously HAD a shaft drive, what is your saildrive experience?

 

[MrBill_FLL]

non owner, but crew on a dufor with one...

its smooth and quiet! but is only 7 years old now... -so really too early to really tell.

 

[Stu Jackson]

gunni, thanks for the courage to ask this question.

 

[BarryL]

simple?

The production builders are in a rush to replace the sturdy and simple shaft n strut drive systems with saildrives, and they want me to believe it is an improvement. I'm not buying it. If you have one of these contraptions, and especially if you previously HAD a shaft drive, what is your saildrive experience?

Hey,

I have no experience with sail drive, so I can't help there. Personally, I don't think that the standard shaft is so simple. There is the coupling, the stuffing box and on many boats (mine included) the strut and cutless bearing. Lots that can wear out and cause problems. Personally, a sail drive seems like a better solution.

Barry

 

[kloudie1]

I agree that saildrives are OK in places where ya pull the boat every year .. and you are in the water only half a year.. here, it might be 3-4 years between haul-outs and the season is all year.. I don't like the expensive gearbox operating under water with only about 10 thousandths of an inch wide sliding contact (Lip seal to shaft) separating the gearbox from disaster. That big hole through the bottom of the boat doesn't sit well with me either but the diaphragms have a pretty good record.

 

[tommays]

The issue is the same as with the kabilion sterndrives on powerboats

They use a piece of marginal metal from a marine standpoint that depends on a complex sometimes 40 step factory paint job and anodes to stay alive and for most people it does

the newer powerboat pods are the first units made out of a true marine alloy and doing much better and after 5 some odd years on the market the true upkeep cost is becoming known

 

[Maine Sail]

Hey,

I have no experience with sail drive, so I can't help there. Personally, I don't think that the standard shaft is so simple. There is the coupling, the stuffing box and on many boats (mine included) the strut and cutless bearing. Lots that can wear out and cause problems. Personally, a sail drive seems like a better solution.

Barry

Until you foot the bill every seven or so years to replace the seal or begin having corrosion issues and need to replace the leg $$$$$$$$$. They are much more simple, and less labor intensive for a builder to install but generally wind up being more costly over the long haul for the boat owner. Neither set up is perfect but I have enough customers with sail drives to know that I don't want one and I do avoid used boats that had them...

I have many customers with the original shaft and stuffing boxes going back 30 or more years (yes most ignore the hose replacements) and I don't have single sail drive customer with a leg anywhere near that old that has not been replaced a few times already.

One of my customers just replaced the seal on his 2004 boat this past winter. The builder left NO ROOM to get the gear box out so the seal could be replaced and this involved cutting fiberglass, cabinetry and many other items just to get at the seal and then repairing all these items, cha ching $$$$$$$$$$$$$$. He is also dealing with corrosion issues. The leg may need replacement this coming winter. That would be just 8 seasons!!! The leg has been stripped, primed and repainted four times since new and no matter what nothing wants to stick to it and the aluminum is corroding badly. Everyone has been pointing fingers. The engine maker pointing fingers at the builder, the builder pointing fingers at the engine manufacturer and the builder and engine manufacturer pointing fingers at the owner... Who's out the big money? Yep the owner not the builder or the engine maker... As I said easier and less costly for the builder to install more money over the long haul for the owner. Any money he might have saved in alignments or re-packing stuffing boxes has been more than made up for, perhaps by a factor of 20 in just 7 seasons..

The big problem with saildrives is maintaining the proper cathodic balance of protection for the leg. When props are changed, seacocks added keel metal exposed, leg aluminum exposed due to failing paint etc. this all changes the cathodic protection balance and the protection needed for the leg also changes. To much protection can be just as bad as not enough and when most owners don't own a silver-silver reference cell or know how to use one even if they do then it becomes a real crap shoot.. Brackish, fresh or salt water will also require differing approaches to anode protection. When you own a sail drive you are forced to be come intimately aware of what, why and how corrosion problems exist and are exacerbated. If you don't want to become "aware" then a checkbook or credit card serves the same purpose..

They certainly have benefits, little prop walk and very smooth, but for me they just don't outweigh the potential negatives.

 

[njsail]

I've had both types and here's my two cents on both. I had an Island Packet 27 85' which had the standard shaft and packing gland arrangement. When the stern tube started to come loose I needed to get in there replace it. The only problem is it's near impossible to reach down into the bilge under the engine and get the angle needed to replace the stern hose. I had to have the engine pulled in order to reach the area I needed to work in. When I pulled the shaft it was scored badly and I also replaced a bunch of other stuff. The cost was more than the seal I just replaced on my sail drive. Granted some boats have great access to the shaft and stern and packing gland, etc...but many don't.

Before buying our Bavaria 40 Ocean I heard all the stories about sail drives and how they aren't as good as the old shaft arrangement but after just spending a lot of money and aggravation to fix that good old shaft arrangement I went all in to give it a try. every year I change the drive leg oil, the zinc and paint the leg with trilux. Our sail drive is now 11 or so years old and runs smooth and quite. This year I put on a kiwi-prop and absolutely love it. It really made a difference under sail in light wind. For now I'm a sail drive fan. That could change in a heartbeat with a major problem but isn't that the case with any mechanical system. The dry bilge is a nice perk too. Neither setup is perfect as Maine Sail mentioned but there are factors that affect each. If you can't easily reach something do you think it will be well maintained over the years? I pull my boat every year and have full access to maintain the sail drive inside and out. If I were cruising in remote areas or wasn't going to be pulling out every year I would prefer a shaft with great access to all the parts. Now everyone go sailing.

 

[Gunni]

I can't make sense of the Island Packet design logic. They sell the boat as a long distance owner - cruiser and yet they bury the tanks and system components under built-in structure. My marina neighbor's IP baffled fuel tank needs to come out for a thorough cleaning, and the only way to do that is tear out a bunch of furniture. Same with the holding tanks - built in.

My sense, from touring the boat show and talking to brokers is that the production builders know what their target buyer is looking at, and it isn't the mechanical systems. So they cut corners there to make the new boat price point. It may sell more new boats, but it makes buying used a much more treacherous situation. I bought my B411 because it was a well-sorted, late-run build, easily accessed systems, a normally aspirated Yanmar, and a dripless shaft drive. It is a great boat, fast, easy to sail, easy to work on, and likely the last Beneteau I own.