Honda EU2200i Companion - 16K Airconditioner

[Monterey385]

I was completely surprised (in a good way) today. I finally broke down and purchased a Honda EU2200i Companion generator. My primary motivation for this was to provide the ability to charge my battery bank while on a mooring using my Pronautic 12-30P charger instead of running my engine. It appears that I might be the beneficiary of Honda's increasing the upper limit on its 2K generators to 2.2K.

I fired up the generator and connected it to my main AC Dockside input using the 30Amp plug on the Companion. Without a second generator, the 30 Amp plug is rated for 15 Amps and 120 volts continuous (1800 watts). While the units maximum output is reported to be 2200 watts, the manual states that the 30 Amp plug is limited to 1800 watts unless it is combined with a second unit. Thus, I was expecting my Battery Charger to be limited to 15 Amps even though it can max at 30 Amps. The incoming voltage dropped to 90 volts and the Battery Charger went to 21 amps. I noted on the Promariner manual that there is a setting to reduce the maximum input to 25%, 50%, or 75% in cases of reduced incoming voltage. I need to check with Promariner in the morning to see if running the unit at lower than expected voltages will do harm or whether I should reduce it to 50% before I leave the dock on my trip.

Then the surprise. I knew my 16K Air Conditioner only drew 7.5 amps when running according to its specs but there was no surge rating. I fully expected to trip the breaker when the compressor kicked on. Didn't happen … the air conditioner ran great. The generator had to run at a higher RPM but the units ran great.

I need someone to burst my bubble and tell me what I may be doing wrong because this appears too good to be true. I sense that I need to find out what level of voltage is running into my Air Conditioner but it has a low voltage threshold at 85 volts and that didn't trip.

However, if I'm not doing anything wrong … the Honda EU2200i Companion has a new home on my boat. At 47 pounds its lighter than my kids' suitcases on vacation and easier to carry.

Go ahead … somebody mess up my good mood … please ...

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

It should work fine. Ours does too. Another success the 'expert' said couldn't be done.

 

[Monterey385]

It should work fine. Ours does too. Another success the 'expert' said couldn't be done.

Don -- I'm going with your optimism … so second question … we have CO monitors because having grown up with my dad owning service stations, CO scares the *&^% out of me. That said, have you determined a safe way to run the generator on a mooring and not risking CO poisoning or worse?

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

Don -- I'm going with your optimism … so second question … we have CO monitors because having grown up with my dad owning service stations, CO scares the *&^% out of me. That said, have you determined a safe way to run the generator on a mooring and not risking CO poisoning or worse?

I may not be the best person to ask as I always considered the gasoline people store for their outboard as more dangerous. I can't find a resonably price explosive meter but CO monitors are cheap.

Also, statistically, it's safer to run the generator than is the drive home from the marina.

 

[Davidasailor26]

Cool that it works for the air conditioner, but I'm surprised it bogged down so much with the battery charger. The generator amperage is rated at 120V AC, but the charger is rated at 12V DC. For the charger to push 30A at 12V is 360 watts, plus inefficiency losses. That should be well within the 1800 watt continuous generator capacity. It looks like the installation manual for the charger recommends a 10A fuse, again less than the generator capacity. I'm thinking you were getting 21A just because that's all the batteries could accept, but why would the voltage drop to 90V?

 

[Monterey385]

Cool that it works for the air conditioner, but I'm surprised it bogged down so much with the battery charger. The generator amperage is rated at 120V AC, but the charger is rated at 12V DC. For the charger to push 30A at 12V is 360 watts, plus inefficiency losses. That should be well within the 1800 watt continuous generator capacity. It looks like the installation manual for the charger recommends a 10A fuse, again less than the generator capacity. I'm thinking you were getting 21A just because that's all the batteries could accept, but why would the voltage drop to 90V?

Thanks !!! Duh moment ... You are right ... it’s DC Amps not AC amps. And as I have replayed my steps the system was putting out 100V before any load was applied. I am going to do a few more tests and ask Honda.

 

[Monterey385]

Quick update - just checked the generator directly with a multimeter … both outlets (the 20amp and 30amp) are putting out 127 volts at the outlet and at the end of an extension cord with no load. This weekend I will retest the unit with my dockside cords. The cords are delivering 120 volts from the power tower at the dock using the meter on my board so I don't think its the cord or the meter.

3 Dumb questions,

1. If 15 Amps (the output of the generator) is fed into a 30 amp cord, could the cord itself cause a voltage drop that would not occur if the 30 amp cord is fed 30 amps from the source?
2. If so, would I be better off connecting the boat using a 20amp to 30amp converter and using the 20amp plug on the generator?
3. Alternatively, would a 12ft 30 Amp cord work better than a 50ft 30 amp cord?

Thx

 

[JimInPB]

1. If 15 Amps (the output of the generator) is fed into a 30 amp cord, could the cord itself cause a voltage drop that would not occur if the 30 amp cord is fed 30 amps from the source?

A heavier cord will not cause a voltage drop on a 15 amp load.

3. Alternatively, would a 12ft 30 Amp cord work better than a 50ft 30 amp cord?

Shorter cords give slightly less voltage drop than longer ones do, but since the cord is oversized in terms of ampacity to begin with, I would be surprised to see a drop in excess of 5vac, if that much.

The wild card here, is that I don't know what that 30 amp outlet is wired to. If it is in parallel with the 15 amp outlet, then you will see no difference in performance drawing up to 15 amps from either outlet. If the 30 amp outlet is wired to a different circuit, then anything is possible. If this is the case, then I would expect that the owners manual would explain it.

As a rule, those briefcase generators are the quietest & most efficient thing out there. They claim to put out power that is clean enough to use with sensitive electronics. The down side to them is that they lack surge capacity. During Hurricane Irma, a friend of mine fried his while trying to run a window shaker air conditioner in his house. Unfortunately, I do not know the amp rating of that AC unit.

Also, please consider that if you are really putting out only 90vac, you may brown out your AC & damage the compressor motor.

Since those briefcase generators are based on inverter technology, they likely produce an approximated sign-wave, rather than a real one. Some digital meters may not read that correctly. You may want to also check your voltage with an old fashioned analog meter as a cross check, just to be certain that you are getting a good reading.

 

[LeslieTroyer]

@Monterey385 it’s impossible to know what cable would drop more voltage without knowing the size of the wire in each. Adding plug converters will make any drop worse. I really doubt the cable dropped 127V to 90V. Thats just a huge amount, and the cable would be smoking hot after just a little bit.

Les

 

[JimInPB]

Actually, lets do the math on the voltage drop. A 30 amp cord is most likely AWG #10. When I look up resistance of #10 wire, I see charts that list it between 1-1.25 ohms per 1,000 feet, depending on temperature. If the wire is hot (worst case scenario) & 100 feet long, then you would have 100*1.25/1000 = .125 ohms. E=I*R, so .125ohms*15 amps = 1.875 volts of drop from 100' of 30 amp wire carrying 15 amps.

A "15-amp" cord of the same length will give you a bigger voltage drop when carrying the same current

 

[Monterey385]

I concur … I don't think its the cord. it wasn't hot and it did not show any signs of compromised performance. I am very intrigued by the sine wave / digital meter thought … that makes a lot more sense to me … it is another "difference" between the power tower and the generator. The multimeter comes out again this weekend -

 

[Benny17441]

The 20A and the 30A receptacles just gives you the ability to use 3 different types of plugs. The has nothing to do with the output capacity of the generator which is around 15A maximum. A/C electricity as opposed to D/C electricity can travel long distances and loose very little so any of the available extensions and power cords would be fine to use. The power output is related to the RPM but the voltage should be constant. The generator must be in a good state of tune to be able to provide surge power when required. Yes use a reliable analog multimeter to test for voltage as it does not make sense that you can measure 127V at one time and 90V at another. Running electric motors at a reduced voltage can damage them but an electrical fixture such as a battery charger should suffer no adverse effects. The built in limit switches for input and load should adequately protect the unit. Running the A/C at higher RPM will reduce the running time to around 4 hours which means that you will have to get up in the middle of the night to refuel. There is a connector available to attach a 3 1/2 gallon fuel tank to the existing one gallon internal tank. It uses suction to keep the internal tank full at all times until the auxiliary tank is used up. Don't remember if Honda had the adapter or if it was a 3rd party. I once made my own but was a little hesitant about using it unattended for fear of a fuel leak.

 

[Monterey385]

Good news, I spoke with Honda and ProMariner today. Both gave me the same info. The voltmeters are providing an erroneous reading. I will confirm this weekend with a measurement directly at the breaker with a better multimeter. Apparently the Honda also has a Floating Neutral that has a tendency to confuse Reverse Polarity sensors but I'm not experiencing that symptom. So far so good.