I bought my 26S August 2007. Not knowing the history of the trailer brake maintenance, I want to replace the Brake Fluid, check the Brake Linnings, and Readjust the brakes before boating season starts up here. Here is the problem. The manual calls for SAE 70 Ri or 70 R3 brake fluid. I can not find it or any auto parts store including NAPA that has heard of it. I know what DOT 3,4,or 5 is, but not SAE 70 Ri or R3 is. ANY HELP would be appreciated. Got answers?? Thanks, Chuck owner of the "Last Chance"
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I bought my 26S August 2007. Not knowing the history of the trailer brake maintenance, I want to replace the Brake Fluid, check the Brake Linnings, and Readjust the brakes before boating season starts up here. Here is the problem. The manual calls for SAE 70 Ri or 70 R3 brake fluid. I can not find it or any auto parts store including NAPA that has heard of it. I know what DOT 3,4,or 5 is, but not SAE 70 Ri or R3 is. ANY HELP would be appreciated. Got answers?? Thanks, Chuck owner of the "Last Chance"
Dot 4?
looks like DOT4 ATE Super Gold Brake Fluid Affordable high performance brake fluid that has both a high dry boiling point (536 deg) and a high wet boiling point (392 deg), but without being excessively hygroscopic. SAE Specification J1703 (supersedes 70 R1 and 70 R3) and ISO 4925. Can be mixed with all fluids which fulfill these specifications and DOT 5.1. $17.99 per liter http://www.gmgracing.com/other_brakes.shtml (btw, I actually do use ATE Super blue in everything I own with brakes... smart guys use the gold one year and blue the next to see when system is flushed...) Ha! looky... http://www.ne-ts.com/mac/cc/cc-108page15-23.html
looks like DOT4 ATE Super Gold Brake Fluid Affordable high performance brake fluid that has both a high dry boiling point (536 deg) and a high wet boiling point (392 deg), but without being excessively hygroscopic. SAE Specification J1703 (supersedes 70 R1 and 70 R3) and ISO 4925. Can be mixed with all fluids which fulfill these specifications and DOT 5.1. $17.99 per liter http://www.gmgracing.com/other_brakes.shtml (btw, I actually do use ATE Super blue in everything I own with brakes... smart guys use the gold one year and blue the next to see when system is flushed...) Ha! looky... http://www.ne-ts.com/mac/cc/cc-108page15-23.html
Dot 4?
looks like DOT4 ATE Super Gold Brake Fluid Affordable high performance brake fluid that has both a high dry boiling point (536 deg) and a high wet boiling point (392 deg), but without being excessively hygroscopic. SAE Specification J1703 (supersedes 70 R1 and 70 R3) and ISO 4925. Can be mixed with all fluids which fulfill these specifications and DOT 5.1. $17.99 per liter http://www.gmgracing.com/other_brakes.shtml (btw, I actually do use ATE Super blue in everything I own with brakes... smart guys use the gold one year and blue the next to see when system is flushed...) Ha! looky... http://www.ne-ts.com/mac/cc/cc-108page15-23.html
looks like DOT4 ATE Super Gold Brake Fluid Affordable high performance brake fluid that has both a high dry boiling point (536 deg) and a high wet boiling point (392 deg), but without being excessively hygroscopic. SAE Specification J1703 (supersedes 70 R1 and 70 R3) and ISO 4925. Can be mixed with all fluids which fulfill these specifications and DOT 5.1. $17.99 per liter http://www.gmgracing.com/other_brakes.shtml (btw, I actually do use ATE Super blue in everything I own with brakes... smart guys use the gold one year and blue the next to see when system is flushed...) Ha! looky... http://www.ne-ts.com/mac/cc/cc-108page15-23.html
You Sure You
Timo42, From the Manual: BLEEDING THE BRAKE SYSTEM "Fill the system with SAE 70 R1 or 70 R3 heavy duty brake fuuid. ----" I can not find it anywhere. I am going to call MacGregore and the dealer in Seattle tomarrow. Tried today, but no answer on phone. Thanks, Chuck
Timo42, From the Manual: BLEEDING THE BRAKE SYSTEM "Fill the system with SAE 70 R1 or 70 R3 heavy duty brake fuuid. ----" I can not find it anywhere. I am going to call MacGregore and the dealer in Seattle tomarrow. Tried today, but no answer on phone. Thanks, Chuck
You Sure You
Timo42, From the Manual: BLEEDING THE BRAKE SYSTEM "Fill the system with SAE 70 R1 or 70 R3 heavy duty brake fuuid. ----" I can not find it anywhere. I am going to call MacGregore and the dealer in Seattle tomarrow. Tried today, but no answer on phone. Thanks, Chuck
Timo42, From the Manual: BLEEDING THE BRAKE SYSTEM "Fill the system with SAE 70 R1 or 70 R3 heavy duty brake fuuid. ----" I can not find it anywhere. I am going to call MacGregore and the dealer in Seattle tomarrow. Tried today, but no answer on phone. Thanks, Chuck
DOT4?
mrBill, Thanks for the info on DOT5.1. I have found that info, but can not find anything that say's SAE Specification J1703 supersedes 70 R1 and 70 R3, and ISO 4925. Also, the link you gave is the one I am quoting about SAE 70 R1 or 70 R3. Can you give me a link that give a new cross referance for 70 XXX? Thanks, Chuck
mrBill, Thanks for the info on DOT5.1. I have found that info, but can not find anything that say's SAE Specification J1703 supersedes 70 R1 and 70 R3, and ISO 4925. Also, the link you gave is the one I am quoting about SAE 70 R1 or 70 R3. Can you give me a link that give a new cross referance for 70 XXX? Thanks, Chuck
DOT4?
mrBill, Thanks for the info on DOT5.1. I have found that info, but can not find anything that say's SAE Specification J1703 supersedes 70 R1 and 70 R3, and ISO 4925. Also, the link you gave is the one I am quoting about SAE 70 R1 or 70 R3. Can you give me a link that give a new cross referance for 70 XXX? Thanks, Chuck
mrBill, Thanks for the info on DOT5.1. I have found that info, but can not find anything that say's SAE Specification J1703 supersedes 70 R1 and 70 R3, and ISO 4925. Also, the link you gave is the one I am quoting about SAE 70 R1 or 70 R3. Can you give me a link that give a new cross referance for 70 XXX? Thanks, Chuck
pretty sure you want DOT4 not silicone.
Ate Super blue, is dot4 what is dot5.1? oh, reading the gold fluid details... it mixes with all other types... yep, it does that. its like the LMA brake fluid, less hydroscopic. good stuff imho. http://www.amazon.com/Super-Blue-Racing-Brake-Fluid/dp/B0007SN6F6 pretty unusual to have silicone brake fluid, but maybe just maybe in a trailer.. heres what I'm reading: "Fill the system with SAE 70 Ri or 70 R3 heavy duty brake fluid." heavy duty brake fluid IS dot 4.. right? YMMV. http://www.ne-ts.com/mac/cc/cc-108page15-23.html BLEEDING THE BRAKE SYSTEM: Fill the system with SAE 70 Ri or 70 R3 heavy duty brake fluid. Install a rubber hose on the wheel cylinder bleeder valve. Have the loose end of the hose submerged in a glass container of brake fluid to observe bubbling. By loosening the bleeder screw on the wheel cylinder one turn, the system is open to the atmosphere. Pump the actuator with long steady strokes. The bleeding operation is complete when the bubbling stops. Be sure to close the bleeder screw securely. Repeat the bleeding operation at each wheel cylinder. During the bleeding process, replenish the brake fluid, so the fluid level does not fall below 1/2 full in the master cylinder reservoir. After bleeding is completed, refill the master cylinder and securely install the filler cap. Replace cloudy, dirty or watery brake fluid.
Ate Super blue, is dot4 what is dot5.1? oh, reading the gold fluid details... it mixes with all other types... yep, it does that. its like the LMA brake fluid, less hydroscopic. good stuff imho. http://www.amazon.com/Super-Blue-Racing-Brake-Fluid/dp/B0007SN6F6 pretty unusual to have silicone brake fluid, but maybe just maybe in a trailer.. heres what I'm reading: "Fill the system with SAE 70 Ri or 70 R3 heavy duty brake fluid." heavy duty brake fluid IS dot 4.. right? YMMV. http://www.ne-ts.com/mac/cc/cc-108page15-23.html BLEEDING THE BRAKE SYSTEM: Fill the system with SAE 70 Ri or 70 R3 heavy duty brake fluid. Install a rubber hose on the wheel cylinder bleeder valve. Have the loose end of the hose submerged in a glass container of brake fluid to observe bubbling. By loosening the bleeder screw on the wheel cylinder one turn, the system is open to the atmosphere. Pump the actuator with long steady strokes. The bleeding operation is complete when the bubbling stops. Be sure to close the bleeder screw securely. Repeat the bleeding operation at each wheel cylinder. During the bleeding process, replenish the brake fluid, so the fluid level does not fall below 1/2 full in the master cylinder reservoir. After bleeding is completed, refill the master cylinder and securely install the filler cap. Replace cloudy, dirty or watery brake fluid.
pretty sure you want DOT4 not silicone.
Ate Super blue, is dot4 what is dot5.1? oh, reading the gold fluid details... it mixes with all other types... yep, it does that. its like the LMA brake fluid, less hydroscopic. good stuff imho. http://www.amazon.com/Super-Blue-Racing-Brake-Fluid/dp/B0007SN6F6 pretty unusual to have silicone brake fluid, but maybe just maybe in a trailer.. heres what I'm reading: "Fill the system with SAE 70 Ri or 70 R3 heavy duty brake fluid." heavy duty brake fluid IS dot 4.. right? YMMV. http://www.ne-ts.com/mac/cc/cc-108page15-23.html BLEEDING THE BRAKE SYSTEM: Fill the system with SAE 70 Ri or 70 R3 heavy duty brake fluid. Install a rubber hose on the wheel cylinder bleeder valve. Have the loose end of the hose submerged in a glass container of brake fluid to observe bubbling. By loosening the bleeder screw on the wheel cylinder one turn, the system is open to the atmosphere. Pump the actuator with long steady strokes. The bleeding operation is complete when the bubbling stops. Be sure to close the bleeder screw securely. Repeat the bleeding operation at each wheel cylinder. During the bleeding process, replenish the brake fluid, so the fluid level does not fall below 1/2 full in the master cylinder reservoir. After bleeding is completed, refill the master cylinder and securely install the filler cap. Replace cloudy, dirty or watery brake fluid.
Ate Super blue, is dot4 what is dot5.1? oh, reading the gold fluid details... it mixes with all other types... yep, it does that. its like the LMA brake fluid, less hydroscopic. good stuff imho. http://www.amazon.com/Super-Blue-Racing-Brake-Fluid/dp/B0007SN6F6 pretty unusual to have silicone brake fluid, but maybe just maybe in a trailer.. heres what I'm reading: "Fill the system with SAE 70 Ri or 70 R3 heavy duty brake fluid." heavy duty brake fluid IS dot 4.. right? YMMV. http://www.ne-ts.com/mac/cc/cc-108page15-23.html BLEEDING THE BRAKE SYSTEM: Fill the system with SAE 70 Ri or 70 R3 heavy duty brake fluid. Install a rubber hose on the wheel cylinder bleeder valve. Have the loose end of the hose submerged in a glass container of brake fluid to observe bubbling. By loosening the bleeder screw on the wheel cylinder one turn, the system is open to the atmosphere. Pump the actuator with long steady strokes. The bleeding operation is complete when the bubbling stops. Be sure to close the bleeder screw securely. Repeat the bleeding operation at each wheel cylinder. During the bleeding process, replenish the brake fluid, so the fluid level does not fall below 1/2 full in the master cylinder reservoir. After bleeding is completed, refill the master cylinder and securely install the filler cap. Replace cloudy, dirty or watery brake fluid.
IMHO
It sounds like they recommend DOT3 fluid, I checked a surge brake mfg site and they call for DOT3, if you want to spend the extra money for Silicon, go for it but since the trailer will probably be near water briefly and the system is sealed, the difference may be unnoticeable. Tim
It sounds like they recommend DOT3 fluid, I checked a surge brake mfg site and they call for DOT3, if you want to spend the extra money for Silicon, go for it but since the trailer will probably be near water briefly and the system is sealed, the difference may be unnoticeable. Tim
IMHO
It sounds like they recommend DOT3 fluid, I checked a surge brake mfg site and they call for DOT3, if you want to spend the extra money for Silicon, go for it but since the trailer will probably be near water briefly and the system is sealed, the difference may be unnoticeable. Tim
It sounds like they recommend DOT3 fluid, I checked a surge brake mfg site and they call for DOT3, if you want to spend the extra money for Silicon, go for it but since the trailer will probably be near water briefly and the system is sealed, the difference may be unnoticeable. Tim
Thanks
At this time, I do not know what brake fluid I want to use. As I stated in my first post, I am trying to find out what SAE 70 R1,or 70 R3 is. It could be Dot 3 or something, but I don't want to quess if I don't have to. If I had to quess at something, I would go with DOT 5.1 which is borate ester based, thus its compatibility with DOT3 and DOT4. See info below. However, I will see what MacGregor had in mind when he wrote the manual. I will not go with a silicone base product. Thanks for all your inputs. POLYGLYCOL ETHER BASED FLUIDS Fluids containing Poly glycol ethers are regarded as DOT 3, 4, and DOT 5.1. These type fluids are hydroscopic meaning they have an ability to mix with water and still perform adequately. However, water will drastically reduce the boiling point of fluid. In a passenger car this is not an issue. In a racecar it is a major issue because as the boiling point decreases the performance ability of the fluid also decreases. Poly glycol type fluids are 2 times less compressible than silicone type fluids, even when heated. Less compressibility of brake fluid will increase pedal feel. Changing fluid on a regular basis will greatly increase the performance of the brake system. FLUID SPECIFICATIONS All brake fluids must meet federal standard #116. Under this standard is three Department of Transportation (DOT) minimal specifications for brake fluid. They are DOT 3, DOT 4, and DOT 5.1 (for fluids based with Polyalkylene Glycol Ether) and DOT 5 (for Silicone based fluids). MINIMAL boiling points for these specifications are as follows: Dry Boiling Point-Wet Boiling Point DOT 3 401ºF 284º F DOT 4 446º F 311º F DOT 5 500º F 356º F DOT 5.1 518ºF 375º F DOT3 is an aliphatic polyether. DOT4 is borate ester based. DOT5 is polydimethylsiloxane (silicone based). DOT5.1 is borate ester based, thus its compatibility with DOT3 and DOT4. DOT 5 is very different--it's silicone based, doesn't absorb water, isn't corrosive, is bad for some seals, is hard to bleed, and is not miscible with 3 or 4. Stay away from it--it needs a system designed for it. More information can be obtained from the following standards documents: DOT3: SAE J1703 DOT4: FMVSS 116; proposed SAE standard J1704 DOT5: SAE J1705 DOT5.1: No SAE spec
At this time, I do not know what brake fluid I want to use. As I stated in my first post, I am trying to find out what SAE 70 R1,or 70 R3 is. It could be Dot 3 or something, but I don't want to quess if I don't have to. If I had to quess at something, I would go with DOT 5.1 which is borate ester based, thus its compatibility with DOT3 and DOT4. See info below. However, I will see what MacGregor had in mind when he wrote the manual. I will not go with a silicone base product. Thanks for all your inputs. POLYGLYCOL ETHER BASED FLUIDS Fluids containing Poly glycol ethers are regarded as DOT 3, 4, and DOT 5.1. These type fluids are hydroscopic meaning they have an ability to mix with water and still perform adequately. However, water will drastically reduce the boiling point of fluid. In a passenger car this is not an issue. In a racecar it is a major issue because as the boiling point decreases the performance ability of the fluid also decreases. Poly glycol type fluids are 2 times less compressible than silicone type fluids, even when heated. Less compressibility of brake fluid will increase pedal feel. Changing fluid on a regular basis will greatly increase the performance of the brake system. FLUID SPECIFICATIONS All brake fluids must meet federal standard #116. Under this standard is three Department of Transportation (DOT) minimal specifications for brake fluid. They are DOT 3, DOT 4, and DOT 5.1 (for fluids based with Polyalkylene Glycol Ether) and DOT 5 (for Silicone based fluids). MINIMAL boiling points for these specifications are as follows: Dry Boiling Point-Wet Boiling Point DOT 3 401ºF 284º F DOT 4 446º F 311º F DOT 5 500º F 356º F DOT 5.1 518ºF 375º F DOT3 is an aliphatic polyether. DOT4 is borate ester based. DOT5 is polydimethylsiloxane (silicone based). DOT5.1 is borate ester based, thus its compatibility with DOT3 and DOT4. DOT 5 is very different--it's silicone based, doesn't absorb water, isn't corrosive, is bad for some seals, is hard to bleed, and is not miscible with 3 or 4. Stay away from it--it needs a system designed for it. More information can be obtained from the following standards documents: DOT3: SAE J1703 DOT4: FMVSS 116; proposed SAE standard J1704 DOT5: SAE J1705 DOT5.1: No SAE spec
Thanks
At this time, I do not know what brake fluid I want to use. As I stated in my first post, I am trying to find out what SAE 70 R1,or 70 R3 is. It could be Dot 3 or something, but I don't want to quess if I don't have to. If I had to quess at something, I would go with DOT 5.1 which is borate ester based, thus its compatibility with DOT3 and DOT4. See info below. However, I will see what MacGregor had in mind when he wrote the manual. I will not go with a silicone base product. Thanks for all your inputs. POLYGLYCOL ETHER BASED FLUIDS Fluids containing Poly glycol ethers are regarded as DOT 3, 4, and DOT 5.1. These type fluids are hydroscopic meaning they have an ability to mix with water and still perform adequately. However, water will drastically reduce the boiling point of fluid. In a passenger car this is not an issue. In a racecar it is a major issue because as the boiling point decreases the performance ability of the fluid also decreases. Poly glycol type fluids are 2 times less compressible than silicone type fluids, even when heated. Less compressibility of brake fluid will increase pedal feel. Changing fluid on a regular basis will greatly increase the performance of the brake system. FLUID SPECIFICATIONS All brake fluids must meet federal standard #116. Under this standard is three Department of Transportation (DOT) minimal specifications for brake fluid. They are DOT 3, DOT 4, and DOT 5.1 (for fluids based with Polyalkylene Glycol Ether) and DOT 5 (for Silicone based fluids). MINIMAL boiling points for these specifications are as follows: Dry Boiling Point-Wet Boiling Point DOT 3 401ºF 284º F DOT 4 446º F 311º F DOT 5 500º F 356º F DOT 5.1 518ºF 375º F DOT3 is an aliphatic polyether. DOT4 is borate ester based. DOT5 is polydimethylsiloxane (silicone based). DOT5.1 is borate ester based, thus its compatibility with DOT3 and DOT4. DOT 5 is very different--it's silicone based, doesn't absorb water, isn't corrosive, is bad for some seals, is hard to bleed, and is not miscible with 3 or 4. Stay away from it--it needs a system designed for it. More information can be obtained from the following standards documents: DOT3: SAE J1703 DOT4: FMVSS 116; proposed SAE standard J1704 DOT5: SAE J1705 DOT5.1: No SAE spec
At this time, I do not know what brake fluid I want to use. As I stated in my first post, I am trying to find out what SAE 70 R1,or 70 R3 is. It could be Dot 3 or something, but I don't want to quess if I don't have to. If I had to quess at something, I would go with DOT 5.1 which is borate ester based, thus its compatibility with DOT3 and DOT4. See info below. However, I will see what MacGregor had in mind when he wrote the manual. I will not go with a silicone base product. Thanks for all your inputs. POLYGLYCOL ETHER BASED FLUIDS Fluids containing Poly glycol ethers are regarded as DOT 3, 4, and DOT 5.1. These type fluids are hydroscopic meaning they have an ability to mix with water and still perform adequately. However, water will drastically reduce the boiling point of fluid. In a passenger car this is not an issue. In a racecar it is a major issue because as the boiling point decreases the performance ability of the fluid also decreases. Poly glycol type fluids are 2 times less compressible than silicone type fluids, even when heated. Less compressibility of brake fluid will increase pedal feel. Changing fluid on a regular basis will greatly increase the performance of the brake system. FLUID SPECIFICATIONS All brake fluids must meet federal standard #116. Under this standard is three Department of Transportation (DOT) minimal specifications for brake fluid. They are DOT 3, DOT 4, and DOT 5.1 (for fluids based with Polyalkylene Glycol Ether) and DOT 5 (for Silicone based fluids). MINIMAL boiling points for these specifications are as follows: Dry Boiling Point-Wet Boiling Point DOT 3 401ºF 284º F DOT 4 446º F 311º F DOT 5 500º F 356º F DOT 5.1 518ºF 375º F DOT3 is an aliphatic polyether. DOT4 is borate ester based. DOT5 is polydimethylsiloxane (silicone based). DOT5.1 is borate ester based, thus its compatibility with DOT3 and DOT4. DOT 5 is very different--it's silicone based, doesn't absorb water, isn't corrosive, is bad for some seals, is hard to bleed, and is not miscible with 3 or 4. Stay away from it--it needs a system designed for it. More information can be obtained from the following standards documents: DOT3: SAE J1703 DOT4: FMVSS 116; proposed SAE standard J1704 DOT5: SAE J1705 DOT5.1: No SAE spec
DOT 5.1
I had never heard of DOT 5.1! imagine that, hmm. guess I learned something new today! I did some auto racing many years ago, and used that ATE dot4 for the wet boiling point. its also less hydroscopic than some others. as you know, dot3 and dot4 are same, except dot4 is a little better. I've never hear of any problems mixing fluids, unless its dot5 (silicone). and I'm sure you'll flush the system (use a quart). I'd think whatever you decide will fine, as long as you flush once or twice a year. (do you have a hose bib tapped into the drum brakes? thats a nice thing to do, so you can flush them... if you are in salt water that is).
I had never heard of DOT 5.1! imagine that, hmm. guess I learned something new today! I did some auto racing many years ago, and used that ATE dot4 for the wet boiling point. its also less hydroscopic than some others. as you know, dot3 and dot4 are same, except dot4 is a little better. I've never hear of any problems mixing fluids, unless its dot5 (silicone). and I'm sure you'll flush the system (use a quart). I'd think whatever you decide will fine, as long as you flush once or twice a year. (do you have a hose bib tapped into the drum brakes? thats a nice thing to do, so you can flush them... if you are in salt water that is).
DOT 5.1
I had never heard of DOT 5.1! imagine that, hmm. guess I learned something new today! I did some auto racing many years ago, and used that ATE dot4 for the wet boiling point. its also less hydroscopic than some others. as you know, dot3 and dot4 are same, except dot4 is a little better. I've never hear of any problems mixing fluids, unless its dot5 (silicone). and I'm sure you'll flush the system (use a quart). I'd think whatever you decide will fine, as long as you flush once or twice a year. (do you have a hose bib tapped into the drum brakes? thats a nice thing to do, so you can flush them... if you are in salt water that is).
I had never heard of DOT 5.1! imagine that, hmm. guess I learned something new today! I did some auto racing many years ago, and used that ATE dot4 for the wet boiling point. its also less hydroscopic than some others. as you know, dot3 and dot4 are same, except dot4 is a little better. I've never hear of any problems mixing fluids, unless its dot5 (silicone). and I'm sure you'll flush the system (use a quart). I'd think whatever you decide will fine, as long as you flush once or twice a year. (do you have a hose bib tapped into the drum brakes? thats a nice thing to do, so you can flush them... if you are in salt water that is).
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