When I pump my forward head it comes straight out of the vent on the outside of the boat
The tank was emptied yesterday
I'm lost as to what this can be
The tank was emptied yesterday
I'm lost as to what this can be
Help! Forward head pumps straight to vent!
- Thread starter redunculous
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Couple of Questions
What about the aft head? Since they are both going to the same tank, I can't see it being an issue with the forward head. You had a problem emptying the tank before. Could this still be an issue? Does your pump out hose have a sight glass so that you can monitor the flow? Did you try adding fresh water to the holding tank to measure how much it will hold? Sorry for all the dumb questions, I'm just thinking through this in a check-sheet way. I suspect that for whatever reason, the tank's still full.When I pump my forward head it comes straight out of the vent on the outside of the boat
The tank was emptied yesterday
I'm lost as to what this can be
Full tank
Your tank is most assuredly full. Either it was NOT emptied yesterday after all, or you've filled it up again--which, if you've had guests aboard can happen quickly. How many gallons does it hold?
How did you try to empty the tank yesterday--dockside pumpout, or macerator pump?
\When I pump my forward head it comes straight out of the vent on the outside of the boat. The tank was emptied yesterday
I'm lost as to what this can be
Your tank is most assuredly full. Either it was NOT emptied yesterday after all, or you've filled it up again--which, if you've had guests aboard can happen quickly. How many gallons does it hold?
How did you try to empty the tank yesterday--dockside pumpout, or macerator pump?
hey redunclous
didn't you just re-plumb your tank and have some trouble with the aft head? I'm thinking you have some hoses connected less than correctly.
Does the aft head do the same thing?
didn't you just re-plumb your tank and have some trouble with the aft head? I'm thinking you have some hoses connected less than correctly.
Does the aft head do the same thing?
Apologies for taking so long to respond
I'm still investigating but I've had to head back to Iraq so its slow going
I had her pumped out dockside immediately after this
She still seems to fill and smell pretty quickly - not sure which comes first either
The macerator pumps as I added a small amount of food colouring to the water I put in the tank and watched it come out of the side
I'm pretty lost, I was wondering if its possible for the holding tank to have had so much crud in there for such a long period of time that its solidified but then I wonder how plausible that is.
I've also noticed that recently the forward head can smell incredibly rotten - not like sewage but definitely something that has rotten. I really want to say it only does this after a sail as well.
I am lost with this and its so frustrating, I go home, want to sail and cant due to this as the boat can completely stink inside AND out
Rick - will check the amount of water I can put it, I will time how long it takes my hose to fill a gallon bottle and then I can roughly work out the gallons its taking before it flows out the vent - thanks for the idea. The dockside pumpout did have a see through part but it was not exactly clear. I've never pumped my boat out before or any boat for that matter so I am not really sure how long its supposed to take with a full tank?
Bill - the aft head is plumbed correctly as it only has a fresh water in and a discharge hose out
I'm still investigating but I've had to head back to Iraq so its slow going
I had her pumped out dockside immediately after this
She still seems to fill and smell pretty quickly - not sure which comes first either
The macerator pumps as I added a small amount of food colouring to the water I put in the tank and watched it come out of the side
I'm pretty lost, I was wondering if its possible for the holding tank to have had so much crud in there for such a long period of time that its solidified but then I wonder how plausible that is.
I've also noticed that recently the forward head can smell incredibly rotten - not like sewage but definitely something that has rotten. I really want to say it only does this after a sail as well.
I am lost with this and its so frustrating, I go home, want to sail and cant due to this as the boat can completely stink inside AND out
Rick - will check the amount of water I can put it, I will time how long it takes my hose to fill a gallon bottle and then I can roughly work out the gallons its taking before it flows out the vent - thanks for the idea. The dockside pumpout did have a see through part but it was not exactly clear. I've never pumped my boat out before or any boat for that matter so I am not really sure how long its supposed to take with a full tank?
Bill - the aft head is plumbed correctly as it only has a fresh water in and a discharge hose out
I suspect that you're just filling up your tanks a lot faster than you think you are. You need a tank level indicator that lets you know how much is in the tank, not just when it's full, and we prob'ly should have a nice long chat about how to maintain and use your system. So send me an email and let's finally get you sorted out and odor free!
Meanwhile, contact Hunter to find how much your tanks are supposed to hold. If they can't tell you, apply the math skills needed to calculate the cubic inches, then divide by 231 to arrive at the approx volume in gallons.
Meanwhile, contact Hunter to find how much your tanks are supposed to hold. If they can't tell you, apply the math skills needed to calculate the cubic inches, then divide by 231 to arrive at the approx volume in gallons.
Thanks Peggy
I have someone working on the issue for me whilst I'm away.
He said yesterday that he pulled the macerator hose off the thru hull, stuck it in a bucket and ran it - nothing came out even though he is sure that there was water in the holding tank.
Hes going to lift the floor on the weekend and inspect the tank fittings and the macerator, at the same time I have asked him to replace all the hoses with trident 101 or 102 as per your recomendations. He also said that the vent line is 3/4 and that it is not even sanitation hose so thats going as well - any recomendations? I was also advised to place in a charcoal filter on the vent line so if you agree with that I will get it done.
I requested a quote from Triple M for a new tank just incase (there is a smell when you lift the seat by the nav station which is where the waste hoses all come through) and I have spoken to Ferriello about a tank monitor - if my aluminium holding tank is in good condition I will get it drilled and an internal monitor fitted!
Your book was shipped this morning as well as the new Compact Raritan head ($199 at defender) I have ordered to replace the forward jabsco so hopefully I will make some progress.
Greatly appreciate the e-mail offer and I will most likely send one when I get back
On a side note I also ordered the Pureayre with a garden pump system and will request the guy leave all the flooring up etc so I can spray it in all the right places.
Thank you so much again for all your help
I have someone working on the issue for me whilst I'm away.
He said yesterday that he pulled the macerator hose off the thru hull, stuck it in a bucket and ran it - nothing came out even though he is sure that there was water in the holding tank.
Hes going to lift the floor on the weekend and inspect the tank fittings and the macerator, at the same time I have asked him to replace all the hoses with trident 101 or 102 as per your recomendations. He also said that the vent line is 3/4 and that it is not even sanitation hose so thats going as well - any recomendations? I was also advised to place in a charcoal filter on the vent line so if you agree with that I will get it done.
I requested a quote from Triple M for a new tank just incase (there is a smell when you lift the seat by the nav station which is where the waste hoses all come through) and I have spoken to Ferriello about a tank monitor - if my aluminium holding tank is in good condition I will get it drilled and an internal monitor fitted!
Your book was shipped this morning as well as the new Compact Raritan head ($199 at defender) I have ordered to replace the forward jabsco so hopefully I will make some progress.
Greatly appreciate the e-mail offer and I will most likely send one when I get back
On a side note I also ordered the Pureayre with a garden pump system and will request the guy leave all the flooring up etc so I can spray it in all the right places.
Thank you so much again for all your help
NO filter in the vent line!
Filters only treat the symptoms, they don't cure the problem....in fact, they actually help to CREATE the problem. Search "vent line filter" in the HM forum for lots of discussion about this.
He said yesterday that he pulled the macerator hose off the thru hull, stuck it in a bucket and ran it - nothing came out even though he is sure that there was water in the holding tank.
Sounds like it needs a new impeller (if the person working on the system doesn't think that's the FIRST thing to check, he's not someone I'd want to pay to work on MY boat!). With your track record of problems emptying the tank, you're likely to go through a lot of impellers...so I'd replace it with an electric diaphragm pump that can run dry without harm. The SeaLand T-Series pump is the best by far. SeaLand Waste Discharge Pump
Although I think it's prob'ly a good idea to go ahead and replace the aluminum tank, I don't THINK you need to pay for a custom one-off tank from Triple M...I think we can find one that'll fit in the Ronco Plastics catalog..they have more than 400 to choose from. And, a Type I MSD (treatment device) might be an even better solution. We can talk about that when you return--or from Irag if you have Skype and some time to talk. However, the odor under the nav seat is most likely due to permeated hoses. In fact, except for replacing hoses and MAYBE the macerator pump, we really should talk before you do ANYthing...'cuz you're jumping at a lot of fixes that may not be the best fixes for the long run..so slow down and let's do it right the first time. It's so much cheaper and easier than doing things over.
Filters only treat the symptoms, they don't cure the problem....in fact, they actually help to CREATE the problem. Search "vent line filter" in the HM forum for lots of discussion about this.
He said yesterday that he pulled the macerator hose off the thru hull, stuck it in a bucket and ran it - nothing came out even though he is sure that there was water in the holding tank.
Sounds like it needs a new impeller (if the person working on the system doesn't think that's the FIRST thing to check, he's not someone I'd want to pay to work on MY boat!). With your track record of problems emptying the tank, you're likely to go through a lot of impellers...so I'd replace it with an electric diaphragm pump that can run dry without harm. The SeaLand T-Series pump is the best by far. SeaLand Waste Discharge Pump
Although I think it's prob'ly a good idea to go ahead and replace the aluminum tank, I don't THINK you need to pay for a custom one-off tank from Triple M...I think we can find one that'll fit in the Ronco Plastics catalog..they have more than 400 to choose from. And, a Type I MSD (treatment device) might be an even better solution. We can talk about that when you return--or from Irag if you have Skype and some time to talk. However, the odor under the nav seat is most likely due to permeated hoses. In fact, except for replacing hoses and MAYBE the macerator pump, we really should talk before you do ANYthing...'cuz you're jumping at a lot of fixes that may not be the best fixes for the long run..so slow down and let's do it right the first time. It's so much cheaper and easier than doing things over.
Hi Peggy
Thanks for the response
I do have skype, let me know the best way to send it to you
I e-mailed ronco a few days ago but got a delayed email back - I googled for another address and have re-sent. Hopefully they will come back to me and have done one before so have the measurements (however I do have the hunter measurements to hand)
A tank from triple M is rather expensive I must admit., I'd rather avoid replacing but if its at that stage then so be it.
With regards to the filter - noted and not happening now
The floor is going to be lifted over the weekend and the hoses are 100% going to replaced.
Just a query - does the vent hose have to be a sanitation hose?
Kind Regards
Guy
Thanks for the response
I do have skype, let me know the best way to send it to you
I e-mailed ronco a few days ago but got a delayed email back - I googled for another address and have re-sent. Hopefully they will come back to me and have done one before so have the measurements (however I do have the hunter measurements to hand)
A tank from triple M is rather expensive I must admit., I'd rather avoid replacing but if its at that stage then so be it.
With regards to the filter - noted and not happening now
The floor is going to be lifted over the weekend and the hoses are 100% going to replaced.
Just a query - does the vent hose have to be a sanitation hose?
Kind Regards
Guy
Just a query - does the vent hose have to be a sanitation hose?
Yes...and so should toilet intake hoses. But you can get away with Shields or Trident #148 for those.
As for Ronco...their marine catalog is at Ronco Plastics Marine Catalog It has all their drawings in it. Matching your drawing to one of 'em should keep you occupied most of the flight across the pond.
Send me an email (EMAIL, pls...not PM), and we'll figure out how to connect via voice...time zone differences and all that. Click on my name to the right of this post, then you'll see an option to send email or PM.
Yes...and so should toilet intake hoses. But you can get away with Shields or Trident #148 for those.
As for Ronco...their marine catalog is at Ronco Plastics Marine Catalog It has all their drawings in it. Matching your drawing to one of 'em should keep you occupied most of the flight across the pond.
Send me an email (EMAIL, pls...not PM), and we'll figure out how to connect via voice...time zone differences and all that. Click on my name to the right of this post, then you'll see an option to send email or PM.
Clear Vinyl Hose Can Also Colapse
Permeation is not the only issue. On my boat and one other I have seen, clear vinyl vents can simply pinch in the bends over time, leaving the tank with no effective vent. Vacuum rated hose, like the 148 suggested, will prevent that.
Permeation is not the only issue. On my boat and one other I have seen, clear vinyl vents can simply pinch in the bends over time, leaving the tank with no effective vent. Vacuum rated hose, like the 148 suggested, will prevent that.
The original tank on an H40.5 is an aluminum, 38 gallon tank that was a REALLY odd shape. When I had my 40.5, I like most of the other owners, ended up buying the tank from Triple M. It wasn’t the tank that was expensive, it was the shipping. Triple M sent the tank by U.S. Mail, as it was the cheapest way at the time. As I had a PO Box at the time, you should have seen the face of the person when the tank showed up at the Post Office. There is also a lag time in getting the tank, as it depends on the production schedule.
The original manufacturer was still in business and can provide the original style tank. Was a little cheaper, but aluminum tanks only last so long and it was a job I didn’t want to do twice. Never thought I’d end up buying another boat.
The original manufacturer was still in business and can provide the original style tank. Was a little cheaper, but aluminum tanks only last so long and it was a job I didn’t want to do twice. Never thought I’d end up buying another boat.
And I think the original manufacturer was Ezell, located in Florida:
http://www.ezellengineering.com/
http://www.ezellengineering.com/
The holding tank
So this is my holding tank
Looks like its been under pressure to bulge like it does in the photos.
Its going to be taken out and properly inspected today so I will know more.
Peggie, I initially thought the vent line might have been blocked up at some point - could this have caused that much pressure buildup to bulge the tank like it shows in the photos?
Also, please accept my apologies for spelling your name Peggy instead of Peggie, its been very rude of me.
On a lighter note, your book arrived yesterday and is safe in my girlfriends hands
Kind Regards
Redunc
So this is my holding tank
Looks like its been under pressure to bulge like it does in the photos.
Its going to be taken out and properly inspected today so I will know more.
Peggie, I initially thought the vent line might have been blocked up at some point - could this have caused that much pressure buildup to bulge the tank like it shows in the photos?
Also, please accept my apologies for spelling your name Peggy instead of Peggie, its been very rude of me.
On a lighter note, your book arrived yesterday and is safe in my girlfriends hands
Kind Regards
Redunc
Attachments
Peggie, when trying to email you I get the following error
Corrupted Content Error
The page you are trying to view cannot be shown because an error in the data transmission was detected.
The page you are trying to view cannot be shown because an error in the
data transmission was detected.Please contact the web site owners to inform them of this problem.
I will let sailboatowners know about the error
Corrupted Content Error
The page you are trying to view cannot be shown because an error in the data transmission was detected.
The page you are trying to view cannot be shown because an error in the
data transmission was detected.Please contact the web site owners to inform them of this problem.
I will let sailboatowners know about the error
Two of your email tries made it, so I have no idea why you're getting error messages.
So this is my holding tank...Looks like its been under pressure to bulge like it does in the photos.
I'd say it's been quite seriously pressurized!
Peggie, I initially thought the vent line might have been blocked up at some point - could this have caused that much pressure buildup to bulge the tank like it shows in the photos?
Absolutely! A blocked vent can create enough pressure in a tank to rupture even the thickest wall plastic or stainless tank. Aluminum tanks typically have relatively thin walls, so it doesn't take a lot of pressure to distort them. Apparently the pressure has been able to escape through the toilet...otherwise you or someone would have gotten a sewage bath when the pumpout cap was loosened.
Also, please accept my apologies for spelling your name Peggy instead of Peggie, its been very rude of me.
Not to worry...my mother never got it right either.
On a lighter note, your book arrived yesterday and is safe in my girlfriends hands
And she's gonna read it, right? :dance:
So this is my holding tank...Looks like its been under pressure to bulge like it does in the photos.
I'd say it's been quite seriously pressurized!
Peggie, I initially thought the vent line might have been blocked up at some point - could this have caused that much pressure buildup to bulge the tank like it shows in the photos?
Absolutely! A blocked vent can create enough pressure in a tank to rupture even the thickest wall plastic or stainless tank. Aluminum tanks typically have relatively thin walls, so it doesn't take a lot of pressure to distort them. Apparently the pressure has been able to escape through the toilet...otherwise you or someone would have gotten a sewage bath when the pumpout cap was loosened.
Also, please accept my apologies for spelling your name Peggy instead of Peggie, its been very rude of me.
Not to worry...my mother never got it right either.
On a lighter note, your book arrived yesterday and is safe in my girlfriends hands
And she's gonna read it, right? :dance:
If she wants the smells gone she will do
Should I have my tank pressure tested when it gets taken out? I wouldnt even know what pressure to test it at but I would love to be able to keep it and save some money.
I'll report back with some more pictures when its pulled out and it can be looked at properly
I guess thats why my old crappy jabsco was bubbling and flowing back in there - so glad I had it in there rather than a decent head!
Should I have my tank pressure tested when it gets taken out? I wouldnt even know what pressure to test it at but I would love to be able to keep it and save some money.
I'll report back with some more pictures when its pulled out and it can be looked at properly
I guess thats why my old crappy jabsco was bubbling and flowing back in there - so glad I had it in there rather than a decent head!
Mind you,
As long as its not corroded / leaking and I install a tank monitor on it whilst i have the opportunity I guess I should be ok.
As long as its not corroded / leaking and I install a tank monitor on it whilst i have the opportunity I guess I should be ok.
Nope...
There are only two kinds of metal holding tanks---those that leak and those that will leak. Labor is the majority of the cost of replacing a tank...if it's coming out anyway, now is the time to replace it with a good quality plastic tank, especially since the hoses are already being replaced it. Do it ALL at once...unless you want to just continually have problems.
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