Hello Dave. We took delivery of a new 260 last October down here in Western Australia. When we got it the forestay would not reach the bow and an extra shackle was used. Being a perfectionist I decided the rake was probably not correct so I set about re-rigging. My specific question is though how much bend should be in the mast. I tightened up the spreader shrouds fairly tight to get bend but I guess you have seen enough of these to tell me how many inches of bow there should be? This bend is for the mast alone prior to stepping!
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response
Mark; The first question is how much room is left in the upper shroud turnbuckles. If there is not much left, then loosen up to put the mast forward. The real test here I guess is do you have alot of weather helm and if so move it forward. Sometimes the forstay may be cut too short when it was fabricated and that is why I am asking a question first. I have found a slight bend to the back is fine and usuall about 4 inches from the back of the mast at the goose neck to a line from the top of the mast down with wieight. Let me know Crazy Dave Condon
Mark; The first question is how much room is left in the upper shroud turnbuckles. If there is not much left, then loosen up to put the mast forward. The real test here I guess is do you have alot of weather helm and if so move it forward. Sometimes the forstay may be cut too short when it was fabricated and that is why I am asking a question first. I have found a slight bend to the back is fine and usuall about 4 inches from the back of the mast at the goose neck to a line from the top of the mast down with wieight. Let me know Crazy Dave Condon
Mast Tension from Ray Bowles
Mark, You might what to check out Ray's procedure for tuning at this site. http://www.ayesail.net/sailing/MAST_TENSIONING_PROCEDURE.htm I just used it twice in the last month to redo my rig and will be going out this weekend to see how it is set. Jim S/V Java
Mark, You might what to check out Ray's procedure for tuning at this site. http://www.ayesail.net/sailing/MAST_TENSIONING_PROCEDURE.htm I just used it twice in the last month to redo my rig and will be going out this weekend to see how it is set. Jim S/V Java
Yes but?
The tension on the upper and lower shrouds is very inportant but thats not my question. I need to know how much bend should be in the mast prior to stepping. As I mentioned in my original post I put bend in the mast by winding up the spreader shroud turnbuckles. From memory in the manual the shroud is referred to as RD1. Now with RD1 loose and the mast lying on the ground there is no bend in the mast. However when the turnbuckle on RD1 is wound up, because the spreaders tend aft, the mast bends. So I need to know how much bend in the mast before standing it up? Thanks for staying with me on this one!
The tension on the upper and lower shrouds is very inportant but thats not my question. I need to know how much bend should be in the mast prior to stepping. As I mentioned in my original post I put bend in the mast by winding up the spreader shroud turnbuckles. From memory in the manual the shroud is referred to as RD1. Now with RD1 loose and the mast lying on the ground there is no bend in the mast. However when the turnbuckle on RD1 is wound up, because the spreaders tend aft, the mast bends. So I need to know how much bend in the mast before standing it up? Thanks for staying with me on this one!
respnes
Mark; I assume you are talking about the wires from the spreader tips going down and attaching to the mast about 7 feet up. I usually leave these alone until last. Intially, I will tune the mast when it is up. Once tuned, then I will hand tighten those wires tight only. The main purpose for those wires is to keep the mast from bending forwards. Once the mast is tuned, you do not need to retune it every time you lower/raise the mast. As for prebend, I usally have a gentle sloping of the mast backwards. Hopefully this ansers your question. Dave Condon
Mark; I assume you are talking about the wires from the spreader tips going down and attaching to the mast about 7 feet up. I usually leave these alone until last. Intially, I will tune the mast when it is up. Once tuned, then I will hand tighten those wires tight only. The main purpose for those wires is to keep the mast from bending forwards. Once the mast is tuned, you do not need to retune it every time you lower/raise the mast. As for prebend, I usally have a gentle sloping of the mast backwards. Hopefully this ansers your question. Dave Condon
Getting in deep
Hello Dave. You mentioned that the purpose of these wires? is to prevent the mast from bending forward and yet the spreaders are swept back thus any tension at all that is applied to these wires (?) will in fact push the centre of the mast forward.
Hello Dave. You mentioned that the purpose of these wires? is to prevent the mast from bending forward and yet the spreaders are swept back thus any tension at all that is applied to these wires (?) will in fact push the centre of the mast forward.
Mark, It sounds like your 260 is different than
my 26. All the rig tuning I did on it was done with the mast raised, without any regard to the resting values. Bend and rake are vastly different values. Our bend is about 2 inches max. Rake is approx 5 inches. 20 days left until we leave to find our 10 year boat. I plan on sharing that brew within 7 years. Ray S/V Speedy
my 26. All the rig tuning I did on it was done with the mast raised, without any regard to the resting values. Bend and rake are vastly different values. Our bend is about 2 inches max. Rake is approx 5 inches. 20 days left until we leave to find our 10 year boat. I plan on sharing that brew within 7 years. Ray S/V Speedy
Dave, I don't think I follow this.
Dave, I don't understand this description. "wires from the spreader tips going down and attaching to the mast about 7 feet up" Are you talking about the lower shrouds, which go from the mast just under the spreader bases down to the U-bolt at the gunwale? Or the upper shrouds, which start about 5 feet from the top of the mast, and go down through the spreader tips to the U-bolt at the gunwale? Are there 260's with shrouds different from this?
Dave, I don't understand this description. "wires from the spreader tips going down and attaching to the mast about 7 feet up" Are you talking about the lower shrouds, which go from the mast just under the spreader bases down to the U-bolt at the gunwale? Or the upper shrouds, which start about 5 feet from the top of the mast, and go down through the spreader tips to the U-bolt at the gunwale? Are there 260's with shrouds different from this?
O-oh
Sorry Tom & Ray but I seem to be confusing everyone so I might try to get it straight. Now the lower shrouds are connected to the mast just below the spreader and run down to the U bolt on port and starboard sides. Correct? The upper shrouds are connected to the mast above the spreader and of course run to the end of the spreader and then down to the chainplate for want of terms or to be more precise the U bolts on port and starboard sides. Correct? Where the upper shrouds attach to the spreader there is also another cable (on both sides) that extends down to the mast and terminates with a T ball in the mast about 5' up from the bottom. Correct? Now it is this cable that I have wound up (on each side)to achieve mast bend or pre bend. If I loosen these off whilst the mast is lying down the mast will naturally straighten. As I wind up the turnbuckles and put tension on these cables the mast begins to bend. Too much tension and you end up with a banana. So if I have explained that correctly what I would like to know is prior to stepping the mast how much pre-bend should be in the mast. As you all know you can add further bend when adjusting the upper and lower shrouds however I need to have the pre-bend set correctly. Few! That was hard work Ray I don't think there will be any beers left by the time you get here (just joking)
Sorry Tom & Ray but I seem to be confusing everyone so I might try to get it straight. Now the lower shrouds are connected to the mast just below the spreader and run down to the U bolt on port and starboard sides. Correct? The upper shrouds are connected to the mast above the spreader and of course run to the end of the spreader and then down to the chainplate for want of terms or to be more precise the U bolts on port and starboard sides. Correct? Where the upper shrouds attach to the spreader there is also another cable (on both sides) that extends down to the mast and terminates with a T ball in the mast about 5' up from the bottom. Correct? Now it is this cable that I have wound up (on each side)to achieve mast bend or pre bend. If I loosen these off whilst the mast is lying down the mast will naturally straighten. As I wind up the turnbuckles and put tension on these cables the mast begins to bend. Too much tension and you end up with a banana. So if I have explained that correctly what I would like to know is prior to stepping the mast how much pre-bend should be in the mast. As you all know you can add further bend when adjusting the upper and lower shrouds however I need to have the pre-bend set correctly. Few! That was hard work Ray I don't think there will be any beers left by the time you get here (just joking)
Picture Hope this helps
Here is the picture of the rigging from the H260 manual hope this helps. I also wonder what the tension should be on the RD1 wire? Its alittle tough standing on the latter with a loos guage to check the tension and what value it should be. Ray, I thought you were already on the way? Jim S/V Java
Here is the picture of the rigging from the H260 manual hope this helps. I also wonder what the tension should be on the RD1 wire? Its alittle tough standing on the latter with a loos guage to check the tension and what value it should be. Ray, I thought you were already on the way? Jim S/V Java
Attachments
See B&R Tuning URL...
Here is a URL for B&R Rig tunning, including the diagonals -- the stays from spreader tips to mast... http://www.hunterowners.com/ref/br.html
Here is a URL for B&R Rig tunning, including the diagonals -- the stays from spreader tips to mast... http://www.hunterowners.com/ref/br.html
Now I understand...
Sorry for the confusion. My 1995 H26 doesn't have the "RD1" as shown in Jim's post. I knew the shrouds were lighter wire on the 260, but I didn't know the rigging configuration had changed. Dave, does this change any of the advice you gave me on the phone?
Sorry for the confusion. My 1995 H26 doesn't have the "RD1" as shown in Jim's post. I knew the shrouds were lighter wire on the 260, but I didn't know the rigging configuration had changed. Dave, does this change any of the advice you gave me on the phone?
Me too. Indeed, the 260 mast has extra items not
included on the 26 mast. Mark, I think that the ability to set the bend with these wires could be alot of fun. Many more possibilities. Jim, we will leave Washington State no later than Aug. 9 and head east. The house will have closed out and "Speedy" will hopefully have been sold. If she doesn't sell then we'll keep her for our return and let the kids use her until then. I kind'a like the lady and we have the ability to store her in one of the barns thru the winters. Ray S/V Speedy
included on the 26 mast. Mark, I think that the ability to set the bend with these wires could be alot of fun. Many more possibilities. Jim, we will leave Washington State no later than Aug. 9 and head east. The house will have closed out and "Speedy" will hopefully have been sold. If she doesn't sell then we'll keep her for our return and let the kids use her until then. I kind'a like the lady and we have the ability to store her in one of the barns thru the winters. Ray S/V Speedy
Thanks Ray Tom & Jim
Thankyou all for staying with this one. So we now have a picture of the RD1. This is the one I have tightened up conciderably to put bend in the mast prior to standing the mast up. "BUT" I would like to know just how much bend. The link states 1% of height of mast above boom so unless anyone can advise otherwise I'll try that. I guess if I could get the sail maker to inspect it would help! This is a fantastic forum and discussion about topics like this are not only interesting but I hope will form long term friendships. Cheers and beers to you all. Mark
Thankyou all for staying with this one. So we now have a picture of the RD1. This is the one I have tightened up conciderably to put bend in the mast prior to standing the mast up. "BUT" I would like to know just how much bend. The link states 1% of height of mast above boom so unless anyone can advise otherwise I'll try that. I guess if I could get the sail maker to inspect it would help! This is a fantastic forum and discussion about topics like this are not only interesting but I hope will form long term friendships. Cheers and beers to you all. Mark
bend
I have heard 4" to 5" quite a few times, but it really depends on how you're sail was cut. Weather it has a tight or loose leach. More bend would tend to open up the top part of the leach, which is usually better in stronger winds or rolling seas. Lighter air would usually suggest the leach not open up as much, which you can induce with less bend. Hope that helps. Jeff Peltier
I have heard 4" to 5" quite a few times, but it really depends on how you're sail was cut. Weather it has a tight or loose leach. More bend would tend to open up the top part of the leach, which is usually better in stronger winds or rolling seas. Lighter air would usually suggest the leach not open up as much, which you can induce with less bend. Hope that helps. Jeff Peltier
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