My wife and self are in search for a sailboat. She has taken sailing courses and study hard on sailing and maintenace even took a course on engines, myself always have had a motor pushing my boats and have no clue when it comes to sailboats. We both feel that we don't want to spend more than $20,000 and feel that we want something that is built well even if its a much older boat. We both have no issues on working on something as long as its something worth while and actually feel we would enjoy it. So as I search and look at sailboats I am going to discuss them and would like all the feed back that I can get from everyone with knowledge on the boat or even if you no nothing about the boat some input on your thoughts. I am going to start with a Pacific Seacraft Flicka that I viewed yesterday. I loved the boat and the classic look but did not have an inclosed head Diesel did not run and was locked up and needed work that I felt would surpass boat value and then some. Tomorrow I will be viewing a Tartan 30 and posting pictures like I said please feel free to chime in and give me your thoughts. Thanks in advance for any input.
Help a Nubie find a boat
- Thread starter grtsct
- Start date
- Status
There are several outstanding sailboats in both your size and price range. All of my recommendations are boats which were built in the 1970s. The Yankee 30 is an excellent choice and very similar in design to the Tartan 30, which I also like, but it's better constructed. One of the best built boats is the C&C 27 & 30. Another is the Sabre 28 & 30. I own a Sabre 28. Personally, I like the looks and overall design of the Ericson 31, either the Cruising or Independence versions. I also prefer an Atomic 4 gasoline auxiliary rather than a diesel.
I guess I am biased - but Catalina 30 would get my vote. They are built well and has everything you need. I would pick a fin keel. Year would be 1984 an younger. Engine hours not more that 1500 and sails that do not need to be changed for another year or so.
http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1987/Catalina-30-MK-II-2472387/Cortez/FL/United-States
here is an example - see link above
Visit www.yachtworld.com and inter your specs.
http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1987/Catalina-30-MK-II-2472387/Cortez/FL/United-States
here is an example - see link above
Visit www.yachtworld.com and inter your specs.
Boats are defined by compromises. The boats for protected inland waters and those for offshore sailing vary widely in chareteristics so first define the anticipated type of sailing. (racing, coastal cruising, week end trips, day sailing, entertaining etc) Define the characteristics that would optimize a boat for the type of sailing and then make a list of "must have" followed by a list of "would like". An example of must have could be an inboard diesel while a would like could be a dodger. Make your "must have's" to be deal breakers and don't let price or availability a reason to settle for anything less as if it does'nt fit your sailing, you will not be happy. Do not be afraid to look outside of your area for that perfect fit. You could always have it trailered home or have a first adventure sailing her home. The object would be to find the boat with all yiur "must have" together with most of your "would like". If you quickloy find a boat that has everything, probably your list was not long enough. Good luck.
thanks for the input on the boats, Robert you mention you like the gas engine over the diesel any paticular reason?
my thinking on boats is that I want something buillt like a tank it maybe slow but I want thick fiberglass I would perfer full keel that was less than 3'6" draft and an inboard engine. I have heard bad stories about bolt on keels that the bolts rusted. But like I said before I know nothing about sailboats
$20,000 is alot of boat for a first sailboat and you said you don't know anything about sailboats. I would spend a few grand on a decent day sailor to make sure you really enjoy it. Just my opinion.
Don't worry about what others say regarding your budget. I am still on my first sail boat. Enjoy your boat and just be sure you know what you are getting into. Since you've owned motor boats before I'm sure you are familiar with the issues and costs surrounding ownership.
I've had an Atomic 4 since 1978 and it's the only gas engine I recommend. They have 4 cylinders versus two or three for a typical diesel engine in a 30 foot sailboat. Therefore, they run much smoother and quieter than a diesel. Every part for the Atomic 4 is available, even complete engines. They are easier to maintain and troubleshoot compared to a diesel. Plus they are less expensive to buy and maintain. Moyer Marine provides outstanding service and information regarding the Atomic 4: http://www.moyermarine.com
Thoughts
In your area, there will be Cals, Ericksons, O'Days, Islanders from that era. All will require you to retain a surveyor to closely examine the systems. Most over 28 feet will have inboards, most gasoline.
Enjoy! Let us know what you decide.
First, I'd pass on being married to a full keel. Most full keels are bolted anyway, so the same horror stories apply. 3.6" draft will be hard to come by. If you really need that, I'd be inclined to look at a swing keel like a Catalina 25, or a shoal draft like some Catalinas, Hunters and O'Days. You don't need a tank or slow. None of the production boats are going to fall apart on you and thicker does not (necessarily) equate with better. However, the 70's boats were generally overbuilt because there was less knowledge about long term FRP construction and CAD design, etc.
In your area, there will be Cals, Ericksons, O'Days, Islanders from that era. All will require you to retain a surveyor to closely examine the systems. Most over 28 feet will have inboards, most gasoline.
Enjoy! Let us know what you decide.
I'd start by asking yourself some questions to narrow the field.
Are you SURE sailing is something you want to do? If not you might try an inexpensive day sailer for a season or so. Boats in the 22 foot range from Catalina, Hunter and O'Day are plentiful and if you decide to move up or move out you can sell it for close to what you have in it. Or you may just decide to keep it. All these boats have a loyal following.
Do you want to day sail, stay out over night or explore the Bay for days at a time? Elbow room and live aboard comfort become increasingly important the more time you'll be aboard.
Do you want speed or comfort? Keep this in mind while looking. You can find a comfortable boat that doesn't sail like a pig. After all you're not sailing around the Horn you're sailing around the Bay.
Is there a particular dock, marina or area you want to sail out of? If so pick up a local chart and look at channel depths. A 3.5' draft is a pretty shallow draft and will definitely limit your choices.
If you're concerned about keel bolt corrosion I'd recommend having a surveyor look the boat over. Surveyors charge by the size/complexity of the boat. A day sailer will be less expensive than a 35' cruiser as there is less boat and there are less systems to inspect. I'm a pretty savy do-it-myself type but I've had both boats surveyed and it was worth it both times.
Two things to keep in mind. The only way to really check keel bolts (unless they're really bad off) is to drop the keel. But keep in mind keel failure is pretty rare.
Gas vs. Diesel? My preference is diesel for a live aboard cruiser. I think they're less complicated and safer than gas engines. My opinion. Others will disagree. On smaller boats you can't beat an outboard for efficiency. In either case I think it's more important to find a boat whose owner paid attention to proper maintenance.
What does your gut say? My experience is you kiss a lot of toads when you're boat shopping. My gut told me when I stepped on the right boat.
Remember to have fun! You're buying a boat.
Are you SURE sailing is something you want to do? If not you might try an inexpensive day sailer for a season or so. Boats in the 22 foot range from Catalina, Hunter and O'Day are plentiful and if you decide to move up or move out you can sell it for close to what you have in it. Or you may just decide to keep it. All these boats have a loyal following.
Do you want to day sail, stay out over night or explore the Bay for days at a time? Elbow room and live aboard comfort become increasingly important the more time you'll be aboard.
Do you want speed or comfort? Keep this in mind while looking. You can find a comfortable boat that doesn't sail like a pig. After all you're not sailing around the Horn you're sailing around the Bay.
Is there a particular dock, marina or area you want to sail out of? If so pick up a local chart and look at channel depths. A 3.5' draft is a pretty shallow draft and will definitely limit your choices.
If you're concerned about keel bolt corrosion I'd recommend having a surveyor look the boat over. Surveyors charge by the size/complexity of the boat. A day sailer will be less expensive than a 35' cruiser as there is less boat and there are less systems to inspect. I'm a pretty savy do-it-myself type but I've had both boats surveyed and it was worth it both times.
Two things to keep in mind. The only way to really check keel bolts (unless they're really bad off) is to drop the keel. But keep in mind keel failure is pretty rare.
Gas vs. Diesel? My preference is diesel for a live aboard cruiser. I think they're less complicated and safer than gas engines. My opinion. Others will disagree. On smaller boats you can't beat an outboard for efficiency. In either case I think it's more important to find a boat whose owner paid attention to proper maintenance.
What does your gut say? My experience is you kiss a lot of toads when you're boat shopping. My gut told me when I stepped on the right boat.
Remember to have fun! You're buying a boat.
All good advice. More tidbits: I would always insist on a "sea trial" with the current owner (or rep, broker, etc). Every boat has idiosyncrasies and this will help you in starting to learn about them. Additionally, it will prove to you that the boat is actual able and equipped (at least show you what is lacking). Also, I feel strongly that a boat should not smell awful. In fact that was the tipping point for me in both of my major purchases. A decent smelling boat (I'm talking about belowdecks) usually means a well cared for boat. It is normal to make an offer contingent upon a sea trial and survey and your acceptance of both with X amount of time. Yes the survey will cost you a few hundred, but on anything larger than a 25 footer I think it's essential. I also strongly agree with those above who recommend starting with a smaller, easier first boat (22-25 ft). In this size range you can even store and move them on a trailer, which can be very convenient...
Ok today I looked at the Tartan 30 it felt like it was a well made boat and the owner clearly has taken good care of her over the years. The engine ran great and any problems such as a soft spot on her deck and a problem with the port side chain plate had been repaired by a professional years ago and shows no signs of current issues. There really isn't much to complain about as far as the boat goes however it just didn't have that warm feeling (as my wife says). I loved the fact that the engine is located forward allowing great access also allowing for all that storage in the rear of the boat. I have not ruled this boat out by no means but still looking for right now. Here are some pics let me know what you think?
Tartan 30, ca 1970s, is one of the boats I recommended but the side galley version is not as popular as the aft galley. This boat looks very typical with numerous issues such as the condition of the engine, dated upholstery, fiberglass cracks, mismatched bow chocks, etc. I'd keep looking because this particular boat needs too much work and it's a buyer's market. But the Tartan 30 is a very good choice based on fundamentals: design, construction, popularity and price. The Yankee 30 is similar to the Tartan 30 and a higher quality boat.
Yeah after discussing the tartan 30 more with my wife we feel that it just isn't the right boat and are going to keep looking. I will be keeping an eye out for some other good boats for sale.
- Status