I have some electrical work to do on the boat and need some heat shrink tubing to seal the wires after I solder them. Where is a good place to buy heat shrink tubing? Thanks
- Status
We'll get it for you here.....
Let me know what size, color and quantity if we don't offer what you need here: http://shop.sailboatowners.com/detail.htm?fno=400&group=959&cat=3324 Dave Groshong Customer Service SailboatOwners.com dave@sailboatowners.com Toll Free 877-932-7245 ext.116, Mon-Fri, 9-5 Pacific.
Let me know what size, color and quantity if we don't offer what you need here: http://shop.sailboatowners.com/detail.htm?fno=400&group=959&cat=3324 Dave Groshong Customer Service SailboatOwners.com dave@sailboatowners.com Toll Free 877-932-7245 ext.116, Mon-Fri, 9-5 Pacific.
Soldering and Crimping
This subject has been debated here before, I am sure. Remember that advocates of crimping are just stating the MINIMUM requirements for a good connection. Soldering, and soldering with a crimp are both far superior to crimping alone. Also, the crimper and the stripper must have recent calibration to be of valid use, otherwise the crimped connection may be responsible for increased resistance up to causing a fire hazard. If you are competant and have the time, solder....
This subject has been debated here before, I am sure. Remember that advocates of crimping are just stating the MINIMUM requirements for a good connection. Soldering, and soldering with a crimp are both far superior to crimping alone. Also, the crimper and the stripper must have recent calibration to be of valid use, otherwise the crimped connection may be responsible for increased resistance up to causing a fire hazard. If you are competant and have the time, solder....
Soldering done by a ...
Competent technician, yes. That is correct. However, when one is faced with repairs and they are not at port, one is more apt to complete the repairs with crimp tools than with a soldering iron. I have in my communications career seen more blotched solder jobs by "competent technicians" than crimp jobs. Agree, there are argument on both sides of the table. However, in this discussion, it is best to weigh both coins and pick the one most likely to be the best solution for the time allotted. If given the choice to solder or crimp, my hand would reach for the crimp tool which would result in a quicker, a possibly more practical repair. To sum it up; to solder correctly takes a lot of experience. To solder poorly take 2 minutes.
Competent technician, yes. That is correct. However, when one is faced with repairs and they are not at port, one is more apt to complete the repairs with crimp tools than with a soldering iron. I have in my communications career seen more blotched solder jobs by "competent technicians" than crimp jobs. Agree, there are argument on both sides of the table. However, in this discussion, it is best to weigh both coins and pick the one most likely to be the best solution for the time allotted. If given the choice to solder or crimp, my hand would reach for the crimp tool which would result in a quicker, a possibly more practical repair. To sum it up; to solder correctly takes a lot of experience. To solder poorly take 2 minutes.
Using...
Using non-adhesive lined heat shrink tubing or the type available at Radio Shack, or most home centers, is next to useless for what you are trying to achieve. Non-adhesive lined tubing will only give you the strain relief benefit of heat shrink but not the waterproof factor. I have actually seen crimped connections in worse shape from the use of non-adhesive lined heat shrink than the same connection with no heat shrink at all because it tends to trap moisture as well as let it in. Tips for good electrical connections: 1) Use a high quality ratcheting crimper not one of the el-cheapo's that strips and crimps. A good crimper will pay for itself ten times over! 2) Use Anchor Marine or equal quality connectors only. Practical Sailor did a review of connectors a few years back and the cheap ones were just that cheap. The Anchor marine grade connectors were of a heavier metal (stronger crimp) and had a better coating to prevent corrosion (longer life). 3) Use ONLY adhesive lined heat shrink tubing! Never use plain old heat shrink unless all you want is strain relief! 4) Use a HEAT GUN not a blow torch to melt and shrink the tubing and DO take your time. Many times if you heat it to fast you'll shrink the tubing but not actually melt the adhesive especially when working with battery cables. Melting the adhesive is what makes it waterproof! 5) Avoid solder joints on a boat. Every expert on marine electrical systems is basically in agreement on this including the ABYC. Soldering makes a hard or stiff point in the wire that DOES NOT hold up well to flex, strain or vibrations. The solder (rosin core) also contains an acid that does not react well in the marine environment and may actually accelerate corrosion. The main reason the ABYC recommends against using solder as a connection is because of the potential for circuit over loading. If you over load the circuit the solder could melt resulting in a failure. 6) If you MUST solder first crimp the connector to the wire then flow the solder into it. With the advent of adhesive lined heat shrink, adding more mechanical strength, there should be no need to solder a properly crimped & heat shrunk marine connection. I have re-wired many, many boats and I've yet to see even a very good solder joint last as long, or be as reliable as a good crimped joint and I'm not talking about a crimp/adhesive lined heat shrink connection just a crimped connection on either tinned or un-tinned wire. I like this statement from a guy who was on the fence about this until he re-wired a Valiant that had many soldered connections done by a PO. Here's his quote: "I would like to tell anyone still soldering that almost without exception, EVERY soldered joint on the V-42 we have is corroding and failing. It may have taken close to 20 years to do it, but we did not find these issues on ANY of the crimped joints... NONE. If that is not a first hand testimonial to crimp over solder, I do not know what is." P.S. ABYC standards (E-11.16.3.7), “Solder shall not be the sole means of mechanical connection in any circuit” Not one high dollar, top shelf construction, yacht I've been on uses soldered connections! Oh and buy your adhesive lined heat shrink from Sailboat Owneres.com!!!
Using non-adhesive lined heat shrink tubing or the type available at Radio Shack, or most home centers, is next to useless for what you are trying to achieve. Non-adhesive lined tubing will only give you the strain relief benefit of heat shrink but not the waterproof factor. I have actually seen crimped connections in worse shape from the use of non-adhesive lined heat shrink than the same connection with no heat shrink at all because it tends to trap moisture as well as let it in. Tips for good electrical connections: 1) Use a high quality ratcheting crimper not one of the el-cheapo's that strips and crimps. A good crimper will pay for itself ten times over! 2) Use Anchor Marine or equal quality connectors only. Practical Sailor did a review of connectors a few years back and the cheap ones were just that cheap. The Anchor marine grade connectors were of a heavier metal (stronger crimp) and had a better coating to prevent corrosion (longer life). 3) Use ONLY adhesive lined heat shrink tubing! Never use plain old heat shrink unless all you want is strain relief! 4) Use a HEAT GUN not a blow torch to melt and shrink the tubing and DO take your time. Many times if you heat it to fast you'll shrink the tubing but not actually melt the adhesive especially when working with battery cables. Melting the adhesive is what makes it waterproof! 5) Avoid solder joints on a boat. Every expert on marine electrical systems is basically in agreement on this including the ABYC. Soldering makes a hard or stiff point in the wire that DOES NOT hold up well to flex, strain or vibrations. The solder (rosin core) also contains an acid that does not react well in the marine environment and may actually accelerate corrosion. The main reason the ABYC recommends against using solder as a connection is because of the potential for circuit over loading. If you over load the circuit the solder could melt resulting in a failure. 6) If you MUST solder first crimp the connector to the wire then flow the solder into it. With the advent of adhesive lined heat shrink, adding more mechanical strength, there should be no need to solder a properly crimped & heat shrunk marine connection. I have re-wired many, many boats and I've yet to see even a very good solder joint last as long, or be as reliable as a good crimped joint and I'm not talking about a crimp/adhesive lined heat shrink connection just a crimped connection on either tinned or un-tinned wire. I like this statement from a guy who was on the fence about this until he re-wired a Valiant that had many soldered connections done by a PO. Here's his quote: "I would like to tell anyone still soldering that almost without exception, EVERY soldered joint on the V-42 we have is corroding and failing. It may have taken close to 20 years to do it, but we did not find these issues on ANY of the crimped joints... NONE. If that is not a first hand testimonial to crimp over solder, I do not know what is." P.S. ABYC standards (E-11.16.3.7), “Solder shall not be the sole means of mechanical connection in any circuit” Not one high dollar, top shelf construction, yacht I've been on uses soldered connections! Oh and buy your adhesive lined heat shrink from Sailboat Owneres.com!!!
West Marine
I was told that the local West Marine carries what I need. I want to finish this project this weekend, so I will buy from them this time. I will stock up for future jobs from this site. It will be interesting to see what kind of kit this site puts together. Thank again everybody.
I was told that the local West Marine carries what I need. I want to finish this project this weekend, so I will buy from them this time. I will stock up for future jobs from this site. It will be interesting to see what kind of kit this site puts together. Thank again everybody.
Maine Sail
I went right out to the boat show to see the new top level boats that had no solder joints. I was prepared to be amazed by the newest technology that eliminates soldered joint. I was unable to find even one boat anywhere without soldered joints. Let me give you an example: Every VHF radio was soldered. Every auto pilot had soldered joints. Every item that had any kind of control board had- you guessed it- soldered joints. Now I know that you are an opponent of soldering connections, but could you please give an example of a boat that does not have soldered joints. I dismiss your concerns about the flux on solder- if you use rosin core solder you do not induce corrosion. One can easily determine the resistance of a joint, soldered, crimped or otherwise. With a little care, anyone can make a soldered joint that exceeds the current carrying capability of a crimped joint. Vibration should only be a concern with wires directly in contact with the engine, and all wire should be supported as well as relieved of strain. Consider that the typical solder joint seals the end of the wire strands, preventing moisture from wicking up into the wire insulation. By flowing the adhesive around the ends of a piece of shrink tubing on a soldered wire, you have encapsulated the internal wire, preventing the h2o intrusion. Soldering is definitely more time consuming. Here is my solution, considering that the ABYC standards are MINIMUM standards: crimp to hold in place, solder for connectivity, proper heat shrink application, support and strain relief. Please do not give up on solder, it is on every boat, car plane etc
I went right out to the boat show to see the new top level boats that had no solder joints. I was prepared to be amazed by the newest technology that eliminates soldered joint. I was unable to find even one boat anywhere without soldered joints. Let me give you an example: Every VHF radio was soldered. Every auto pilot had soldered joints. Every item that had any kind of control board had- you guessed it- soldered joints. Now I know that you are an opponent of soldering connections, but could you please give an example of a boat that does not have soldered joints. I dismiss your concerns about the flux on solder- if you use rosin core solder you do not induce corrosion. One can easily determine the resistance of a joint, soldered, crimped or otherwise. With a little care, anyone can make a soldered joint that exceeds the current carrying capability of a crimped joint. Vibration should only be a concern with wires directly in contact with the engine, and all wire should be supported as well as relieved of strain. Consider that the typical solder joint seals the end of the wire strands, preventing moisture from wicking up into the wire insulation. By flowing the adhesive around the ends of a piece of shrink tubing on a soldered wire, you have encapsulated the internal wire, preventing the h2o intrusion. Soldering is definitely more time consuming. Here is my solution, considering that the ABYC standards are MINIMUM standards: crimp to hold in place, solder for connectivity, proper heat shrink application, support and strain relief. Please do not give up on solder, it is on every boat, car plane etc
Maine sail, Soldered electrical connections must be mechanically
secure before the soldering is done. Wire is wrapped aroung the lug to form a secure mechanical connection then it is soldered. Shoving a wire into a crimp on connector is just plain bad practice. Lugs made for soldered connections are quite different from crimp on connectors. Properly crimped connections are adequate without solder as you have been stating. Properly made soldered connections are equal to properly made crimped connections but they aren't asembled in the same manner. After a fire all of the wire in a soldered assembly should still be in place just as it would be in an assembly with all crimped connections.
secure before the soldering is done. Wire is wrapped aroung the lug to form a secure mechanical connection then it is soldered. Shoving a wire into a crimp on connector is just plain bad practice. Lugs made for soldered connections are quite different from crimp on connectors. Properly crimped connections are adequate without solder as you have been stating. Properly made soldered connections are equal to properly made crimped connections but they aren't asembled in the same manner. After a fire all of the wire in a soldered assembly should still be in place just as it would be in an assembly with all crimped connections.
Ross
Quote: "Wire is wrapped around the lug to form a secure mechanical connection then it is soldered." Wrapping wire does not qualify as a mechanical connection per ABYC standards. Again, these are not my guidelines. I certainly hope folks know the difference between a solder-n-crimp type terminal (no insulation) and straight crimp terminals with blue, red or yellow insulation. I also hope they would know there are two different types of crimping tools one for uninsulated terminals (dimple style crimper) and one for insulated a ratcheting die style crimper.. Again if you must solder on a boat and want to do it to ABYC standars you must have a mechanical connection too.
Quote: "Wire is wrapped around the lug to form a secure mechanical connection then it is soldered." Wrapping wire does not qualify as a mechanical connection per ABYC standards. Again, these are not my guidelines. I certainly hope folks know the difference between a solder-n-crimp type terminal (no insulation) and straight crimp terminals with blue, red or yellow insulation. I also hope they would know there are two different types of crimping tools one for uninsulated terminals (dimple style crimper) and one for insulated a ratcheting die style crimper.. Again if you must solder on a boat and want to do it to ABYC standars you must have a mechanical connection too.
- Status