Curious to how many owners do their own repairs? From the simple (replacing a bulb), to mechanical (engine maintenance), to structural (interior replacements, blister repair, painting)
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I rebuilt my own
Hey Doug, I rebuilt my own hunter it was a basketcase. I got a '74 H-25that was left open to the weather for years and it still is a major project but I love boats and I am cheap so I decided to go this route. The other advantage I have is that I get the interior I want since I had to strip it bare to the hull.
Hey Doug, I rebuilt my own hunter it was a basketcase. I got a '74 H-25that was left open to the weather for years and it still is a major project but I love boats and I am cheap so I decided to go this route. The other advantage I have is that I get the interior I want since I had to strip it bare to the hull.
Examples of Self Repairs and Maintenance
I do a significant amount of repairs myself, especially with my previous boats. I reupholstered much of the interior headliner, and some interior woodwork, replaced thru-hulls, rewired battery and electrical systems and rebedded deck mounted hardware. Installed new engine and engine control panel, and repainted the bootstripe. On my new boat I have done electrical perairs, I replaced the tanks sending units on the water and fuel tank gauges. I do all my own routine maintenance like oil and filter changes, transmission oil changes, fuel system maintenance, fuel filter changes, battery maintenance and level checks and electrical system performance checks. I have done lots of teak refinishing and have done bottom paint several times on my first boat. On my first boat I removed the keel and ground and sanded it smooth and refinished it with epoxy. On my present and previous boats I installed additional batteries and the associated wiring using Ancor high quality battery cable and terminal lugs which I assembled myself. I replaced the water pump for the sink and showers which failed under warranty and installed a thru-hull in preparation for installing a new central air conditioning system myself. I fabricated a hardwood laminated engine mount for my dingy motor to mount it on the stern rail. I repaired and tested VHF marine radios and replaced antennas and cable on previous boats. I don't think I would tackle cosmetic gelcoat repairs or blister / structural, hull fiberglass repairs myself although I think I could do it I rely on the professionals for this work as it will look much prettier and they usually have much more experience. I also leave the sewing and cushion type upholstery work and canvas work to the professionals although I picked out the fabrics, purchased the foam rubber and cut it to shape. Is this what you were asking about?
I do a significant amount of repairs myself, especially with my previous boats. I reupholstered much of the interior headliner, and some interior woodwork, replaced thru-hulls, rewired battery and electrical systems and rebedded deck mounted hardware. Installed new engine and engine control panel, and repainted the bootstripe. On my new boat I have done electrical perairs, I replaced the tanks sending units on the water and fuel tank gauges. I do all my own routine maintenance like oil and filter changes, transmission oil changes, fuel system maintenance, fuel filter changes, battery maintenance and level checks and electrical system performance checks. I have done lots of teak refinishing and have done bottom paint several times on my first boat. On my first boat I removed the keel and ground and sanded it smooth and refinished it with epoxy. On my present and previous boats I installed additional batteries and the associated wiring using Ancor high quality battery cable and terminal lugs which I assembled myself. I replaced the water pump for the sink and showers which failed under warranty and installed a thru-hull in preparation for installing a new central air conditioning system myself. I fabricated a hardwood laminated engine mount for my dingy motor to mount it on the stern rail. I repaired and tested VHF marine radios and replaced antennas and cable on previous boats. I don't think I would tackle cosmetic gelcoat repairs or blister / structural, hull fiberglass repairs myself although I think I could do it I rely on the professionals for this work as it will look much prettier and they usually have much more experience. I also leave the sewing and cushion type upholstery work and canvas work to the professionals although I picked out the fabrics, purchased the foam rubber and cut it to shape. Is this what you were asking about?
Rag men are a weee bit thrifty, laddy
Most sailboat people, men & women, have a scottmen in their family tree, cause we are a wee bit tight to shelling out big bucks, for a proffesional, that we can do ourselves, maybe it's because we rely on the wind, that God has supplied us, freely, to move us, and that most of us have a small simple engine, we can attack, or maybe it's because we've seen what those professionals do, and the level or limitations of their work, we decide to handle it ourselves, from bilges, to teak trim, man or woman, sweaty and grimy, do it, it's a love thing, either you have it or you don't, if you don't , then you better have lots of money, to pay for it.
Most sailboat people, men & women, have a scottmen in their family tree, cause we are a wee bit tight to shelling out big bucks, for a proffesional, that we can do ourselves, maybe it's because we rely on the wind, that God has supplied us, freely, to move us, and that most of us have a small simple engine, we can attack, or maybe it's because we've seen what those professionals do, and the level or limitations of their work, we decide to handle it ourselves, from bilges, to teak trim, man or woman, sweaty and grimy, do it, it's a love thing, either you have it or you don't, if you don't , then you better have lots of money, to pay for it.
Necessity is the mother of invention
Simple answer: I do absolutely EVERYTHING on my boat. There is nothing a repairmen can do that you cannot do if you are motivated to learn. They had to learn somewhere along the line, and so can we.
Simple answer: I do absolutely EVERYTHING on my boat. There is nothing a repairmen can do that you cannot do if you are motivated to learn. They had to learn somewhere along the line, and so can we.
isn't that part of owning a boat?
I completely restored my 1980 H33 (all electrical, plumbing, new electronics, updated systems, batteries, and of course, varnish) and now enjoy doing a lot of the upgrades on my new H410 (solar panels/battery monitor wiring, profane sniffer, WEMA gauge replacements, additional battery). How can you own a sailboat and not be at least partially into doing repairs, etc? It's that darn pride of ownership thing again! /c s/v Twilight, H410
I completely restored my 1980 H33 (all electrical, plumbing, new electronics, updated systems, batteries, and of course, varnish) and now enjoy doing a lot of the upgrades on my new H410 (solar panels/battery monitor wiring, profane sniffer, WEMA gauge replacements, additional battery). How can you own a sailboat and not be at least partially into doing repairs, etc? It's that darn pride of ownership thing again! /c s/v Twilight, H410
Another rebuild
I'm also in the process of rebuilding a basket case Hunter 25. Completed the hull and deck last year, about three weeks of work (I hope) to complete interior. Launched after July 4 last year and restoration work stopped. It was time to sail. Should be one of the first boats in the water this year. Worst job, replacing balsa deck coring from inside the boat. West System bonds to hair and skin very well.
I'm also in the process of rebuilding a basket case Hunter 25. Completed the hull and deck last year, about three weeks of work (I hope) to complete interior. Launched after July 4 last year and restoration work stopped. It was time to sail. Should be one of the first boats in the water this year. Worst job, replacing balsa deck coring from inside the boat. West System bonds to hair and skin very well.
a different perspective
A job that takes a boatyard one hour will take me at least twice that amount of time. In those two hours I could earn a lot more money at my own profession than I will end up paying the yard. (Being a writer, I don't bill by the hour, but bill by the page, hence the fudge factor: some days I make a lot more per hour than the local yards charge, and some days I sit and stare at the word processor, thinking that I'd rather be sailing.) Anyway, time is more precious to me than money, and I'd much rather spend my weekends out cruising than torturing my boat with a wrench. These days I hire a mechanic even to change the oil in the diesel. My only caveat in saying this is that i think it's important for cruisers to understand their boat's systems, which means that we should all get our hands dirty once in a while.
A job that takes a boatyard one hour will take me at least twice that amount of time. In those two hours I could earn a lot more money at my own profession than I will end up paying the yard. (Being a writer, I don't bill by the hour, but bill by the page, hence the fudge factor: some days I make a lot more per hour than the local yards charge, and some days I sit and stare at the word processor, thinking that I'd rather be sailing.) Anyway, time is more precious to me than money, and I'd much rather spend my weekends out cruising than torturing my boat with a wrench. These days I hire a mechanic even to change the oil in the diesel. My only caveat in saying this is that i think it's important for cruisers to understand their boat's systems, which means that we should all get our hands dirty once in a while.
I'm never sure of that calculation
The calculation that pits the owner's time against a mechanic's time is never as simple as it first seems. Let's begin with the easy part. The owner in this example is a computer consultant who earns $120/hr. The yard charge for mechanic's time is $48/hr. The mechanic, to his chagrin, gets paid less than half that. So we have a simple 5:2 ratio, right? Well, not quite. The owner pays for the mechanic's time with after tax money, and in this example, the owner is in the 39% bracket, so now the ratio is 3:2. That's close enough to even that many owners would choose to do the job themself. The owner prefers to work on his boat for two hours, than to work on software for three, especially since he already spends too little time doing the former and too much doing the latter. Then there is the matter of efficiency. What takes the owner four hours, the mechanic can do in two. Of course, the owner must still invest the time to explain the problem, discuss the solution, wait for the yard manager, and pay his bill. That kind of time is so painful, it should count double or triple. My perception is also that repairs by professional mechanics tend to use more new parts than those done by owners. There goes more money. Of course, when the owner does his own repairs, he has to drive out to West Marine for the parts. West Marine charges a pretty premium, and while there, the owner purchases a neat fandangle he would not have purchased otherwise. Bottom line? Beats me. I do many things myself, and pay for others. More than deciding on the basis of a financial calculation is hard to bring to close, I tend to do the things I want to do, and pay for the things that are the most messy and least fun. John Farnsworth is right, of course, that sailors should understand their boats' systems. Beyond that, we all try to maximize our pleasure within the limits of our budget.
The calculation that pits the owner's time against a mechanic's time is never as simple as it first seems. Let's begin with the easy part. The owner in this example is a computer consultant who earns $120/hr. The yard charge for mechanic's time is $48/hr. The mechanic, to his chagrin, gets paid less than half that. So we have a simple 5:2 ratio, right? Well, not quite. The owner pays for the mechanic's time with after tax money, and in this example, the owner is in the 39% bracket, so now the ratio is 3:2. That's close enough to even that many owners would choose to do the job themself. The owner prefers to work on his boat for two hours, than to work on software for three, especially since he already spends too little time doing the former and too much doing the latter. Then there is the matter of efficiency. What takes the owner four hours, the mechanic can do in two. Of course, the owner must still invest the time to explain the problem, discuss the solution, wait for the yard manager, and pay his bill. That kind of time is so painful, it should count double or triple. My perception is also that repairs by professional mechanics tend to use more new parts than those done by owners. There goes more money. Of course, when the owner does his own repairs, he has to drive out to West Marine for the parts. West Marine charges a pretty premium, and while there, the owner purchases a neat fandangle he would not have purchased otherwise. Bottom line? Beats me. I do many things myself, and pay for others. More than deciding on the basis of a financial calculation is hard to bring to close, I tend to do the things I want to do, and pay for the things that are the most messy and least fun. John Farnsworth is right, of course, that sailors should understand their boats' systems. Beyond that, we all try to maximize our pleasure within the limits of our budget.
Do What I Can....Legally
In my area, there are certain "projects" that cannot be done by one's self. Bottom jobs, for example, must be done in a yard with approved EPA filtration and recycling system. You are more than welcome to do the botoom job yourself if you can get the 31-footer into your garage where nobody can see you work on it.
Due to other major implications of "operator error" many marinas have clauses in their contracts that state certain types of repairs on the vessel must be performed by a certified marine mechanic. Things such as complete fuel system removal and re-installation must be performed by professionals due again to the environmental consequences of some moron that doesn't know what he's doing dumping 20 gals of diesel into the freshwater reservoir the city uses for drinking. (Diesel really clogs up the filtration systems, ya know.) Other than those types of things, I do everything possible. I do, however, invite over my diesel-mechanic-buddy to show me something I'm not familiar with or my been-around-boats-since-the-Mayflower-buddy that can provide all sorts of advice I can choose to ignore if I feel like it. Advice taken or not it still only costs me a beer or two. There are a couple of issues with "time vs. money." I am still trying to schedule time to completely reinstall the freshwater compartment cover on my H31. Been trying to get to that for about 6 months now to no avail. Yes, I need it redone. No, it's not critical. Yes, I want to do it myself. No, I haven't gotten a quote to see what'll it'll cost to have done. I don't know, if I'll ever get to it.
In my area, there are certain "projects" that cannot be done by one's self. Bottom jobs, for example, must be done in a yard with approved EPA filtration and recycling system. You are more than welcome to do the botoom job yourself if you can get the 31-footer into your garage where nobody can see you work on it.
Due to other major implications of "operator error" many marinas have clauses in their contracts that state certain types of repairs on the vessel must be performed by a certified marine mechanic. Things such as complete fuel system removal and re-installation must be performed by professionals due again to the environmental consequences of some moron that doesn't know what he's doing dumping 20 gals of diesel into the freshwater reservoir the city uses for drinking. (Diesel really clogs up the filtration systems, ya know.) Other than those types of things, I do everything possible. I do, however, invite over my diesel-mechanic-buddy to show me something I'm not familiar with or my been-around-boats-since-the-Mayflower-buddy that can provide all sorts of advice I can choose to ignore if I feel like it. Advice taken or not it still only costs me a beer or two. There are a couple of issues with "time vs. money." I am still trying to schedule time to completely reinstall the freshwater compartment cover on my H31. Been trying to get to that for about 6 months now to no avail. Yes, I need it redone. No, it's not critical. Yes, I want to do it myself. No, I haven't gotten a quote to see what'll it'll cost to have done. I don't know, if I'll ever get to it.Been there's calculation is oversimplified
Both Been There and John F raise good points, but I think a point raised in John's message is the best one - it's not just a question of pure economics, it's a question of having better things to do, like sailing. Just like Been There, I have a tendency to do those tasks which I enjoy or otherwise want to do. Some are large projects, some are small projects. Before starting on a project, however, I think about what other demands I have on my time and what things I would rather be doing. Those questions generally lead me to give the boatyard more work. But then, it's the same analysis I go through when deciding what to do and what to hire out around the home (yes, I pay a landscaper to cut my grass every week and rake the leaves in the fall). In addition to a 60+ hour typical work week, I coach soccer in the spring and fall for at least one of my kids. In the past, I've also coached baseball ans winter (indoor) soccer. I'm also an official in my daughter's swim leagues (winter and summer). Plus there's the maintenance and other chores that come with home ownership. While I enjoy the personal satisfaction that comes with successfully completing a project on the boat, most of the time I prefer to sail or spend time with my kids and I find that's it's worth the $68 per hour the yard charges to let me do that.
Both Been There and John F raise good points, but I think a point raised in John's message is the best one - it's not just a question of pure economics, it's a question of having better things to do, like sailing. Just like Been There, I have a tendency to do those tasks which I enjoy or otherwise want to do. Some are large projects, some are small projects. Before starting on a project, however, I think about what other demands I have on my time and what things I would rather be doing. Those questions generally lead me to give the boatyard more work. But then, it's the same analysis I go through when deciding what to do and what to hire out around the home (yes, I pay a landscaper to cut my grass every week and rake the leaves in the fall). In addition to a 60+ hour typical work week, I coach soccer in the spring and fall for at least one of my kids. In the past, I've also coached baseball ans winter (indoor) soccer. I'm also an official in my daughter's swim leagues (winter and summer). Plus there's the maintenance and other chores that come with home ownership. While I enjoy the personal satisfaction that comes with successfully completing a project on the boat, most of the time I prefer to sail or spend time with my kids and I find that's it's worth the $68 per hour the yard charges to let me do that.
everything...
and not just because its cheaper. The quality of the work I've paid for has usually been questionable. Paying more or going somewhere with a "great reputation" doesn't help; they all seem to hire the lowest priced unskilled seasonal labor. Independents are sometimes better; at least some are guarding their reputations. I'm no great craftsman, but I know its my butt going to sea in the thing. The best defense is self sufficiency.
and not just because its cheaper. The quality of the work I've paid for has usually been questionable. Paying more or going somewhere with a "great reputation" doesn't help; they all seem to hire the lowest priced unskilled seasonal labor. Independents are sometimes better; at least some are guarding their reputations. I'm no great craftsman, but I know its my butt going to sea in the thing. The best defense is self sufficiency.
Do it all
When there isn't any alternative as is the case here, one either does it or it doesn't get done: from changing oil, hull nick repairs, lubricating the furler to hauling in the fall and dropping the 340 in the water in the spring. Last year it was installing the Maxi prop, and replacing the holding tank sensor. This year its the drippless packing and the prop saver. The year before it was the 10 cd deck. Periodic bottom painting and replacing halyards is also a norm.
When there isn't any alternative as is the case here, one either does it or it doesn't get done: from changing oil, hull nick repairs, lubricating the furler to hauling in the fall and dropping the 340 in the water in the spring. Last year it was installing the Maxi prop, and replacing the holding tank sensor. This year its the drippless packing and the prop saver. The year before it was the 10 cd deck. Periodic bottom painting and replacing halyards is also a norm.
do it right
Do the things that you can do or learn to do. If you cant do it right dont do it, pay to have it done. It can get expensive to have someone fix your mess ups
Do the things that you can do or learn to do. If you cant do it right dont do it, pay to have it done. It can get expensive to have someone fix your mess ups
Sums it up
So it seems the majority of us "get our hands dirty". I agree with Tom M that "rag men are a wee bit thrifty". We all have different financial means but we have the love of sail in common. Would I do the repairs on my vessel if I could easily afford to have someone else do them? Would I have purchased a ten year old boat instead of a new one? I enjoy working on my boat - it brings one closer to the spirit of their vessel.
So it seems the majority of us "get our hands dirty". I agree with Tom M that "rag men are a wee bit thrifty". We all have different financial means but we have the love of sail in common. Would I do the repairs on my vessel if I could easily afford to have someone else do them? Would I have purchased a ten year old boat instead of a new one? I enjoy working on my boat - it brings one closer to the spirit of their vessel.
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