Guidance

[Berkay]

Good afternoon everybody,
A quick briefing on my goal, I'm a 25 year old looking to get involved in the ownership and operation of a sailboat. My only issue is that as much as I always wanted to grow up on the water I never had the opportunity, therefore I lack knowledge on a majority of the aspects of boating ownership, boating in general and the details.
Before investing in a actual sailboat I wanted to learn the ins and out of maintence, costs, transport, brands, etc. I was looking for guidance on any sources of information whether it be books, YouTube channels, other forums, a thread/topic here on SBO. I looked into sailing classes by me that I have been debating taking, I don't know how it is with the current pandemic, but don't know if it is worth investing the money or not.
I do see that this forum is mainly with experienced sailors and I hope I don't come off to clueless and waste your time. Any guidance to things I can be reading, doing or studying that will help me in the long run when I finally buy my first boat will be much appreciated. As for buying a boat, any recommendations on brands for either a beginner or just a quality smaller sailboat in general?
Thank you for your time.

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

There are lots of books although ‘doing’ beats reading about it every time. Find a local boat club and inquire there about crewing or lessons - most have schools. Also, the CG Auxiliary has boating classes for beginners although those might be limited now. Or find someone with a boat who needs rail meat or help with maintenance by asking at a local marina. Depending on where you are, the Covid 19 limitations may be minor.

 

[sail sfbay]

Welcome to the forum!!

You will get lots of advise on this subject on this forum and everyone has their own experience on how they developed sailing knowledge and expertise and what their first boat was and what they have now. One option is to join a sailing club that offers sailing classes (preferably ASA classes) and has their own fleet of boats you can get qualified to sail. With ASA certification, you might consider chartering small then larger sailboats. Another option is to find a friend or business acquaintance who sails and ask if you can sail with them (social distancing, of course). With that experience and a budget and knowledge on how large a sailboat you want, you will be ready to purchase your first sailboat, either trailerable or berthed sailboat. I started with a Hobie Cat 16 in Pennsylvania and eventually purchased a Hunter 31, then 386 and my current sailboat. Lots of good sailboat brands out there so have fun looking.

 

[dlochner]

Welcome to SBO. Just for the record, none of us were born with sailing skills, we all learned them in various ways and at various times.

At least an introductory class on basic sailing would be immensely helpful. US Sailing runs them as well some commercial outfits. The Colgate schools are well established with a good record.

If you have little or no experience, my suggestion is to start small and cheap with your first boat. Folks who learn on day sailors quickly learn how wind and waves affect sailing and sail trim. Small light boats are quick to respond to changes in sail trim or steering. In the long run you'll be a better sailor. Buy cheap, an old beat up boat may not look pretty, but you'll be less stressed out when docking or with the inevitable learning mishaps experiences. It will also be your learning boat. Learn to make minor repairs and basic maintenance. If it you don't have much money tied up into it, then mistakes unplanned learning experiences will not be as painful or stressful.

Given the time of year and the Covid concerns, you may have to spend the next few months dreaming and learning before getting out on the water.

 

[31seahorse]

+1 for the information already given. Look through sites that sell sailboats (Sailboat Owners, Craigslist, Yachtworld). That will give you an idea of boats available in your area....NJ should have quite a few. Ask questions about maintenance, etc. Welcome to the SBO group. Respectfully, 31 seahorse

 

[Benny17441]

Two types of boats and boating; powerboats or sailboats. Make sure you decide what type of boating you would like before making an investment. As a general rule small sailboats of 20' to 25' are more stable and forgiving than the smaller ones of 11' to 19'. They are also more capable for overnighting and multi-day trips. It is a costly ($$$) mistake to buy a smaller boat just to learn how to sail and then selling it to get a bigger boat. Buy the boat you see yourself sailing for the next 5 to 10 years and then learn on it. Powerboats are a different animal, you can keep them on your backyard in a trailer, take them out, have fun all day and then put them away. A sailboat you have to raise the mast, hank on the sails, attach the rudder and if you intend to come back in the day you cannot go very far. This can get old pretty fast and you may find yourself making excuses not to go out. The alternative is to rent a wet slip or mooring to keep it in the water. I look at boating like an activity I enjoy so to me the cost of the boat is just a partial cost of boating, the other cost is the rental of a slip and maintenance. I once owned a boat that I paid 3X for the slip over a few years than what I paid for the boat. Just sitting in the boat talking to my marina neighbors or going out on a whim made the slip costs worthwhile. The costliest parts in a boat are 1) the hull 2) sails, 3)engine 4) mast and riggings. When buying a used boat concentrate that those 4 are in good condition. Within sailboats there is a subset of 4 kinds of ballast 1) swing keel ballasted 2) Water Ballast 3) fixed keel/center board Combo and 4)fixed keels fin or full. Google them, but in a small boat I prefer #3 as it gives best room in the cabin with reliable stability. If you do not have a friend that knows how to sail and could take you out 2 to 3 times and show you the basics then go ahead and take a course. The same when purchasing a boat, take someone with you that can help identify possible costly problems. Even a free boat may not be a gift as today it costs money to dispose of a vessel that is in your name. After you have the boat and a few basic lessons that is when you read and practice. I assure you the process will be enjoyable and gradually you will expand your confidence and horizons. Good luck.

 

[TomY]

Good afternoon everybody,
A quick briefing on my goal, I'm a 25 year old looking to get involved in the ownership and operation of a sailboat. My only issue is that as much as I always wanted to grow up on the water I never had the opportunity, therefore I lack knowledge on a majority of the aspects of boating ownership, boating in general and the details.
Before investing in a actual sailboat I wanted to learn the ins and out of maintence, costs, transport, brands, etc. I was looking for guidance on any sources of information whether it be books, YouTube channels, other forums, a thread/topic here on SBO. I looked into sailing classes by me that I have been debating taking, I don't know how it is with the current pandemic, but don't know if it is worth investing the money or not.
I do see that this forum is mainly with experienced sailors and I hope I don't come off to clueless and waste your time. Any guidance to things I can be reading, doing or studying that will help me in the long run when I finally buy my first boat will be much appreciated. As for buying a boat, any recommendations on brands for either a beginner or just a quality smaller sailboat in general?
Thank you for your time.

Before you get all into all the above (fun stuff), see what you think of sailing a small boat.

Maybe a friend has one and will get you (safely) started. Or a nearby club has a quick intro sailing course that has you sailing the first day (if it doesn't have you sailing in a small boat ASAP, keep looking).

If you like sailing, you'll be hooked once you feel the motion of a small sailboat as it responds to the wind in the sails and the tiller tugs in your hand reacting to the water moving past the rudder.

It's like coasting downhill on a bicycle, only, the hill never ends.

 

[rgranger]

Welcome to SBO. Just for the record, none of us were born with sailing skills, we all learned them in various ways and at various times.

At least an introductory class on basic sailing would be immensely helpful. US Sailing runs them as well some commercial outfits. The Colgate schools are well established with a good record.

If you have little or no experience, my suggestion is to start small and cheap with your first boat. Folks who learn on day sailors quickly learn how wind and waves affect sailing and sail trim. Small light boats are quick to respond to changes in sail trim or steering. In the long run you'll be a better sailor. Buy cheap, an old beat up boat may not look pretty, but you'll be less stressed out when docking or with the inevitable learning mishaps experiences. It will also be your learning boat. Learn to make minor repairs and basic maintenance. If it you don't have much money tied up into it, then mistakes unplanned learning experiences will not be as painful or stressful.

Given the time of year and the Covid concerns, you may have to spend the next few months dreaming and learning before getting out on the water.

I second (maybe third) @dlochner

Find an old sunfish or sailing dinghy and go sailing. Bigger boats are not necessarily harder to sail... just harder to dock, anchor, trailer, store etc.

Catalina Capri 16.5 - boats - by owner - marine sale

1995 Catalina Capri 16.5 w Mercury 3.3 hp and trailer. Red, white and blue sails. Only used in...

cnj.craigslist.org

14ft Sunfish Sailboat - Excellent Condition - boats - by owner -...

14ft Sunfish Sailboat in excellent condition. Lightly used, kept clean and stored indoors. Hull...

cnj.craigslist.org

ZUMA SAILBOATS - boats - by owner - marine sale

Zuma sailboats complete. The one on the trailer just needs a good cleaning- $550 or BO. The one on...

cnj.craigslist.org

Hunter 170 sailboat - boats - by owner - marine sale

Hunter 170 sailboat. Complete with trailer, sails and lines. Selling for a family member who kept...

cnj.craigslist.org

1994 Sunfish Sailboat - boats - by owner - marine sale

1994 Sunfish in excellent condition. This has the new rolled edge. Boat is 120lbs light. 20lbs...

cnj.craigslist.org

Butterfly Sail Boat - Vintage MINT 1960's - boats - by owner -...

In fully operational order, so good in fact, you could go sailing Today! The Butterfly is a unique...

cnj.craigslist.org

Sailboat with Trailer - boats - by owner - marine sale

Sunfish sailboat with trailer for sale. Sailboat is late 1970's early 1980's. Last used 2017....

cnj.craigslist.org

14 foot O' Day sailboat - boats - by owner - marine sale

1972 , 14 foot Oday class boat Javelin model all glass, with trailer and good sails many sailing...

cnj.craigslist.org

Phantom Sailboat -sunfis - boats - by owner - marine sale

Needs TLC but is complete with rudder with tiller handle and all rigging. Nice sail as well. No...

cnj.craigslist.org

12’ sunfish style sailboat - boats - by owner - marine sale

12’ phantom sailboat Similar to a sunfish but faster. Sunfish rudder and centerboard so parts are...

jerseyshore.craigslist.org

That should get you started. Another great place to shop for boats is this site (sailboatowners.com) and sailboatlistings.com

An ugly boat can be cleaned and painted. You are buying the sails, (maybe a trailer) and the rigging. So try to look past any dirt or grime on the boat.

 

[shemandr]

You should look for a boat that is optimized for the area you intend to use it. For example, if you are going to be sailing on Barnaget Bay you would want a boat that doesn't draw a lot of water since you will be limited in where you can sail. Also that area, and many costal estuaries on the coast have an afternoon sea breeze which is often 15+ knots. That will feel like a bit of wind to you at first. You also may want something beachable. Keel boats not. For a lake you could often have a keel, but often there isn't as much wind. You might also have endless power boat wakes and would need a boat which can handle that. If you want to stay over night some lakes don't permit that. You may want to cruise and visit destinations. That might be a completely different boat. Look at the area you want to sail in and see what other people are sailing. So ......where do you want to sail?

 

[shemandr]

My pick of the litter rgranger has offered is the 14' O'Day. Sunfish and their clones are WET boats i.e. no sailing from mid-October to latish May. Don't buy a project boat. Go sailing!

 

[Berkay]

You should look for a boat that is optimized for the area you intend to use it. For example, if you are going to be sailing on Barnaget Bay you would want a boat that doesn't draw a lot of water since you will be limited in where you can sail. Also that area, and many costal estuaries on the coast have an afternoon sea breeze which is often 15+ knots. That will feel like a bit of wind to you at first. You also may want something beachable. Keel boats not. For a lake you could often have a keel, but often there isn't as much wind. You might also have endless power boat wakes and would need a boat which can handle that. If you want to stay over night some lakes don't permit that. You may want to cruise and visit destinations. That might be a completely different boat. Look at the area you want to sail in and see what other people are sailing. So ......where do you want to sail?

I am fine with a smaller boat it was actually my original idea. I was looking to sail somewhere safe to do so where I can learn and just float around feeling the wind , sails and learning how to position everything. If barnegat bay works then so be it. I would like to probably get a boat that like you said is beachable since I’m kinda nervous to be getting one with a keel since I feel I would be constantly worried about hitting the keel. Do you have such places?

 

[dlochner]

I feel I would be constantly worried about hitting the keel

There are 3 kinds of sailors, those that have run aground, those who are going to run aground and liars.

Just don't hit the bottom hard.

 

[jon hansen]

never liked that old wive's tale , even a little. gives the newbee the idea that running aground is normal and OK.
running aground is akin to reckless driving. like say driving off the freeway and into the ditch is normal.

just my $0.02

there is no need to run aground, ever. there is so much deep water out there, why play in the shallows.

you florida guys and those shifting sands, i get it, i understand.

just never thought that old wive's tale was funny. running aground is wreckless driving. should be avoided at all cost's

 

[Tally Ho]

never liked that old wive's tale , even a little. gives the newbee the idea that running aground is normal and OK.
running aground is akin to reckless driving. like say driving off the freeway and into the ditch is normal.

just my $0.02

there is no need to run aground, ever. there is so much deep water out there, why play in the shallows.

you florida guys and those shifting sands, i get it, i understand.

just never thought that old wive's tale was funny. running aground is wreckless driving. should be avoided at all cost's

I am so fortunate to sail on Lake Michigan and to have 40 feet of water immediately outside my marina. And unlike some marinas on the Great Lakes, I am not up a river or canal. Some locations struggled with low water on the Great Lakes (not this year) and had to dredge or limit access to Shallow draft boats.

One of my few complaints is the relatively short sailing season... and ice...and snow... but hey, we can’t have it all.


To the OP, I sailed with a friend on his Catalina 30 one Sunday afternoon, and I was hooked.
I read a ton and looked at a lot of boats (virtually) over that first winter. The following summer, my oldest so. And I took a 3-day charter class on a Catalina 36. After the class, we chartered the boat A few times that summer. I also had an idea that a MacGregor 26M would be a neat boat: trailerable, can carry a 50hp outboard and motor fairly fast, and sail...all in one. I found someone willing to take me out on his Mac 26X, which is similar. I learned a lot that day about what I wanted...a heavier boat (not trailerable), kept at a slip, with a Diesel inboard motor, 30 foot or so for The a Great Lakes.

My first boat was a little smaller, a Hunter 280. But she met the other requirements. After 5 years, I “upgraded” to a 10-year older O’Day 322 (which I really enjoy). The Hunter was a great first boat...no many maintenance issues and very low maintenance needs. She was small enough for me to learn on, but not too small to feel comfortable most of the time on Lake Michigan. My O’Day 322 has much more character (meaning she is older, takes more care and feeding, etc.) but she has a great cabin layout and she sails really well.

So my advice...find someone to sail with, and get on as many different boats as you can. See what appeals to you, and your specific Sailing grounds. I can run the deepest draft I want in my area. But that is not true for many people. I did not like trailering, setting the boat up, tearing the boat down every time I wanted to sail... my time is too short (still working and don’t want to waste 2 hours of a Saturday messing around with the mast and sails). But maybe that all of that flexibility Appeals to you. I like a comfy cabin...maybe you just need a comfy cockpit.

Have fun with the search...but when you find the boat you want...buy it. When I first saw my O’Day 322, it sold before I made an offer...it took me 5 years and buying another boat first before she came back available and I purchased her.

Greg

 

[shemandr]

Here is a Wiki... write up about the Barnegut Bay Sneakbox. It's been working for over a hundred years. If you google BBS there are go pro movies of them sailing. Could work nicely for you. But the history is interesting - to me. I'm going to read that book about someone taking the Sneakbox down the Ohio River and hence the Mississippi River. Camper cruising! Now I'm more of a Motel 6 cruiser but there's great adventure out there for you. More later.

Sneakbox - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[shemandr]

Or this:

https://sailboatdata.com/sailboat/barnegat-bay-a-cat

Again a design of 100 year history on that body of water. Something was working. The wide hull provides good stability without a deep keel (It has a centerboard). It also provides a spacious cockpit. These boats were born of the need for a stable - working boat - in that 15+ sea breeze. They also have active racing. They can be good overnighters. You may want a smaller version. The A Cat isn't trailerable. Worth a look.

 

[capta]

Good afternoon everybody,
A quick briefing on my goal, I'm a 25 year old looking to get involved in the ownership and operation of a sailboat. My only issue is that as much as I always wanted to grow up on the water I never had the opportunity, therefore I lack knowledge on a majority of the aspects of boating ownership, boating in general and the details.
Before investing in a actual sailboat I wanted to learn the ins and out of maintence, costs, transport, brands, etc. I was looking for guidance on any sources of information whether it be books, YouTube channels, other forums, a thread/topic here on SBO. I looked into sailing classes by me that I have been debating taking, I don't know how it is with the current pandemic, but don't know if it is worth investing the money or not.
I do see that this forum is mainly with experienced sailors and I hope I don't come off to clueless and waste your time. Any guidance to things I can be reading, doing or studying that will help me in the long run when I finally buy my first boat will be much appreciated. As for buying a boat, any recommendations on brands for either a beginner or just a quality smaller sailboat in general?
Thank you for your time.

In your situation my suggestion would be to buy a 15 foot or smaller very cheap dinghy that's pretty beat up, but serviceable. This is not going to be a boat to take your friends out on, but instead you will be crashing into docks, running aground and even tipping her over on occasion. This is the boat to make all your beginner's mistakes on, before you buy a nicer, more expensive boat. And believe me, if you start with the more expensive boat, you are still going to make all the same mistakes, classes or not, but the repair bills will be much more expensive, and if you load the boat up with friends, there is the possibility of someone getting hurt. Sailing isn't rocket science, but it does take a lot of sailing to get it.

This is how almost every professional sailor of note learned to sail, not through some expensive cookie cutter course.

Along with your little beater, I would highly recommend a great little book called Royce's Sailing Illustrated, a fun yet very comprehensive book filled with important information for the novice sailor or experienced professional. No massive preachy tome this, just a well put together book with everything from rigging, docking and even splicing. I've been using it to teach sailing for over 45 years, and still refer to it now and then, myself.

As you gain sailing experience, and spend time with other sailors, either just chatting, or sailing on their boats, you'll gain a much better idea of the bigger boat you will actually want to own.

 

[jon hansen]

capta just gave you the best recipe to learn the sport, period.

enjoy!

 

[Capt jgw]

There are lots of books although ‘doing’ beats reading about it every time. Find a local boat club and inquire there about crewing or lessons - most have schools. Also, the CG Auxiliary has boating classes for beginners although those might be limited now. Or find someone with a boat who needs rail meat or help with maintenance by asking at a local marina. Depending on where you are, the Covid 19 limitations may be minor.

I also recommend you look up your local USCGAUX. I've been a member about 40 years, first connected with them through a boat safety class. They got me the base I needed to start a new career as a commercial boat Captain. I now have a 200 GT license, based on the knowledge I gained taking then teaching their classes. Check them out.

 

[sailme88]

So a question for you. What is your learning style? Are you a visual learner, or prefer to read? Knowing this is where the answer to your question really lies. This forum is an excellent site for asking for advise. You really don't need advise yet, you have a basic idea of what you want to accomplish. Refine your needs and desires and then find the best avenue to achieve them.
You have several key things going for you. 1) you have a goal and 2) by your own admission, lack knowledge on a wide spectrum of sailing related benchmarks. Both of " your" statements a profound. You readily acknowledge and admit your shortfall which is something that belies your 25 years. You've got more going for yourself than you may realize.
Enjoy the journey.