Had my first race last weekend. We were doing well to the first mark, then promptly got whipped by the fleet on the down wind (run) leg. Not having a spinnaker really hurt us. Any good ideas to improve down wind performance -w-out spinnakers. Any used spinnakers out there? Didn't know what the PHRF Rating is for this boat? Anyone know? Scott Davis (CYC)
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Greg Stebbins
Racing a 23
Your PHRF Rating is about 260. Before you jump on a spiniker, What sails do you have?
Your PHRF Rating is about 260. Before you jump on a spiniker, What sails do you have?
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William Davis
re spanked
I was using my big genny and full main. Don't know what size the genny is, but its close to a 155. Scott
I was using my big genny and full main. Don't know what size the genny is, but its close to a 155. Scott
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Cliff Ruckstuhl
Need More Info?
Scott I need some more info. Do you have a whisker pole? What kind of shape are your sails in? Do you have a backstay adjuster? When I raced the 23 it was a JAM fleet and I would Pass boats on the down wind leg. One time we passed a Junkalina going down wind while we changed the head sail. Also what is the length of your spreaders? See my post on Rig Tuning. Cliff
Scott I need some more info. Do you have a whisker pole? What kind of shape are your sails in? Do you have a backstay adjuster? When I raced the 23 it was a JAM fleet and I would Pass boats on the down wind leg. One time we passed a Junkalina going down wind while we changed the head sail. Also what is the length of your spreaders? See my post on Rig Tuning. Cliff
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William Davis
RE: More info
Thanks Cliff for the help, Here is what I have.. My sails are in good shape. My back stay is adjustable, however it dosn't seem to want to loosten up (slack) much more than 1/2 way up. The rollers are about 1/2 way up the V when it stops. My rigging is all tight (forstay, shrouds.) I do have quite alot of weather helm when sailing to windward. My head sails are: genowa, and a smaller working jib. Both are in like new condition. I do have and use a spinnaker pole. My spreaders are stock approx 20-25 inch each side. Next race is this comming weekend. We plan to get out there and try again.
Thanks Cliff for the help, Here is what I have.. My sails are in good shape. My back stay is adjustable, however it dosn't seem to want to loosten up (slack) much more than 1/2 way up. The rollers are about 1/2 way up the V when it stops. My rigging is all tight (forstay, shrouds.) I do have quite alot of weather helm when sailing to windward. My head sails are: genowa, and a smaller working jib. Both are in like new condition. I do have and use a spinnaker pole. My spreaders are stock approx 20-25 inch each side. Next race is this comming weekend. We plan to get out there and try again.
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Tim Thompson
I'd take PHRF of 260
Wow! If I could convince the yacht club here of 260 I would be a lot more competitive and maybe win a few. They have my PHRF at 218! Help! What can I do to get them to change that?
Wow! If I could convince the yacht club here of 260 I would be a lot more competitive and maybe win a few. They have my PHRF at 218! Help! What can I do to get them to change that?
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Jim Kolstoe
Some speed thoughts
William, Save your spinnikar pole for a spinnikar and use a whisker pole for your gennie - it can be adjusted to the conditions. For downwind speed, are you easing your backstay, outhaul and cunningham? You want the fuller (deeper camber) shape in your sails. Also look at your course. Directly down-wind is generally slower than any other windanglem, especially if your main it blanketing your gennie. . Speaking of wind angles, talk to the experienced racers about "polar charts." they give a graphic representation of boat speed for each course relative to true wind. Even if you don't work one up, undestanding the implications of a "typical" polar chart can be helpful. If other h23's are racing, or even sailing in your vacinity, try sailing near them and look at their sails to see what they're doing that might help you. Consider crewing for experienced racers - you can learn a lot in a hurry. I used to have problems with a heavy weather helm upwind. Remember the adage: "when in doubt, let it out." You are probably trimmed in too tight. I try to have a small "bubble" in the main near the mast. The air flow is disturbed by the mast anyway, so no power is lost. Then trim the headsail by the tell-tails: windward tell-tails slightly lifted, leeward tell-tails streaming back. You also want to tighten your back stay adjuster and cunningham, and depending on appearent wind strength, the outhaul. Figure on going back and forth between the two as they mutually interact. Consider reading "Sail Power." It has chapters on how to trim each of your sails, and on how the sails interact. Jim Kolstoe.
William, Save your spinnikar pole for a spinnikar and use a whisker pole for your gennie - it can be adjusted to the conditions. For downwind speed, are you easing your backstay, outhaul and cunningham? You want the fuller (deeper camber) shape in your sails. Also look at your course. Directly down-wind is generally slower than any other windanglem, especially if your main it blanketing your gennie. . Speaking of wind angles, talk to the experienced racers about "polar charts." they give a graphic representation of boat speed for each course relative to true wind. Even if you don't work one up, undestanding the implications of a "typical" polar chart can be helpful. If other h23's are racing, or even sailing in your vacinity, try sailing near them and look at their sails to see what they're doing that might help you. Consider crewing for experienced racers - you can learn a lot in a hurry. I used to have problems with a heavy weather helm upwind. Remember the adage: "when in doubt, let it out." You are probably trimmed in too tight. I try to have a small "bubble" in the main near the mast. The air flow is disturbed by the mast anyway, so no power is lost. Then trim the headsail by the tell-tails: windward tell-tails slightly lifted, leeward tell-tails streaming back. You also want to tighten your back stay adjuster and cunningham, and depending on appearent wind strength, the outhaul. Figure on going back and forth between the two as they mutually interact. Consider reading "Sail Power." It has chapters on how to trim each of your sails, and on how the sails interact. Jim Kolstoe.
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rick crockett
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William Davis
Thanks for all the help!
I really do appreciate all the help I have found here. Its been a long time since I have raced and there is lots to learn/remember. We will be back at it this weekend and see how it go's. I have lots of tuning work to do on Sat, and Sunday see if we can keep up with those darn J-22's. I really would like to be a thorn in their side on race days. (Big Grin!) Thanks again!!!
I really do appreciate all the help I have found here. Its been a long time since I have raced and there is lots to learn/remember. We will be back at it this weekend and see how it go's. I have lots of tuning work to do on Sat, and Sunday see if we can keep up with those darn J-22's. I really would like to be a thorn in their side on race days. (Big Grin!) Thanks again!!!
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BK
H23 PHRF ratings
PHRF ratings are regional. H23 ratings range from 225(Florida Suncoast to 270in Eastern Conn.). Average rating is around 240. Charleston SC is 234. Ratings are relative and only have meaning when related to like boats. Compare your rating to a Catalina 22 in your area and relative difference in other areas to get a feel for where your rating should be.
PHRF ratings are regional. H23 ratings range from 225(Florida Suncoast to 270in Eastern Conn.). Average rating is around 240. Charleston SC is 234. Ratings are relative and only have meaning when related to like boats. Compare your rating to a Catalina 22 in your area and relative difference in other areas to get a feel for where your rating should be.
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Jeff Arnett
Down Wind Sail Trim
Jim had some good points on down wind sail trim. Another important device for controlling the main shape down wind is a boom vang. If you don't already have one its pretty easy to add.
Jim had some good points on down wind sail trim. Another important device for controlling the main shape down wind is a boom vang. If you don't already have one its pretty easy to add.
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