Well folks, I sailed my 260 from Smith Point to Annapolis and back to attend the boat show. I thought that Annapolis was beautiful from the water. The show was great and we had some great sailing including a peak of 10.2 kts. surfing some big following seas on the way home. About 15 NM out of Smith Point Marina (pretty good place by the way) the boat rounded up and wouldn't come back. When I looked back to check my rudder position it wasn't there! I hung my head over the stern and saw that it was hanging by the up and down haul lines and trapped in between the transom and the outboard. We got the sails down, the rudder aboard and the motor started and made our way back. I'm sure glad that I had installed a steering link for the outboard. The bracket looks pretty rough, but the rudder is fine. The 1/2" bolt broke in two and is at the bottom of the Chesapeake. I had been holding the rudder down with the down haul line as Hunter suggests and I think most of you do. Any similar problems out there? Jeff Peltier please email me. I couldn't find you on the owner's list. I have talked to Greg at Hunter and emailed pictures aswell. I'll keep you posted as to what they say. We were on a broad reach about 15 deg. off of DDW with about 20 kt. winds and 3 ft seas with a 4ft wave now and then. I am also having problems with the outboard bracket bending as did Jim's on Java. Hunter told me that they sent him a replacement that was the same as the original. It is my belief that it will only bend the same way. The bracket needs to be stronger and taller. I didn't buy this boat to only lake sail on calm days. I am using it well within the "CE certification" conditions that we just had so much discussion about. These seem to be weak links on an otherwise pretty well made boat. Looking for construtive comments, Joe C. in NC '01 H260 Windward Passage
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Frank / MD / H260
H260-rudder problems
My only complain with the 260 is the rudder. I recieved my boat in June, so it's a new boat, but the rudder's cracking lenght wise on the top. And after the first time the hold down rope popped out of the hole and the rudder came up. I've tried a couple different methods, but now rely on a hose clamp to keep the line from slipping through the hole. The compression leveler just doesn't work. I've taken a 12" cresent to it and it still slips under the pound of waves. I my mind the rope shouldn't be used. The compression lever gives you a break-a-way feature that's nice to have if you go into shallow area's, and I'm in the Chesapeake Bay and there's a ton of them. Now I'm using both. I've talked with Hunter a couple of times, but haven't really gotten good answers. Fortunately my brackets and the bolt are fine. There's no excuse for the bolt to break. You should be able to hang the boat by a 1/2" stainless steel bolt. Hey, did the laminate sides of your cabinate, above the sink, curl up? Good Luck, Frank
My only complain with the 260 is the rudder. I recieved my boat in June, so it's a new boat, but the rudder's cracking lenght wise on the top. And after the first time the hold down rope popped out of the hole and the rudder came up. I've tried a couple different methods, but now rely on a hose clamp to keep the line from slipping through the hole. The compression leveler just doesn't work. I've taken a 12" cresent to it and it still slips under the pound of waves. I my mind the rope shouldn't be used. The compression lever gives you a break-a-way feature that's nice to have if you go into shallow area's, and I'm in the Chesapeake Bay and there's a ton of them. Now I'm using both. I've talked with Hunter a couple of times, but haven't really gotten good answers. Fortunately my brackets and the bolt are fine. There's no excuse for the bolt to break. You should be able to hang the boat by a 1/2" stainless steel bolt. Hey, did the laminate sides of your cabinate, above the sink, curl up? Good Luck, Frank
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Scott Blahnik
Rudder problems...
The archives are full of problems with the rudder on the 260. Maybe they'll be recalled!
The archives are full of problems with the rudder on the 260. Maybe they'll be recalled!
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Mark
Hold down rope
We only use the hold down rope out to sea. If we come into shallow water we then tighten up the clamp and release the hold down rope.
We only use the hold down rope out to sea. If we come into shallow water we then tighten up the clamp and release the hold down rope.
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Ray
Did your boat have a tiller or wheel?
The rudder locking system has been a problem since the H26's were built, years before the 260's. I'm disappointed that an otherwise good boat still fails in this critical area. On our 95 H26 the rudder is raised and lowered by an approx. 3/8" rope with no sheaves, blocks or guides. They hold the rudder in place with a 2 bit large wing nut and rope cleat that only fish on the cockpit floor can see. God help you if you ever leave a beach/anchorage that required you to raise your rudder and the rudder rope slipped to one side or the other when you try to pull the rudder down into service. If the rudder loosens and moves by as little as 10% the boat is almost impossible to steer. This rudder set-up ranks right next to Firestone ATV tires in my opinion. But who in the heck am I? Ray S/V Speedy
The rudder locking system has been a problem since the H26's were built, years before the 260's. I'm disappointed that an otherwise good boat still fails in this critical area. On our 95 H26 the rudder is raised and lowered by an approx. 3/8" rope with no sheaves, blocks or guides. They hold the rudder in place with a 2 bit large wing nut and rope cleat that only fish on the cockpit floor can see. God help you if you ever leave a beach/anchorage that required you to raise your rudder and the rudder rope slipped to one side or the other when you try to pull the rudder down into service. If the rudder loosens and moves by as little as 10% the boat is almost impossible to steer. This rudder set-up ranks right next to Firestone ATV tires in my opinion. But who in the heck am I? Ray S/V Speedy
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Joe C.
Steering system OK
Thanks Ray for your supportive post. My boat has the stock Edson wheel steering system which is designed to be used on boats that are larger and heaiver than the 260, so it is well sufficient for the job. I have seen the up/down haul system on the 26's and they have improved them some on the 260 by providing a 2:1 block on the down haul and the down haul line where it comes off the rudder doesn't tend to get "off track". It is still a little tricky to get the rudder locked down well. I usually use my foot on the back of the rudder to help with this. However, sailing on colder days is not too friendly to this. I am looking in to adding a place on the back of the rudder to push with my foot still out of the water. Keep those cards and letters coming, Joe C. in NC '01 H260 Windward Passage PS Hunter is being very helpful and providing replacement parts.
Thanks Ray for your supportive post. My boat has the stock Edson wheel steering system which is designed to be used on boats that are larger and heaiver than the 260, so it is well sufficient for the job. I have seen the up/down haul system on the 26's and they have improved them some on the 260 by providing a 2:1 block on the down haul and the down haul line where it comes off the rudder doesn't tend to get "off track". It is still a little tricky to get the rudder locked down well. I usually use my foot on the back of the rudder to help with this. However, sailing on colder days is not too friendly to this. I am looking in to adding a place on the back of the rudder to push with my foot still out of the water. Keep those cards and letters coming, Joe C. in NC '01 H260 Windward Passage PS Hunter is being very helpful and providing replacement parts.
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Bernie
Outboard brackets
Joe, My outboard brackets are badly bent. I now have a new set that are the same as the originals. When I pull the boat in a couple of months, I intend to straighten the original brackets and then remount the outboard composite board with both the original and new brackets placed together in the shape of a square rather than the current "U" at each end. I will have to slightly enlarge the hole in one set of brackets to make this work, but I think this will give me a lot more strength than provided by the original set. I am going to see if I can get a shop to weld the two piecses together to provide extra strength. I'll let you know how this works out in a few months (I assume they are stainless steel). Good Luck, Bernie
Joe, My outboard brackets are badly bent. I now have a new set that are the same as the originals. When I pull the boat in a couple of months, I intend to straighten the original brackets and then remount the outboard composite board with both the original and new brackets placed together in the shape of a square rather than the current "U" at each end. I will have to slightly enlarge the hole in one set of brackets to make this work, but I think this will give me a lot more strength than provided by the original set. I am going to see if I can get a shop to weld the two piecses together to provide extra strength. I'll let you know how this works out in a few months (I assume they are stainless steel). Good Luck, Bernie
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Mike Pajewski
I've had the same problem
Joe, I had the similar problem on my 96 H26 when we took a cruise to Door County this August. The rudder started to kick up. We were sailing reefed on a broad reach in 15-20 kts of wind with a 2-3 foot chop. All of a sudden the autopilot began to trip off, and when my son tried manual control, he couldn't hold it. Neither could I. The rudder was kicking up and the downhaul (which was cleated) was pulled super tight. We ended up dropping sail, and I climbed out on the transom to reset the rudder and retighten the wingnut. When we got to fish Creek, I ended up tightening the wing nut and the bolt the rudder hinges on with a 10" crescent wrrench. That corrected the problem of kicking up, but I don't dare go agound or the rudder or transom will get trashed. As for the motor mount, the older H26 has a solid wood (I think its teak) and it is quite stout. It just needs to be cleaned up and refinished once in a while. Mike Pajewski H26 "Loon"
Joe, I had the similar problem on my 96 H26 when we took a cruise to Door County this August. The rudder started to kick up. We were sailing reefed on a broad reach in 15-20 kts of wind with a 2-3 foot chop. All of a sudden the autopilot began to trip off, and when my son tried manual control, he couldn't hold it. Neither could I. The rudder was kicking up and the downhaul (which was cleated) was pulled super tight. We ended up dropping sail, and I climbed out on the transom to reset the rudder and retighten the wingnut. When we got to fish Creek, I ended up tightening the wing nut and the bolt the rudder hinges on with a 10" crescent wrrench. That corrected the problem of kicking up, but I don't dare go agound or the rudder or transom will get trashed. As for the motor mount, the older H26 has a solid wood (I think its teak) and it is quite stout. It just needs to be cleaned up and refinished once in a while. Mike Pajewski H26 "Loon"
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Joe C.
Bernie, Motor mount
Bernie, I talked to Greg about this and he told me that he had sent replacement brackets to Jim S. for Java. I was under the impression from an earlier post by Jim that they were going to be a redesigned version, but Greg said no, just a replacement. I told him that I wasn't going to put the same kind back as they would do the same thing. I am meeting with my SS fabricator on Monday to work on a new design. I believe a good deal of the stress happens during trailering, but it is completely impractical to remove our outboards with everything remote. I have the same motor that you do. The "starboard" on mine is also getting cut in to by the outboard clamps and works loose which was a big problem on that trip too. I plan to beef up and extend the height of the brackets and replace the starboard with something tougher (maybe some SS backing plates) and make the brackets taller and tied together across where they meet the stern. I'll post pictures and give a report. It's too much of a safety issue to let it be a weak link. Fair winds and peaceful following seas, Joe
Bernie, I talked to Greg about this and he told me that he had sent replacement brackets to Jim S. for Java. I was under the impression from an earlier post by Jim that they were going to be a redesigned version, but Greg said no, just a replacement. I told him that I wasn't going to put the same kind back as they would do the same thing. I am meeting with my SS fabricator on Monday to work on a new design. I believe a good deal of the stress happens during trailering, but it is completely impractical to remove our outboards with everything remote. I have the same motor that you do. The "starboard" on mine is also getting cut in to by the outboard clamps and works loose which was a big problem on that trip too. I plan to beef up and extend the height of the brackets and replace the starboard with something tougher (maybe some SS backing plates) and make the brackets taller and tied together across where they meet the stern. I'll post pictures and give a report. It's too much of a safety issue to let it be a weak link. Fair winds and peaceful following seas, Joe
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Jeff Peltier
weak point
Joe, I beefed up my rudder post after it broke and put pictures on the photo forum. I never cleat my rudder down line, but rather use a spring to put tention on the line. This is also in the photo forum. Clearly the rudder post needs some attention from Hunter. Jeff Peltier
Joe, I beefed up my rudder post after it broke and put pictures on the photo forum. I never cleat my rudder down line, but rather use a spring to put tention on the line. This is also in the photo forum. Clearly the rudder post needs some attention from Hunter. Jeff Peltier
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Jeff Peltier
weak link
Joe, When mine broke, I decided to beaf up the rudder post with straps, which spread the load around nearly half the post instead of two points. Pictures are on the photo forum. I don't cleat my rudder down line, but rather use a spring to tention the line. The rudder stays down unless weeds accumulate or I hit something. This is also on the photo forum. I have made these comments to Hunter, so far whithout response but, clearly, they could use some help in this area. Jeff Peltier
Joe, When mine broke, I decided to beaf up the rudder post with straps, which spread the load around nearly half the post instead of two points. Pictures are on the photo forum. I don't cleat my rudder down line, but rather use a spring to tention the line. The rudder stays down unless weeds accumulate or I hit something. This is also on the photo forum. I have made these comments to Hunter, so far whithout response but, clearly, they could use some help in this area. Jeff Peltier
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Joe C.
Jeff P. What year is your boat?
Jeff, I had seen your pictures. My boat is an '01 model. It has SS straps welded around the post similar to what you added but a little smaller. I think the big problem was insufficent provision for hold down. It seems like the conditions that I was in would likely make a spring like you are using kick up. I hold mine down with a spinlock power cleat. If the rudder ever gets up it has tremendous leverage back against the boat. Joe C. in NC
Jeff, I had seen your pictures. My boat is an '01 model. It has SS straps welded around the post similar to what you added but a little smaller. I think the big problem was insufficent provision for hold down. It seems like the conditions that I was in would likely make a spring like you are using kick up. I hold mine down with a spinlock power cleat. If the rudder ever gets up it has tremendous leverage back against the boat. Joe C. in NC
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Jeff Peltier
more on rudders
Joe, My 260 is a 98 model. We have another 2001 model on our lake which has a slightly improved strapping system. I have been out in 25 K winds and never had the rudder come up. I have also noticed that the 2001 model has sightly more rake built in than the 98 model. So it appears, they have made some small changes. Jeff Peltier
Joe, My 260 is a 98 model. We have another 2001 model on our lake which has a slightly improved strapping system. I have been out in 25 K winds and never had the rudder come up. I have also noticed that the 2001 model has sightly more rake built in than the 98 model. So it appears, they have made some small changes. Jeff Peltier
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Joe C.
Thanks, Jeff P.
For the rudder repair, I plan to use the replacement parts that Hunter is supplying, but I'm going to experiment with plastic and wood "sheer pins" to be used to hold the rudder down when sailing in heavy weather. Now that motor mount is another story. Fairwinds, Joe C. in NC
For the rudder repair, I plan to use the replacement parts that Hunter is supplying, but I'm going to experiment with plastic and wood "sheer pins" to be used to hold the rudder down when sailing in heavy weather. Now that motor mount is another story. Fairwinds, Joe C. in NC
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