I'm working with the Hunter Owners Website sail loft to replace my main (and jib) on a 29.5. They're suggesting partial battens instead of full. I realize the fulls are harder to raise, but is there any distinction between full and partials in terms of performance? I'd appreciate anyone's comments.
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"Partial Full" batten main
I worked with the Doyle Loft in Cleveland over the past two years to buy a new main, asymmetrical spinnaker, and 110 genoa for Lady Lillie, our '77 h27. Full battens in all 4 slots gives the best sail shape and performance. But the lower two (largest two) full battens will put a lot of pressure on the track slides at the luff, requiring special hardware, and giving problems when raising/lowering the sail. Also, the shape of the lower part of the main gets a lot of support from the clew at the boom. Finally, the top of the sail (where we have 2 full battens) is the most logical place to gain power with the added roach that needs full battens for support. I suggest talking through your question with the Doyle sailmaker (that I assume is) available through this site. Good luck, and enjoy the new main. Our new main was the single best improvment we have made to the Lady Lillie. It added a knot or more to our speed in moderate winds, while reducing heel by 5 degrees. David
I worked with the Doyle Loft in Cleveland over the past two years to buy a new main, asymmetrical spinnaker, and 110 genoa for Lady Lillie, our '77 h27. Full battens in all 4 slots gives the best sail shape and performance. But the lower two (largest two) full battens will put a lot of pressure on the track slides at the luff, requiring special hardware, and giving problems when raising/lowering the sail. Also, the shape of the lower part of the main gets a lot of support from the clew at the boom. Finally, the top of the sail (where we have 2 full battens) is the most logical place to gain power with the added roach that needs full battens for support. I suggest talking through your question with the Doyle sailmaker (that I assume is) available through this site. Good luck, and enjoy the new main. Our new main was the single best improvment we have made to the Lady Lillie. It added a knot or more to our speed in moderate winds, while reducing heel by 5 degrees. David
Full battens don't get beat up as much...
Bill, Another advantage that full battens give you that I didn't initially consider when I got my full batten main, is that is doesn't get all beat up when luffing which consequently doesn't beat you up as much. For example with our old sail when we put a reef into the main, we would let the sheet all the way out, ease the halyard, and then tighten the reefing line. But of course while you are doing this the sail is flapping like a flag (which by the way is not good for the sail). Now with our full batten main the sail undulates a little but doesn't get beat up. Also the full battens seem to flake better in our lazy jacks. p.s. Is your boat Deadline at YRYH? I think my fiancé Elyse Pyle from 1st Advantage went sailing on your boat this past summer. Small world.
Bill, Another advantage that full battens give you that I didn't initially consider when I got my full batten main, is that is doesn't get all beat up when luffing which consequently doesn't beat you up as much. For example with our old sail when we put a reef into the main, we would let the sheet all the way out, ease the halyard, and then tighten the reefing line. But of course while you are doing this the sail is flapping like a flag (which by the way is not good for the sail). Now with our full batten main the sail undulates a little but doesn't get beat up. Also the full battens seem to flake better in our lazy jacks. p.s. Is your boat Deadline at YRYH? I think my fiancé Elyse Pyle from 1st Advantage went sailing on your boat this past summer. Small world.
Couple of full and couple of partial.
Bill: Davids setup is a good compromise as far as I am concerned. This is really the best of both worlds. When we had our main made I told the sailmaker to do this and she decided I needed all full battens. It works fine but I agree that not having that additional pressure would have made hauling the main halyard a little easier. If I did it over (not for another 8-10 years) that is probably what I would do. Also consider a loose footed main while you are at it.
Bill: Davids setup is a good compromise as far as I am concerned. This is really the best of both worlds. When we had our main made I told the sailmaker to do this and she decided I needed all full battens. It works fine but I agree that not having that additional pressure would have made hauling the main halyard a little easier. If I did it over (not for another 8-10 years) that is probably what I would do. Also consider a loose footed main while you are at it.
Anthony makes a good point about cost reduction...
Imagine two fully battened mainsails that, between them, have served nearly 40,000 NM over 11 seasons of sailing, 2/3 of that offshore, and are still going pretty strong. This is the situation with Rivendel II, our Legend 43 (hull #1). With the full main up and the outhaul as well as the main halyard very tight we still do have an acceptable sailshape for close-hauled upwind courses (downwind sail shape is no real problem of course). Unfortunately, our first reef stinks because the lower sail sections are to baggy and with the reef in place the foot of the main cannot be stretched as effectively. So we often wait till the wind goes over 20 knot and then skip the first reef by putting a double reef in. The upper sections still do have a nice foil shape and our 2nd reef, combined with the staysail, keeps us in business till well over 30 knots, when we usually put the 3rd reef in the main and furl the staysail altogether (unless we want to heave to). If not for the full battens I am pretty sure we would have been forced to shell out several thousand $$ for a new main several seasons ago! Flying Dutchman PS We rarely allow our main to luff vigorously, though, by religiously applying the shortcut reefing techniques described in a much earlier post (hope Phil did not lose it yet). FD
Imagine two fully battened mainsails that, between them, have served nearly 40,000 NM over 11 seasons of sailing, 2/3 of that offshore, and are still going pretty strong. This is the situation with Rivendel II, our Legend 43 (hull #1). With the full main up and the outhaul as well as the main halyard very tight we still do have an acceptable sailshape for close-hauled upwind courses (downwind sail shape is no real problem of course). Unfortunately, our first reef stinks because the lower sail sections are to baggy and with the reef in place the foot of the main cannot be stretched as effectively. So we often wait till the wind goes over 20 knot and then skip the first reef by putting a double reef in. The upper sections still do have a nice foil shape and our 2nd reef, combined with the staysail, keeps us in business till well over 30 knots, when we usually put the 3rd reef in the main and furl the staysail altogether (unless we want to heave to). If not for the full battens I am pretty sure we would have been forced to shell out several thousand $$ for a new main several seasons ago! Flying Dutchman PS We rarely allow our main to luff vigorously, though, by religiously applying the shortcut reefing techniques described in a much earlier post (hope Phil did not lose it yet). FD
MY EXPERIENCE
Bill: Early last spring I decided to replace my sails and went with a main w/ 2 full and 2 partial battens (sail came from Quantum in Hampton). I was VERY satisfied with both the quality of the sail and performance/ease of use of the main. The sail maintains great shape when motorsailing upwind and the boat goes like crazy on all points of sail. Last summer I routinely outpointed and outsailed boats with waterlines 4-5' longer. FYI, I really was happy with the sails provided by Quantum. If you want, I can get you Jim's number at his Hampton loft. From the time we ordered the sails until they were delivered was just about 3 months - sails are made in S. Africa and shipped to each loft via a staging location in New Orleans. Good luck. Tim Leighton TIDETIM@AOL.COM
Bill: Early last spring I decided to replace my sails and went with a main w/ 2 full and 2 partial battens (sail came from Quantum in Hampton). I was VERY satisfied with both the quality of the sail and performance/ease of use of the main. The sail maintains great shape when motorsailing upwind and the boat goes like crazy on all points of sail. Last summer I routinely outpointed and outsailed boats with waterlines 4-5' longer. FYI, I really was happy with the sails provided by Quantum. If you want, I can get you Jim's number at his Hampton loft. From the time we ordered the sails until they were delivered was just about 3 months - sails are made in S. Africa and shipped to each loft via a staging location in New Orleans. Good luck. Tim Leighton TIDETIM@AOL.COM
Thanks, Guys
Thanks for all the advice, albeit not unanimous. I will study this and talk to the sail loft. Tim, I did indeed call Quantum. Appreciate the tip. I look forward to your opinion of the sails from the photos I sent. Anthony, mine is indeed Deadline. Ms. Pyle proved an excellent skipper, enabling me to chat up her boss without distraction.
Thanks for all the advice, albeit not unanimous. I will study this and talk to the sail loft. Tim, I did indeed call Quantum. Appreciate the tip. I look forward to your opinion of the sails from the photos I sent. Anthony, mine is indeed Deadline. Ms. Pyle proved an excellent skipper, enabling me to chat up her boss without distraction.
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