For Peggy and west Florida

[Ed Schenck]

My Great Lakes boat has no provision for pumping overboard, no Y-valve and no pump. It does have a capped discharge thru-hull. The nearest pumpout is three hours away IF there is a high tide. Are you folks pumping overboard here on the west coast of Florida?

Peggy, if I do add a y-valve what is the best way? I assume a macerator is called for but I hate adding more electrical crap to the boat. Any other way?

 

[seadaddler]

Pump Out

That's why I am very happy with my Marina we have pump out in the Marina,they need to give us some thing for $11 a ft any way.
I guess or think if you go three miles out into the gulf you can let her rip don't know about Hide tide,which way is the tide going I think more important.
When I was looking for a slip here some private docks did not have access to pump out and thought about a treatment system,my setup it flushes into tank and than macerator over board or pump out.
Nick

 

[Ross]

This link may answer some of your questions. http://www.dep.state.fl.us/cleanmarina/marinas.htm

 

[Stu Jackson]

Overboard discharge designs

Ed, see reply #6, here: http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,4829.0.html

 

[kloudie1]

Hey, Ed.. My H-34 was set up from the factory with a Whale Gusher, hand powered diaphragm pump. The boat is rigged to always go to the tank which can be pumped overboard with the Whale through a vented loop and thru-hull, or it can be pumped out at a facility through the regular deck access. This setup works well except the calcium carbonate-like flakes from the tank will jam the vertically oriented discharge valve of the hand pump. It takes about a year to jam it. If my pump were oriented horizontally, I don’t think this would happen. Attached picture shows the plumbing mess that is more-or-less original. I haven't changed it because I can feel the valve beginning to plug and have time to rinse the thing out and open it and clear it. Nope, that is Bayou water in there and not what it looks like! The red industrial hose goes to the deck pump-out.

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

Where in west FL?

All the waters of the Keys are "no discharge"...AND the "3 mile limit" has been extended to 12 miles on the Gulf side of the Keys... 6 miles on most of the rest of the Gulf side of FL (although I don't know how rigidly they enforce the extra 3 miles... So if you're in the Keys or planning to spend a lot of time there, you might as well keep what you have, 'cuz getting to anywhere you can dump a tank is just about as difficult as getting to the pumpout you say is 3 hours away.

However-the discharge of TREATED waste from a CG certified Type I MSD is legal every else on the west coast of FL--in fact, everywhere else in the Gulf except Destin Harbor...so if you're anywhere north of the Keys and don't plan to go there much, the ideal solution for your boat would be an Electro Scan or PuraSan. The amperage draw may LOOK a little scary, but actual consumption for a couple aboard 24/7 is only 15-17 AH/day. Yes, I know you don't want to add any more 'electrical crap' to your boat...but the freedom from tank maintenance, vent line maintenance, tank products and never having to find a pumpout again or wait for high tide to get to it--IF it's even working!---would be worth it to me! The Ft. Lauderdale Raritan plant often has refurbs and "scratched & dents" at a huge discount...all have the full factory warranty.

But if you'd rather deal with the hassle of a tank, put the y-valve between the tank and the overboard discharge pump...you can either go with a macerator pump or a manual diaphragm pump.

 

[sailingdog]

Flushing the pump with vinegar will help clear the mineral deposits. IIRC, you don't need a vented loop on the tank discharge line. The diaphragm pump acts as a check valve (since it has two check valves in it).

Hey, Ed.. My H-34 was set up from the factory with a Whale Gusher, hand powered diaphragm pump. The boat is rigged to always go to the tank which can be pumped overboard with the Whale through a vented loop and thru-hull, or it can be pumped out at a facility through the regular deck access. This setup works well except the calcium carbonate-like flakes from the tank will jam the vertically oriented discharge valve of the hand pump. It takes about a year to jam it. If my pump were oriented horizontally, I don’t think this would happen. Attached picture shows the plumbing mess that is more-or-less original. I haven't changed it because I can feel the valve beginning to plug and have time to rinse the thing out and open it and clear it. Nope, that is Bayou water in there and not what it looks like! The red industrial hose goes to the deck pump-out.

 

[Seattle Scott]

Ed, in the process of doing some re-plumbing I swapped out my Whale gusher for a macerator. Just ask and the hand pump will be on its way to you. Same pump as shown in post #5.

 

[Ed Schenck]

Thanks for the offer Scott. That is Claude's boat and from the picture it appears hat the pump is also the valve. Is that the case? At any rate I will e-mail you with my thinking on the subject and for your macerator reasoning.

 

[kloudie1]

I have found that nothing except hydrochloric acid will dissolve the kidney stones..I took samples home and tried several different things to try to dissolve that stuff. I do the vinegar flush and it reduces formation, but doesn't stop it completely.
Ed, you are right no Y valve needed but the head always goes to the tank first. I figured that since yours is that way already, it might be easier to Tee into the pump out line and put a pump in there.. I haven't put in a macerator because I figure the kidney stones from the tank would really challenge its longevity.

 

[kloudie1]

Dogg, Interesting comment .. I never thought about eliminating the loop.. you are right, it really is not necessary since even if the pump valves leak, it would fill up the holding tank only to the water line level.. The head bowl top is slightly above the water level as well, so there is no chance of sinking if the thru hull is left open.

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

Hydrochloric acid is another name for muriatic acid

Distilled white vinegar, which is considerably more acidic than cider vinegar, will dissolve sea water minerals and urine crystals, but it's not practical for use in a tank discharge line because it needs to be used undiluted and about once a week to be effective. And while repeated "doses" of distilled white vinegar will eventually dissolve a heavy buildup, it's best used to prevent it.

As for whether a loop is necessary...your logic MIGHT be ok on a cat or powerboat that doesn't heel, but heeling changes the water on a monohull. Wind or sea conditions that cause a boat to heel even a few degrees can put a toilet bowl that's only slightly above waterline when the boat is at rest slightly below it... something that's sunk boats left with thru-hulls open in their slips. Sailing with the rails in the water can put the bowl--and the tank--WAY below the waterline. Which is why it's usually necessary to put vented loops several feet above the resting waterline to achieve the required 6-8" above waterline at any angle of heel.

So if you want to remove the loop (which could cause your boat to flunk an insurance survey), the pump should be moved to a location high enough above the tank to meet that requirement.