Fake Documentation Renewal Notice

kappykaplan · Feb 13, 2023

Art12050 said:
Beware….it’s all a fraud.

Yep, we get a thread or two on this every year. :beer:

Roland5048 · Feb 13, 2023

Just received mine in the mail 5 min. ago. Same address, same postmark. Get it every year at this time. Straight to the circular file. This notice isn't necessarily fake or fraudulent, however. They will renew for the exorbitant fee of $75 a year for a minimum of 5 yrs.

The real one comes from W.VA. and the renewal fee is $26/yr. that you can renew on-line. That one arrives about two months before the expiration date.

Scott T-Bird · Feb 13, 2023

Roland5048 said:
This notice isn't necessarily fake or fraudulent, however. They will renew for the exorbitant fee of $75 a year for a minimum of 5 yrs. The real one comes from W.VA.

You are right ... it is neither fraudulent nor is it fake. It's a real service providing a real Coast Guard Documentation update at a price that some are willing to pay. Rather, some may be tricked into paying. Their website is deceptive by appearing to be the official Coast Guard website ... but with careful examination you can discern the difference. The deception isn't illegal because they do provide the actual service. It's a free market ... they can charge an additional fee for their service if you choose (read "suckered") to go thru them. I don't think the Coast Guard can make them go away ...

dlochner · Feb 13, 2023

If you renew the documentation for 5 years you don't get these notices as often and for 5 years you are protected from rate increases.

Crusty Ol Salt · Feb 13, 2023

Scott T-Bird said:
You are right ... it is neither fraudulent nor is it fake. It's a real service providing a real Coast Guard Documentation update at a price that some are willing to pay. Rather, some may be tricked into paying. Their website is deceptive by appearing to be the official Coast Guard website ... but with careful examination you can discern the difference. The deception isn't illegal because they do provide the actual service. It's a free market ... they can charge an additional fee for their service if you choose (read "suckered") to go thru them. I don't think the Coast Guard can make them go away ...

I wonder if you sign something allowing them to act as your proxy or even worse, a power of attorney to act on your behalf. That could end up in a nightmare.

Scott T-Bird · Feb 13, 2023

dlochner said:
If you renew the documentation for 5 years you don't get these notices as often and for 5 years you are protected from rate increases.

yep, and if I'm not mistaken, this service seemed to pop up as a result of the multiple year option. Didn't they start marketing the multiple year documentation before the Coast Guard actually made it widely known that they offered that function? I believe now, the Coast Guard is either mandating or pushing the multi-year documentation ... at least I know they were two years ago when I was updating mine.

Scott T-Bird · Feb 13, 2023

Crusty Ol Salt said:
I wonder if you sign something allowing them to act as your proxy or even worse, a power of attorney to act on your behalf. That could end up in a nightmare.

No, it's just a simple service. They don't have power of attorney. You simply give them the info and $75 per year, they fill out the forms, submit, and pay the fee to the Coast Guard. Their fee is built in ($75 - $26 = $49 .... that's their profit). You get the documentation from the Coast Guard. If you pay for 5 years they make close to $250 from you and you're set for 5 years. You can get suckered again in 5 years if you want to.

Crusty Ol Salt · Feb 13, 2023

Scott T-Bird said:
No, it's just a simple service.

Ok, I think I got it. Like the young lady at the library who help me with my passport. That makes more sense.

dlochner · Feb 13, 2023

Scott T-Bird said:
yep, and if I'm not mistaken, this service seemed to pop up as a result of the multiple year option. Didn't they start marketing the multiple year documentation before the Coast Guard actually made it widely known that they offered that function? I believe now, the Coast Guard is either mandating or pushing the multi-year documentation ... at least I know they were two years ago when I was updating mine.

Back a few years that was their pitch, for the next 5 years they would take care of documentation for a premium so you wouldn't have to be bothered by filing out a simple form and mailing it back.

I think all documentations are now 5 years. It is a cost cutting move as eventually they will process fewer documentation renewals each year effectively reducing the cost. The only downside is for the boat owner who might sell their boat before the documentation needs renewing. There is no refund for unused years.

I like the 5 year plan and when my estate sells my boat, the unused years will be the least of their worries.

kloudie1 · Feb 13, 2023

About 20 years ago I got the notice and noticed that it was $25 to renew.. At that time, documentation renewal was free ; I thought that it was just another gubmint scheme to gouge the rich sailboat owners. I paid up and the documentation was properly renewed, but after some research, I found that I'd paid a "convenience fee" .. I never bit again but after that year, I got a bunch more offers to help me with my documentation papers.

Scott T-Bird · Feb 13, 2023

Art12050 said:
You can still renew annually for $26 directly form the CG. National Documentation Portal say it’s a minimum of 5. Fraud or no fraud, one things for sure, it’s a ripoff.

I hesitate to actually call it a ripoff, either. If your time is worth say $300 per hour or more, then it is probably worthwhile. They have overhead costs to pay for the service they provide, so they may be making a small margin.

Scott T-Bird · Feb 13, 2023

dlochner said:
I think all documentations are now 5 years. It is a cost cutting move as eventually they will process fewer documentation renewals each year effectively reducing the cost. The only downside is for the boat owner who might sell their boat before the documentation needs renewing. There is no refund for unused years.

I like the 5 year plan and when my estate sells my boat, the unused years will be the least of their worries.

If you sell your boat after 2 years in ... doesn't the new owner get credit for the remaining 3 years? I think they would. Sure, they still have to pay a separate fee for the new-owner reclassification. A savy seller would want credit for pre-paid fees ... just like a seller gets credit for pre-paid property taxes when selling property.

Justin_NSA · Feb 13, 2023

We ought to roll these all up into a sticky

dlochner · Feb 13, 2023

Scott T-Bird said:
If you sell your boat after 2 years in ... doesn't the new owner get credit for the remaining 3 years? I think they would. Sure, they still have to pay a separate fee for the new-owner reclassification. A savy seller would want credit for pre-paid fees ... just like a seller gets credit for pre-paid property taxes when selling property.

As I understand it, no. For most recreational boats USCG documentation is voluntary (unless the lender requires it). This is very different from property tax which is not voluntary. In the case of a property transaction, who pays a partial year tax assessment is part of the negotiation. While a savvy seller might get the buyer to pay the taxes, a savvy buyer might get the seller to cover the taxes for the remainder of the year. All depends on the negotiation skills of the parties and the market.

BigEasy · Feb 13, 2023

Any way you look at it is a rip off dealing with these scoundrels and deceitful at best. Recently had a heated discussion with a friend of mine about the authenticity of the "services" payment scheme; I finally convinced him to go the the real USCG site to get the official renewal fee schedule and terms. Once he obtained the real facts from the USCG site, he was angry at the deceitful manner in which the "service" solicited business. They always send their official looking letter a few months before the Coast Guard, in attempt to fool unsuspecting individuals to use their service.
BTW, I just renewed my documentation a few weeks ago through the USCG. The fee remains $26 annually and you can select any multiple up to five years; your choice. There is no convenience in using the "services" other than paying a hefty fee for them to submit your paper work to the USCG.

Richard19068 · Feb 13, 2023

Scott T-Bird said:
I hesitate to actually call it a ripoff, either. If your time is worth say $300 per hour or more, then it is probably worthwhile.

I respectfully disagree. Whatever adjective you want to apply to this "service" I think it is not worth five cents. It is so easy to renew directly with the coast guard I think it might actually take more time to respond to the misleading notice.

Mark Maulden · Feb 13, 2023

I came to the conclusion yrs ago, i do not need documentation…

Terry Cox · Feb 14, 2023

Received my renewal notice for $26 with a return address of National Vessel Notification Center, PO Box 1119, Falling Waters, WV 25419-1119. Looks legit.