Ensign Halyard on the Wrong Side?

[dkinzer]

I was inspecting the ensign halyard today to see if it needs replacing (it does), and it occurred to me that the halyard is on the wrong side. On our boat, which we just recently purchased, the ensign halyard is on attached to the port spreader. If we were to sail to another country (something that we hope to do sooner rather than later) we would need to hoist the Q flag on the starboard spreader, right?

I know that this boat has been to Canada and that it was originally purchased and registered in Washington. The log book has entries describing crossing over into Canada in the Strait of Juan de Fuca. The boat is USCG documented but I don't know if the previous Oregon owner did that or the original Washington owner did.

So, my question is: why would a boat have an ensign halyard on the port spreader but not have one on the starboard spreader?

 

[BigEasy]

So, my question is: why would a boat have an ensign halyard on the port spreader but not have one on the starboard spreader?

Apparently the previous owner(s) didn’t know the proper protocol for flying a “Q” flag and host country’s flag, burgees, etc.

 

[Caboteur]

Port side to hold a portable radar reflector?

 

[dlochner]

Previous owners have done all kinds of unimaginable things to boats.

It is common practice to hoist courtesy flags, YC burgees and such from the starboard spreader although I am unaware of any requirement to do so.

As @Caboteur says it could be for a radar reflector, that is where my radar reflector hangs.

 

[Joe]

Well, you can ask that question till you're blue in the face, but you'll never understand the motivation of the previous owner who made those trips successfully unless you talk to him directly. I'd be surprised if he said it caused a problem, otherwise he would have changed it. So, if it's bugging you till you can't sleep and you think it's going to ruin your cruising plans, rig one on starboard spreader yourself and have peace of mind. Okay, next problem.

 

[jssailem]

You will likely still be able to enter a foreign country. There maybe some snickering on the dock if you choose a Victoria slip in front of the Empress Hotel along the promenade from the high tea crowd.

While strict protocol calls for flying the Q not many do. I put up my Canadian Courtesy ensign along with a burgee, pull into port make a call to customs, 15 minutes and your on your way. With the Covid restrictions and the required plan for quarantine procedures, I had my Q ensign ready if needed. Never needed during my visit last year.

 

[dkinzer]

Port side to hold a portable radar reflector?

Interesting. I hadn't thought of that. The halyard that is there is about 1/8" diameter - I would expect something a bit heavier for a reflector but perhaps that is all that is needed.

 

[Scott T-Bird]

The boat is USCG documented but I don't know if the previous Oregon owner did that or the original Washington owner did.

I'm still stuck on this ... how do you not know? Did the seller give you a Bill of Sale on a Coast Guard form? Or did the seller provide a Title? Did you not update the Documentation now that you are owner? I had a boat that was once documented (perhaps when it was originally owned in Texas), but it was sold to me with New Jersey Title. The boat had a documentation number fixed on the inside, but it was not a currently documented boat. It had a NJ Title. I sold the boat with Title. My new boat was Documented and came from Massachusetts. I had a Bill of Sale and I had to update the Documentation (the previous owner called me when I didn't do it promptly enough and he received a notification for renewal!). I had to register the boat in New Jersey, but the registration did not come with Title. I was a little confused because I had to fill out a Title form - according to their on-line instructions (and registration form) and pay a fee for both registration and Title, but they explained to me that I should not receive any NJ Title because the boat is Federally Documented. I should have argued over the Title fee, but I was just happy to get out of there.

As far as the starboard / port flag raising ceremonies ... do you think anybody is really going to raise a fuss?

 

[dkinzer]

I'm still stuck on this ... how do you not know?

I know that it was documented when I bought it but it could have been any of the previous owners that initially documented the boat with the Coast Guard. I haven't seen any mention of it in the log book.

 

[jviss]

I think they are called flag halyards (the ensign is flown at the transom). Typically you'd have them on both sides, I think. My two boats did. The starboard side is the place of honor, so courtesy flag there, on top if there are others on that side. You can fly a yacht club burgee to port if not at the masthead.

 

[Scott T-Bird]

I know that it was documented when I bought it but it could have been any of the previous owners that initially documented the boat with the Coast Guard. I haven't seen any mention of it in the log book.

Did you update your Documentation? I don't understand any relevance to an owner prior to the previous owner who sold to you. How was it sold to you? With Coast Guard Bill of Sale or a state title?

Before you sail to Canada, I would be sure your documentation is current. That would be far more important than where the Q flag is put.

BTW, there is a separate Coast Guard form for changing the name and port of your documented vessel. If you need to do that, take care of it as well before you go to Canada.

 

[FastOlson]

The boat is USCG documented but I don't know if the previous Oregon owner did that or the original Washington owner did.

You should, as others have noted, found out all about this when you bought it. Matter of fact, such basics might be part of the survey. Documentation constitutes a title, and that is a 'big deal'.

Where to fly you courtesy flag is minor, by comparison.
All that aside, we have found that our stern post for the radar also provides a great place to fly our US flag, and this reserves the starboard burgee halyard for the Canadian courtesy flag...
If I need to fly our YC burgee when using a reciprocal privilege, I attach it below the courtesy flag.

In my limited experience, no one notices how you fly any flag unless it's obviously in a stupid location.

The important thing is to take a really good snapshot of your boat parked in front of the Empress!

 

[dkinzer]

Just to be clear, there is no issue with the USCG documentation. Although it took several months, we finally received the official USCG papers. In retrospect, I shouldn't have mentioned it at all.

 

[BarryL]

Hey,

Minor point - those flag halyards don't last forever. They chafe and wear and, at least on my boats, don't last more than a few years. So perhaps it's as simple as the starboard flag halyard just broke.

That reminds me I need to move the spreader block outboard 6" to minimize burgee chafe.

Barry

 

[Scott T-Bird]

Just to be clear, there is no issue with the USCG documentation. Although it took several months, we finally received the official USCG papers. In retrospect, I shouldn't have mentioned it at all.

Yes, it was a long wait! It was just odd the way that you mentioned it, as if you weren't aware of the paperwork involved in making the transfer. But, it would also not make any sense that you could have obtained the boat without going thru it.

I'd look for a small pad eye or even a small block hanging from it on the underside of the starboard spreader to see if there was once a halyard in place. I had a halyard on both sides until I replaced the rigging last winter. I forgot to put the halyards back on and never felt a need to last summer. Never missed them.

 

[Rick D]

FWIW, we just came back from a month in Mexico. The protocol is to fly the (Mexican) courtesy flag from the starboard. The Q flag is flown from the port (until cleared by a health inspector). Most of the US boats there are pretty good about flying the courtesy flags.
Interestingly, about 20 years ago, when I first returned from Mexico to the USA, I flew the Q flag as per protocol. When screened by Coast Guard via VHF just after crossing the border, I informed them I had the flag up. They immediately asked why, what was wrong? I told them I thought it was protocol. He just laughed, and said I was the only one he had seen actually do that. That was the last time I did that (upon returning)!