A simple question, under sail what it the correct thing to do, lock the prop by putting into reverse or just let it spin?
E33 - lock the prop or let it run free?
- Thread starter PaxiMoon
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PaxiMoon, the simple answer is neutral or reverse but never forward.
This was a discussion point at a recent Hunter rendezvous when Steve Pettengill was giving a presentation. His recommendation was to put the engine in reverse when at idle and turn the engine off, leaving the sail drive in reverse.
The SD 10 Owner's Manual is silent on this except to say:
“When the engine is off, and the boat sails, moves in tow or is anchored, the propeller may turn with the water current.”
The Hunter e33 Operator’s Manual Chapter 6 page 6.2 paragraph 6.1.2 Saildrive then under CAUTION reads:
“When your boat is under sail with the engine shut down, the saildrive must either me in neutral, allowing the propeller to spin, or reverse, locking it in place. Putting the saildrive into forward gear while undersail can damage the unit.”
I sail with the saildrive in reverse.
This was a discussion point at a recent Hunter rendezvous when Steve Pettengill was giving a presentation. His recommendation was to put the engine in reverse when at idle and turn the engine off, leaving the sail drive in reverse.
The SD 10 Owner's Manual is silent on this except to say:
“When the engine is off, and the boat sails, moves in tow or is anchored, the propeller may turn with the water current.”
The Hunter e33 Operator’s Manual Chapter 6 page 6.2 paragraph 6.1.2 Saildrive then under CAUTION reads:
“When your boat is under sail with the engine shut down, the saildrive must either me in neutral, allowing the propeller to spin, or reverse, locking it in place. Putting the saildrive into forward gear while undersail can damage the unit.”
I sail with the saildrive in reverse.
If these are Yanmar motors and saildrives they need to be left in neutral per the Yanmar MSA that supersedes anything from Hunter.
See this thread it will answer your questions.
A Definitive Answer From Yanmar (LINK)
The MSA from Yanmar
Maine Sail, the 2012 Hunter 33 comes fitted with the ZF (Hurth Marine) SD 10 saildrive. Or at least the Hunter (e)33 with the added Mariner package comes with the Yanmar 3YM30 and the SD 10.
The transmission should be in reverse. The reason is that since the engine does not run there is no oil circulation in the transmission gearbox therefore the gears should not spin without oil otherwise there will be excessive wear on the gears.
This is directly from the SD-10 manual:
"Boat sailing, moving in tow or anchoring when the engine is off, and the boat sails, moves in tow or is anchored, the propeller may turn with the water current."
If this new ZF box is a typical ZF then it can likely safely be locked in reverse but I would check with Yanmar before doing so. All their previous sail legs fall under the MSA. ZF has built some cone clutch systems and this may also be a cone which should be left to spin in neutral or locked with a shaft lock. Check with Yanmar and get it in writing. Owners manuals are often horribly inaccurate..
Maine, I'm not sure that Yanmar would have any interest in this, but I will shoot an email off to them to find out. I expect that Yanmar packages their engines with the SD20. I believe that Hunter has married the SD 10 to the 3YM30. And therefore it is a ZF issue vice Yanmar. More to follow.
Let us know what you find out. The SD-20's etc, are all NEUTRAL only unless a shaft brake is used. Historically ZF/Hurth has said neutral OR reverse but never the same direction of travel. Info and exploded diagrams on the new SD-10's are hard to find...
I covered all bases and sent both ZF and Yanmar very similar emails. I will post the results on this forum.
The SD 10 appears to be very robust given that it can be fitted on engines up to 75 horsies vice the SD 20 up to the 29 hp. Oil in the SD 20 must be changed every 100 hours or once a year, the SD 10 every 250 hours or once a year. Both have to be hauled to do it though.
The SD 10 appears to be very robust given that it can be fitted on engines up to 75 horsies vice the SD 20 up to the 29 hp. Oil in the SD 20 must be changed every 100 hours or once a year, the SD 10 every 250 hours or once a year. Both have to be hauled to do it though.
'kay. One down one to go. Note: In my email to Yanmar, I had also mentioned the bulletin that they had issued pertaining to the gear position for the SD 20 saildrive, while sailing.
Here is what Yanmar's response has to say:
... "I would first like to thank you for taking the time to send in your kind inquiry.
The bulletin you have kindly outlining below is for a Yanmar/Kanzaki (Kanzaki is a division of Yanmar) transmission or a Yanmar Sail drive. This advisory does not comment on other manufacturers products. Since this is a product of ZF and manufactured by ZF, my suggestion would be for you to contact ZF to see what there recommendations are for operating the sail drive while under sail with the engine in the off position.
I have provided contact information for you.
ZF Marine LLC
15351 SW 29th Street, Suite 300
Miramar 33027"
Now what I also take from this is that Yanmar dealers may but will not necessarily be authorized to do warranty work on the ZF saildrive. This could be a problem area in the future with finger pointing. Hmmm.
Still awaiting for a reply from ZF.
Here is what Yanmar's response has to say:
... "I would first like to thank you for taking the time to send in your kind inquiry.
The bulletin you have kindly outlining below is for a Yanmar/Kanzaki (Kanzaki is a division of Yanmar) transmission or a Yanmar Sail drive. This advisory does not comment on other manufacturers products. Since this is a product of ZF and manufactured by ZF, my suggestion would be for you to contact ZF to see what there recommendations are for operating the sail drive while under sail with the engine in the off position.
I have provided contact information for you.
ZF Marine LLC
15351 SW 29th Street, Suite 300
Miramar 33027"
Now what I also take from this is that Yanmar dealers may but will not necessarily be authorized to do warranty work on the ZF saildrive. This could be a problem area in the future with finger pointing. Hmmm.
Still awaiting for a reply from ZF.
Second response is in from ZF. I have attached the PDF file of the Owner's Manual. I missed that information when I skimmed through my manual yesterday. The email from ZF is as follows:
"Congratulations on your new boat. Attached is the operational and maintenance manual for the ZF SD10 sail drive. On page 8 will be the instruction for the position of the gear while under sail power.
2.Sailing:
Boat sailing, moving in tow or anchoring. When the engine is off and the boat sails, moves in tow or is anchored, the propeller may turn with the water current.
CAUTION. When the boat sails with engine switched off the shift position of the gearbox can be:
1) in neutral position and in this case the propeller is free to rotate.
2) in the opposite position of the travel direction to lock the propeller.
Note: do not put the shifting lever of the gearbox in forward position, otherwise the transmission could be damaged!
I hope this answers your question and if you need more assistance let us know.
Best regards,
Jay Denckla
Industrial Technology
Business Unit Marine Propulsion Systems
Sales Department
Account Manager, West Coast
ZF Marine, LLC
12125 Harbour Reach Drive Ste B / Mukilteo, WA 98275
Phone: 425-583-1900, Fax: 425-493-1579"
jay.denckla@zf.com
"Congratulations on your new boat. Attached is the operational and maintenance manual for the ZF SD10 sail drive. On page 8 will be the instruction for the position of the gear while under sail power.
2.Sailing:
Boat sailing, moving in tow or anchoring. When the engine is off and the boat sails, moves in tow or is anchored, the propeller may turn with the water current.
CAUTION. When the boat sails with engine switched off the shift position of the gearbox can be:
1) in neutral position and in this case the propeller is free to rotate.
2) in the opposite position of the travel direction to lock the propeller.
Note: do not put the shifting lever of the gearbox in forward position, otherwise the transmission could be damaged!
I hope this answers your question and if you need more assistance let us know.
Best regards,
Jay Denckla
Industrial Technology
Business Unit Marine Propulsion Systems
Sales Department
Account Manager, West Coast
ZF Marine, LLC
12125 Harbour Reach Drive Ste B / Mukilteo, WA 98275
Phone: 425-583-1900, Fax: 425-493-1579"
jay.denckla@zf.com
Fantastic information Len, there is so much mis-information on this subject I was not sure what was correct and had also missed the info in the manual. I hate the noise of the prop turning had always locked the prop in reverse, but had also been told it must run free.
Now I will continue with the prop locked in reverse.
Cheers Richard
Now I will continue with the prop locked in reverse.
Cheers Richard
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