First of all, I'm new to sailing. Been a "powerboat guy" for many years. I've learned to sail on an O'Day 22, which I currently have and love. However, we all must have bigger boats. That's a rule, I think?? I'm planning purchasing a larger sailboat with coastal cursing in mind. Gulf
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Chlorox bottles? NO WAY!
Blue water cruising? A Hunter 33 or any thin hulled chlorox bottle? No way. Put jsut a little more money into the piggy bank, shop a little harder and look for a good old Alberg 30+, Contessa, Cape Dory 30+. In otherwords a SOLIDLY built boat with a rudder that doesn't hang out in the boondocks unprotected. Yes, I know, I can hear the screams of anger, angst, & pain already. But I stand by what I say, and the record of these solid built cruisers placed side to side with the likes of Hunters and Morgans etc will make those 'yuppy' party boats appear for what they are. Okay, off my soapbax
Seriously look at the 'classics' and really, really do your homework. Didereaux
Blue water cruising? A Hunter 33 or any thin hulled chlorox bottle? No way. Put jsut a little more money into the piggy bank, shop a little harder and look for a good old Alberg 30+, Contessa, Cape Dory 30+. In otherwords a SOLIDLY built boat with a rudder that doesn't hang out in the boondocks unprotected. Yes, I know, I can hear the screams of anger, angst, & pain already. But I stand by what I say, and the record of these solid built cruisers placed side to side with the likes of Hunters and Morgans etc will make those 'yuppy' party boats appear for what they are. Okay, off my soapbax
Seriously look at the 'classics' and really, really do your homework. DidereauxBig "D"
I'll take bitter for 5,000!! *yks Wow, sounds like you've had some bad experiences in life. (like maybe sniffing that clorox bottle a bit too much) Just realize that there is a boat out there for everyone for the purpose that they intend to use it for. Not everyone needs what you do.
I'll take bitter for 5,000!! *yks Wow, sounds like you've had some bad experiences in life. (like maybe sniffing that clorox bottle a bit too much) Just realize that there is a boat out there for everyone for the purpose that they intend to use it for. Not everyone needs what you do.
Consider water depth
If you are wanting to get into areas that are shallower I would go with the shoal draft. If depth is not an issue go with the deep draft. The deep draft boat should point better.
If you are wanting to get into areas that are shallower I would go with the shoal draft. If depth is not an issue go with the deep draft. The deep draft boat should point better.
The Loop?
Not being from the East, not sure what you mean by "The loop", but the H33 I would expect should be fine for the coastal stuff and Bahamas. For the Bahamas and Keys, as I understand, however, you're best advised to consider a pretty shallow draft. The 4 ft version would be better for these areas, but not so good for longer offshore stuff. I've sailed my Catalina 27 all over Northern Calif, from Monterey to Bodega Bay (100 mi +/- north/south of San Francisco), and with a little more work on her, wouldn't hesitate to take her to LA (400 mi)or Cabo San Lucas (1,000 mi), both coastal trips. I'd think long & hard about Taking the 27 to Hawaii (2000+ mi, all offshore) however. The recommended Alberg 30, Cape Dorys etc are unbeatable offshore boats, capable of long passages in deep water, but you're doing coastal stuff, where the requirements are less onerous.
Not being from the East, not sure what you mean by "The loop", but the H33 I would expect should be fine for the coastal stuff and Bahamas. For the Bahamas and Keys, as I understand, however, you're best advised to consider a pretty shallow draft. The 4 ft version would be better for these areas, but not so good for longer offshore stuff. I've sailed my Catalina 27 all over Northern Calif, from Monterey to Bodega Bay (100 mi +/- north/south of San Francisco), and with a little more work on her, wouldn't hesitate to take her to LA (400 mi)or Cabo San Lucas (1,000 mi), both coastal trips. I'd think long & hard about Taking the 27 to Hawaii (2000+ mi, all offshore) however. The recommended Alberg 30, Cape Dorys etc are unbeatable offshore boats, capable of long passages in deep water, but you're doing coastal stuff, where the requirements are less onerous.
Shallow is better, both will work
for you where you're going. Expect to run aground more often in the ICW with the deep keel
for you where you're going. Expect to run aground more often in the ICW with the deep keel
H33C
The Hunter 33 Cher. is a great boat. A lot out there that do what you have in mind. There is a performance trade-off when you go to a shoal keel. Boat won't point as high, but it might get to a few places in Florida and the Bahamas that a deep keel wouldn't. That extra 15" makes a difference. Whether you can use a deep keel or need to go with a shoal keel is very dependent on where you want to go. There are some rather shallow areas in the Bahamas and Florida. If you go with a deep keel, you just have to pay attention to the water depth a little more.
The Hunter 33 Cher. is a great boat. A lot out there that do what you have in mind. There is a performance trade-off when you go to a shoal keel. Boat won't point as high, but it might get to a few places in Florida and the Bahamas that a deep keel wouldn't. That extra 15" makes a difference. Whether you can use a deep keel or need to go with a shoal keel is very dependent on where you want to go. There are some rather shallow areas in the Bahamas and Florida. If you go with a deep keel, you just have to pay attention to the water depth a little more.
So Didereaux ...
You obviously have strong feelings on this subject. It's a subject I have a lot of interest in because I sail my H37.5 in a lot of very challenging waters. I have been searching for some valid information on hull strength and structure of Hunter vs. other makes of sailboat based on design, construction methods etc. All I find is opinion and hearsay. What's the basis for your conclusion that Hunter hulls aren't solidly built? With respect to rudder failures, yes some Hunters have had rudder failures and a balanced rudder is certainly exposed (it's also more efficient). But what's the source of your data that says Hunter rudder failures are more frequent than those of other makes. The Sail magazine article you alluded to on Mike Harker's rudder failure on his H466 due to a collision with an underwater object also quotes a statistic that the rudder failure rate on the Pacific Cup race between San Francisco and Hawaii is between two and three percent (not many Hunters there). They have required an alternative steering system that has been installed and tested for all entrants in the race. I'm not being defensive here. My life and my wife's are dependent on the integrity of our boat. I'd just like some hard data. You mention Coast Guard statistics. Are they available on a web site? Gary Wyngarden S/V Wanderlust H37.5
You obviously have strong feelings on this subject. It's a subject I have a lot of interest in because I sail my H37.5 in a lot of very challenging waters. I have been searching for some valid information on hull strength and structure of Hunter vs. other makes of sailboat based on design, construction methods etc. All I find is opinion and hearsay. What's the basis for your conclusion that Hunter hulls aren't solidly built? With respect to rudder failures, yes some Hunters have had rudder failures and a balanced rudder is certainly exposed (it's also more efficient). But what's the source of your data that says Hunter rudder failures are more frequent than those of other makes. The Sail magazine article you alluded to on Mike Harker's rudder failure on his H466 due to a collision with an underwater object also quotes a statistic that the rudder failure rate on the Pacific Cup race between San Francisco and Hawaii is between two and three percent (not many Hunters there). They have required an alternative steering system that has been installed and tested for all entrants in the race. I'm not being defensive here. My life and my wife's are dependent on the integrity of our boat. I'd just like some hard data. You mention Coast Guard statistics. Are they available on a web site? Gary Wyngarden S/V Wanderlust H37.5
I agree, scientific thought over opinion
Gary, et. al., I'm an old sailor but not bold. I want a safe boat to sail and have had four Hunters. Some time ago I asked the question that you raised about the strength of the hulls, cabins, windows, etc. At that time Hunter told me that each of its dealers had a video promotion type that showed how Hunters are made. In the video are shown research devices design to measure the breaking strenth of fibreglass, window material, and so on. All of that data appears to exceed some of the blue water boats traditional strength. Cabin tops (and sides) were also subjected to stress punishment. The dealer in our area (Signature Yachts) had a box load of them the last time I looked. They are free. A few years ago I had the priviledge of speaking to Jim Pettingill (I'm not sure of the spelling of his last name) who raced around the world in "Thursday's Child," and was for a time associated with Hunter as their main person as he put it, "to break up each boat." A short article in Cruising World by the editor told how he and Pettingill would take a Hunter and literally flop it off a wave onto its side and crash it to see where it would come apart if they did. Jim was one of five people in the company that could change things in the line of construction. There is a Hunter 34 in the archives that has sailed across the Atlantic several times and I suspect we might find other makes that have done the same thing in all oceans. If I were CEO of a boat manufacterer, I would want to be sure no one could sue me for not building my product strong enough. And I would have my data on file for all to see. To all: I don't understand this preoccupation with traditional so called "blue water boats." I have sailed a number of them and they are heavier and in a few instances (a Gult 39 and a Fast Passage 39) harder to sail. Life changes. We build our houses differently but stronger and warmer, our cars have much more plastic but are safer, and I know that Boeings builds planes that are lighter and stronger. Why not boats? If these "blue water boats" are so good, why are they racing Open sixties around the world? There is a logic here that escapes me. Hunter has been building boats for 30 years. I'm sure they have learned from their mistakes but I'm also sure they have learned from research. If one has a question about how a Hunter is built I would contact them and ask for the DVD that is now available. Or go see your dealer. I think that if people have an opinion about what THEY think is right for them to cross an ocean, I will be more interested in their thoughts--I might learn something. However, when they start bashing my beloved (and researched) Hunter 380, I get upset. Les Blackwell H380 Trumpeter Sailing out of Bellingham, WA
Gary, et. al., I'm an old sailor but not bold. I want a safe boat to sail and have had four Hunters. Some time ago I asked the question that you raised about the strength of the hulls, cabins, windows, etc. At that time Hunter told me that each of its dealers had a video promotion type that showed how Hunters are made. In the video are shown research devices design to measure the breaking strenth of fibreglass, window material, and so on. All of that data appears to exceed some of the blue water boats traditional strength. Cabin tops (and sides) were also subjected to stress punishment. The dealer in our area (Signature Yachts) had a box load of them the last time I looked. They are free. A few years ago I had the priviledge of speaking to Jim Pettingill (I'm not sure of the spelling of his last name) who raced around the world in "Thursday's Child," and was for a time associated with Hunter as their main person as he put it, "to break up each boat." A short article in Cruising World by the editor told how he and Pettingill would take a Hunter and literally flop it off a wave onto its side and crash it to see where it would come apart if they did. Jim was one of five people in the company that could change things in the line of construction. There is a Hunter 34 in the archives that has sailed across the Atlantic several times and I suspect we might find other makes that have done the same thing in all oceans. If I were CEO of a boat manufacterer, I would want to be sure no one could sue me for not building my product strong enough. And I would have my data on file for all to see. To all: I don't understand this preoccupation with traditional so called "blue water boats." I have sailed a number of them and they are heavier and in a few instances (a Gult 39 and a Fast Passage 39) harder to sail. Life changes. We build our houses differently but stronger and warmer, our cars have much more plastic but are safer, and I know that Boeings builds planes that are lighter and stronger. Why not boats? If these "blue water boats" are so good, why are they racing Open sixties around the world? There is a logic here that escapes me. Hunter has been building boats for 30 years. I'm sure they have learned from their mistakes but I'm also sure they have learned from research. If one has a question about how a Hunter is built I would contact them and ask for the DVD that is now available. Or go see your dealer. I think that if people have an opinion about what THEY think is right for them to cross an ocean, I will be more interested in their thoughts--I might learn something. However, when they start bashing my beloved (and researched) Hunter 380, I get upset. Les Blackwell H380 Trumpeter Sailing out of Bellingham, WA
Didereaux, FYI - yuppies are people too
Chlorox bottles are very well designed. They contain a highly toxic and corrosive liquid and do it quite effectively and with amazing efficiency. Have you read the lable on your toilet brush? My guess is that you may be using it improperly.
Chlorox bottles are very well designed. They contain a highly toxic and corrosive liquid and do it quite effectively and with amazing efficiency. Have you read the lable on your toilet brush? My guess is that you may be using it improperly.
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