I'm new at cruising-sailing, (old day-sailor), can anyone tell me if there is a difference in diesel fuel bought at a gas station versus a marina? I have an inboard Yanmar diesel and I want to fill the tank and work on the engine. Any help greatly appreciated. Thanks, Mark Crociati
- Status
Diesel
Mark, I asked the same question about a month ago. Never really go a firm answer. Another chat board on diesels recommended going to the marina with a gerry can. My research didn't show that much difference in the fuels. I will be using home heating oil (off-road farm diesel) when working on mine this year. Best of luck, Bryon Thomas "Shore Leave"
Mark, I asked the same question about a month ago. Never really go a firm answer. Another chat board on diesels recommended going to the marina with a gerry can. My research didn't show that much difference in the fuels. I will be using home heating oil (off-road farm diesel) when working on mine this year. Best of luck, Bryon Thomas "Shore Leave"
Yes it the same
The only difference is in the coloring for the purpose of identifing the taxes that have been paid on the fuel.
The only difference is in the coloring for the purpose of identifing the taxes that have been paid on the fuel.
and the taxes mean the price...
in this area, at least, diseal is generally cheaper at the marinas than on the road. Road tax runs the price up for vehicles, which I believe is the reason for the coloring. If price is the issue, it's generally cheaper here to fill up at the marinas than haul cans.
in this area, at least, diseal is generally cheaper at the marinas than on the road. Road tax runs the price up for vehicles, which I believe is the reason for the coloring. If price is the issue, it's generally cheaper here to fill up at the marinas than haul cans.
It's the same
The diesel fuel is the same. The stuff at the truck stops is not dyed red to indicate that road tax have not been paid at the pump but through the ISP fuel programs. That is why it costs 1300 to 1400 dollars to reg a semi truck for six months. Your paying the fuel taxes up front. The dyed fuel means that your paying the fuel taxes at the pump. Basicly that is the only difference between the fuels.
The diesel fuel is the same. The stuff at the truck stops is not dyed red to indicate that road tax have not been paid at the pump but through the ISP fuel programs. That is why it costs 1300 to 1400 dollars to reg a semi truck for six months. Your paying the fuel taxes up front. The dyed fuel means that your paying the fuel taxes at the pump. Basicly that is the only difference between the fuels.
Low sulfur
The fuel on the road has less sulfur than the marine grade stuff. Low sulfur is a good thing, but the process to reduce the sulfur also takes away some of the lubricity of the fuel. You might consider additives if you go with the High priced Low Sulfur Diesel.
The fuel on the road has less sulfur than the marine grade stuff. Low sulfur is a good thing, but the process to reduce the sulfur also takes away some of the lubricity of the fuel. You might consider additives if you go with the High priced Low Sulfur Diesel.
Rob, you're looking to start another argument
aren't you? Lot's of people would disagree with your statement, including me.
aren't you? Lot's of people would disagree with your statement, including me.
They are the same thing
Road and marine diesel are the same thing only the marine is dyed red, as stated earlier for tax reasons. Home heating fuel is still #2 fuel, but isn't filtered as well and there are no additives in it that an engine needs*. Home burner will burn just about anything and are designed that way. Buy the road or marina fuel for your engine. But if you want to keep it legal, buy the marina fuel. For the cost difference and the amount of fuel you will use in a season, it's worth it to buy at the marina. * This was advised in a diesel maintenance course that I took one time at Hansen Marine in Marblehead, MA.
Road and marine diesel are the same thing only the marine is dyed red, as stated earlier for tax reasons. Home heating fuel is still #2 fuel, but isn't filtered as well and there are no additives in it that an engine needs*. Home burner will burn just about anything and are designed that way. Buy the road or marina fuel for your engine. But if you want to keep it legal, buy the marina fuel. For the cost difference and the amount of fuel you will use in a season, it's worth it to buy at the marina. * This was advised in a diesel maintenance course that I took one time at Hansen Marine in Marblehead, MA.
2 Cents Worth
Hi Mark: I'm not too sure if I understand the reason for your question. If you are talking about driving 50 miles to a marina to get fuel,or 2 miles to a truck stop to get enough fuel to top off your boat and this is just a one time event, go to the truck stop, regular diesel will not hurt your boat. If you are talking about economics, unless you do an awfully amount of motoring, you probably will be hard put to burn more than 20 gallons in a season, these things don't use that much. I keep my boat at a full service marina so it's easier for me to motor over to the fuel pump. I like to keep my leisurely lifting activities confined to cold ones rather than jerry cans.
Hi Mark: I'm not too sure if I understand the reason for your question. If you are talking about driving 50 miles to a marina to get fuel,or 2 miles to a truck stop to get enough fuel to top off your boat and this is just a one time event, go to the truck stop, regular diesel will not hurt your boat. If you are talking about economics, unless you do an awfully amount of motoring, you probably will be hard put to burn more than 20 gallons in a season, these things don't use that much. I keep my boat at a full service marina so it's easier for me to motor over to the fuel pump. I like to keep my leisurely lifting activities confined to cold ones rather than jerry cans.
fuel taxes
hey Paul, it's actually the other way-the marine fuel is dyed red because it doesn't have the road taxes added on it-it's illegal to use marine diesel in a road vehicle, not the other way around. even with the marine markup, the diesel at the dock (marblehead, no less) is about 10 cents a galon cheaper than at my local gas station.
hey Paul, it's actually the other way-the marine fuel is dyed red because it doesn't have the road taxes added on it-it's illegal to use marine diesel in a road vehicle, not the other way around. even with the marine markup, the diesel at the dock (marblehead, no less) is about 10 cents a galon cheaper than at my local gas station.
Your best price in fuel..
....is #2 heating oil!! Been using it in my car and boat for ten years. Only difference is the color due to a red dye that is added to heating oil. BUT its 30% to 40% cheaper than diesel. Last summer I was paying .97/gal. Right now it is up to 1.22 which is still .70/gal less than the pump.
....is #2 heating oil!! Been using it in my car and boat for ten years. Only difference is the color due to a red dye that is added to heating oil. BUT its 30% to 40% cheaper than diesel. Last summer I was paying .97/gal. Right now it is up to 1.22 which is still .70/gal less than the pump.
red dye packs
around here the red dye is a pack they put in the tank after the diesel is put in, same diesel as what you put in your car. I guess all of those backhoes and doziers that use the dyed fuel don't need the low sulfer content. I think they work harder than a semi going down the road.
around here the red dye is a pack they put in the tank after the diesel is put in, same diesel as what you put in your car. I guess all of those backhoes and doziers that use the dyed fuel don't need the low sulfer content. I think they work harder than a semi going down the road.
Alan
Be vewy, vewy careful using the diesel in your vehicle with the red dye. Down here they occasionally check. If they pull a sample from your tank and it has the red dye - a MAJOR fine for running fuel in a vehicle that hasn't been levied road taxes. I'm talking in the tens of thousands of dollars in some states.....Other than the dye, it's all the same. The dye is placed there for one reason - enforcement. And they do enforce.
Be vewy, vewy careful using the diesel in your vehicle with the red dye. Down here they occasionally check. If they pull a sample from your tank and it has the red dye - a MAJOR fine for running fuel in a vehicle that hasn't been levied road taxes. I'm talking in the tens of thousands of dollars in some states.....Other than the dye, it's all the same. The dye is placed there for one reason - enforcement. And they do enforce.
Dyed vs. Undyed Diesel - The Real Story
I've been a petroleum distributor for 15 years and a sailor for the past four years. Here are some facts applicable to diesel fuels sold in Virginia. Years ago, diesel was all the same, known as on-road, off-road, #2 fuel, and home heating oil. It was all clear in color and all high sulfer content. Fuel intended for highway use (On-road) has always had highway taxes added to the price (40.9 cents/gal in VA)and we pay it at the wholesale rack and pass this on to all of our customers (if you are tax exempt and fill out the forms, we don't pass on this tax and we get a refund from the wholesale rack). Truckers/diesel car owners were wise to this and would order home heating oil for their home tanks, fill their vehicles and beat the IRS out of 41 cents per gal. The IRS got wise, now all home heating oil and off-road fuel (for use in road construction vehicles, farm tractors, etc) must be dyed red. If a trucker has red fuel in his tanks, he is busted big time by the IRS for tax evasion. Next, the EPA got into it, they now mandate low-sulfer diesel for all on-road uses (max sulfer content of .5% - a new super low sulfer mandate is coming soon). So now, all the diesel fuel you buy at a gas station is low-sulfer, clear, taxed diesel. All off-road, heating oil, #2 fuel oil is dyed red fuel and allowed to have a higher sulfer content (and does have more engine lubrucity than the low-sulfer fuel). We sell this type of fuel to marinas since marine use is "off road" and road taxes are not applicable. Final twist "they don't make it like they used to". Diesel fuels do not have the stability they had years ago due to the modern catalytic cracking refining processes. It has a shelf life of about six months before it starts to break down and "sludge up", it gets little waxy dark globuals in it as it trys to return to its crude oil origination. You can stop this process by adding an after market fuel stabilizer product. For my nine gallon boat tank - I buy on-road diesel (lower sulfer-less smoke, gas station tanks turn the fuel faster and it hasn't been sitting in the marina storage tank destabilizing for the six winter months), I add fuel stabilizer and anti-bacterial/fungicide additive treatment. Water and dirt particles are the diesel engine's biggest enemies. If fuel gets water in it, bacteria/algae grow in the water and eat the carbon in the fuel stopping up your fuel filters = dead in the water and more sailing fun. Hope this helps, Frank
I've been a petroleum distributor for 15 years and a sailor for the past four years. Here are some facts applicable to diesel fuels sold in Virginia. Years ago, diesel was all the same, known as on-road, off-road, #2 fuel, and home heating oil. It was all clear in color and all high sulfer content. Fuel intended for highway use (On-road) has always had highway taxes added to the price (40.9 cents/gal in VA)and we pay it at the wholesale rack and pass this on to all of our customers (if you are tax exempt and fill out the forms, we don't pass on this tax and we get a refund from the wholesale rack). Truckers/diesel car owners were wise to this and would order home heating oil for their home tanks, fill their vehicles and beat the IRS out of 41 cents per gal. The IRS got wise, now all home heating oil and off-road fuel (for use in road construction vehicles, farm tractors, etc) must be dyed red. If a trucker has red fuel in his tanks, he is busted big time by the IRS for tax evasion. Next, the EPA got into it, they now mandate low-sulfer diesel for all on-road uses (max sulfer content of .5% - a new super low sulfer mandate is coming soon). So now, all the diesel fuel you buy at a gas station is low-sulfer, clear, taxed diesel. All off-road, heating oil, #2 fuel oil is dyed red fuel and allowed to have a higher sulfer content (and does have more engine lubrucity than the low-sulfer fuel). We sell this type of fuel to marinas since marine use is "off road" and road taxes are not applicable. Final twist "they don't make it like they used to". Diesel fuels do not have the stability they had years ago due to the modern catalytic cracking refining processes. It has a shelf life of about six months before it starts to break down and "sludge up", it gets little waxy dark globuals in it as it trys to return to its crude oil origination. You can stop this process by adding an after market fuel stabilizer product. For my nine gallon boat tank - I buy on-road diesel (lower sulfer-less smoke, gas station tanks turn the fuel faster and it hasn't been sitting in the marina storage tank destabilizing for the six winter months), I add fuel stabilizer and anti-bacterial/fungicide additive treatment. Water and dirt particles are the diesel engine's biggest enemies. If fuel gets water in it, bacteria/algae grow in the water and eat the carbon in the fuel stopping up your fuel filters = dead in the water and more sailing fun. Hope this helps, Frank
Turn Over
Mark, My only advise is to make sure that the station or marina you use for topping off does a healthy turn over in business. Diesel normally has some water in it, and small stations or marinas with low turnover of the fuel tend to have more than most. Dan
Mark, My only advise is to make sure that the station or marina you use for topping off does a healthy turn over in business. Diesel normally has some water in it, and small stations or marinas with low turnover of the fuel tend to have more than most. Dan
Dan, good point...
For those of us on the Ches. Bay, may want to consider if the marina's tanks got covered in Hurricane Isabel. As much as I like the folks at Skipper's Pier fuel dock on Rockhold Creek, his tanks were under 3-4 feet of water and probably took some on. I'm buying highway diesel in cans from Park's Liquor instead. Frank
For those of us on the Ches. Bay, may want to consider if the marina's tanks got covered in Hurricane Isabel. As much as I like the folks at Skipper's Pier fuel dock on Rockhold Creek, his tanks were under 3-4 feet of water and probably took some on. I'm buying highway diesel in cans from Park's Liquor instead. Frank
- Status