CSM vs Hypalon

[DJW]

Looking at a new achilles dinghy. Is CSM and Hypalon one and the same products? In researching CSM it appears to be the same product. The product information on the Achilles web page shows Lex 88 being made with CSM. I want to get a dinghy but I do not want one made out of PVC. It will be used on our 42' Cascade in HI. It will be stored up in the v-berth when not being used and it does get warm in the summer. A friend gave us his WM Zodaic inflatable floor dinghy which I believe is PVC when my son sold his boat for him but he had left it out on the deck for a couple of year just laying there half out of the carry bag and the floor has come unglued. The dinghy was maybe 5-6 years old and had maybe 2 hours of on the water time but the guy walked away from his boat and just it go to #$%^.

Dennis

 

[Stephan]

Hi Dennis,

Hypalon® is a registered trademark owned by DuPont for their chlorosulfonated polyethylene, a synthetic rubber used in the outer coating of inflatable boat fabrics. In the inflatable boat industry, fabric coated with similar forms of chlorosulfonated polyethylene are referred to as “CSM” fabric (ChloroSulfonated Material) and share the same properties of resistance to chemicals, temperature extremes and ultraviolet light.

In 2010, DuPont discontinued the production of their Hypalon® product. However, there are other manufacturers who will continue to produce their synthetic rubber for use in the production of CSM fabric.

CSM and Hypalon® are simply two names for the same chlorosulfonated polyethylene synthetic rubber coated fabric product. The trademark Hypalon® will likely continue to be used, colloquially, in reference to CSM fabrics for years to come.

No inflatable boats from any manufacturer will be made with Hypalon® as the product is no longer being produced.

Hope that helps.

Stephan

 

[DJW]

Stephan

So it is one and the same and has no relationship with inflatables made out of pvc correct?

Dennis

 

[Stephan]

Yes, CSM & Hypalon are the same material.

Stephan

So it is one and the same and has no relationship with inflatables made out of pvc correct?

Dennis

PVC coated fabrics are plastic elastomer. Totally different from CSM/Hypalon and there are many, many more grades of PVC coated fabrics than there are synthetic rubber fabrics. Some great, some good, some bad and some afwul....

Inflatable boat fabrics are essentially a base cloth (with varying thread material, weave and tenacity), with a coating of PVC, rubber or polyurethane, for a finished product that will have varying life expectancy, strength, tear & abrasion resistance and air holding integrity.

Given what you described, I would go Hypalon. The Achilles LS2RU would probably serve you better as a water taxi than the LEX series. Much easier assembly and break-down.

Stephan

 

[Steve Dion]

Dennis:

Caribe, APEX, AB, Avon, Achilles all make very good quality inflatables. You are wise staying away from PVC.

We just purchased a used 1994 APEX 10 ft RIB for $1,000. It is still in very good condition. One advantage of some of these units is larger tubes. You may want to check around before you purchase one. Also check out the availability of repair facilities for your location. It could be expensive to ship one back to the mainland for repairs.

 

[DJW]

Steve

There is a inflatable boat repair guy in Honolulu who has been around for 10-15 years. I spoke with him about the WM Zodiac inflatable bottom dinghy that was given to us and he said the same thing that Stephan did that he could reglue it but it would not be cheap and that it might not be worth it.

Dennis

 

[cat30]

hypalon repair

anyone know if you can use 5200 for repair on dinghy? for patches or parts that hold the lines?

 

[Compromise]

anyone know if you can use 5200 for repair on dinghy? for patches or parts that hold the lines?

The 3M 5200 works well on Hypalon and will work for pinhole leaks on PVC. It won't hold on large repairs on PVC. I've heard HH-66 works well on PVC. I've got a PVC Zodiac and am currently restoring it.

 

[Gunni]

PVC inflatables are incredibly easy to patch. Other than the weight advantage, ease of novice patching is best. A can of HH-66, tin of acetone, 1/4 sht. of sandpaper, and a swatch of hull fabric and you will have her back in the water in minutes with a permanent patch.

The disadvantage of PVC is UV exposure. But if you plan to store her inside the boat you can get a lighter, more compact inflatable, at a better price. It will smell better too.

 

[Steve Dion]

PVC inflatables are incredibly easy to patch. Other than the weight advantage, ease of novice patching is best. A can of HH-66, tin of acetone, 1/4 sht. of sandpaper, and a swatch of hull fabric and you will have her back in the water in minutes with a permanent patch.

The disadvantage of PVC is UV exposure. But if you plan to store her inside the boat you can get a lighter, more compact inflatable, at a better price. It will smell better too.

The real disadvantage of a PVC inflatable is the problem with the seams. When they split (and they do) it is nearly impossible to repair. They are not that much cheaper considering the short life.

For price comparison a WM 10' unit is $2000 for PVC and $2600 for hypalon. I would NOT suggest a WM unit, but this is just for price comparison.

 

[jviss]

5200?

anyone know if you can use 5200 for repair on dinghy? for patches or parts that hold the lines?

Why on earth would you use 5200 for a Hypalon repair? 5200 is expensive, the tube of stuff is likely to harden once it's used. And there is a correct way to repair Hypalon that doesn't happen to include 5200.

This company is excellent and has a great online library:

http://www.nrsweb.com/repair/hypalon_repair.asp

 

[jviss]

It will smell better too.

I'm not sure that smell is good for you.

 

[Gunni]

I have an 10 y.o. 10'2" WM/Zodiac fabric-reinforced PVC (Decitex) RIB swinging from the davits in full exposure to the sun. It looks like new. Why? I know how to take care of it and I do. I will keep my RIB clean and ready, even as I am clean and ready!

It currently sells for $1,700.

A similar sized/configured CSM/Hypalon RIB weighs 30 lbs more, and costs twice as much. $3,600. In the words of Mr. Kalashnikov, "better is the enemy of good enough".


I've patched a bunch of Hypalon, it takes a lot more skill, care, and time than patching PVC. And the patch will likely fail. Just saying. A PVC patch is a chemical weld, a CSM patch is an adhesive surface bond.

CSM in a hot, enclosed space stinks like an old sulfurous inner tube. Nothing says "man cave" like the rubber boat locker!

 

[jviss]

I have an 10 y.o. 10'2" WM/Zodiac fabric-reinforced PVC (Decitex) RIB swinging from the davits in full exposure to the sun. It looks like new. Why? I know how to take care of it and I do. I will keep my RIB clean and ready, even as I am clean and ready!

It currently sells for $1,700.

A similar sized/configured CSM/Hypalon RIB weighs 30 lbs more, and costs twice as much. $3,600. In the words of Mr. Kalashnikov, "better is the enemy of good enough".


I've patched a bunch of Hypalon, it takes a lot more skill, care, and time than patching PVC. And the patch will likely fail. Just saying. A PVC patch is a chemical weld, a CSM patch is an adhesive surface bond.

CSM in a hot, enclosed space stinks like an old sulfurous inner tube. Nothing says "man cave" like the rubber boat locker!

If you know what you are doing a repair on a Hypalon boat will be quick and easy and last forever. I don't think there's any skill difference, the processes are nearly identical, with differences in the materials and adhesives. And the statement that the CSM repair will "likely fail" is utter nonsense.

Certainly a clumsy, sloppy repair job on either PVC or Hypalon will be poor.

In fact, the CSM repair will cure more quickly, in about half the time, and is useable immediately if the need arises in the field.

I've done a repair on a CSM boat and it went quickly and easily, and has held perfectly for 4 years now. I have some minor gluing to do, and a couple of reinforcements, but that's all on a 12 year old Orca material RIB that has spent all of 12 years in the sun (winter and summer) and still looks and works like nearly-new.

A PVC repair is not a "chemical weld," it's an adhesive repair just as with Hypalon, unless you have some process that I haven't come across. A PVC repair, just as the factory seams on PVC boats, will come apart with UV exposure and time much more quickly than with Hypalon.

One of the reasons that people pay double for Hypalon boats is that they last so much longer, and are much less likely to develop problems early in life.