I have a 1991 Cold Machine and have been wondering about the following: 1) If you disconnect the refrigerant lines at the compressor, will the connectors re-seal themselves, or will the refrigerant escape ? 2) The current Boat US catalog has a note that the Cold Machines listed can only be used with evaporators produced in 2001 or later. What are the differences ? Can I still get a new compressor unit that will work with my old evaporator ? The issue is that of effort required to replace the built-in evaporator, rather than cost of the unit. 3) The auto stores and WM carry a 134a upgrade kit for R12 systems. The instructions on the box are simply to have a tech discharge the R12, then screw on the new connector adapters, and refill the system with the supplied 134a and lubricant cans. Is this a viable option for the Cold Machine ?
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Clyde Lichtenwalner
Some answers
1) They should reseal, but some refrigerant will escape. 2)I believe that a compressor should be available from your local AB distributor or AB. Why do you need one? Mine has been running faithfully 8 months of the year since 1982. Has your compressor broken? In my experience it is the electronic modules that break, and not the compressor. 3) Ask AB, I don't know. I have a small supply of R12, but have not had to recharge in many years.
1) They should reseal, but some refrigerant will escape. 2)I believe that a compressor should be available from your local AB distributor or AB. Why do you need one? Mine has been running faithfully 8 months of the year since 1982. Has your compressor broken? In my experience it is the electronic modules that break, and not the compressor. 3) Ask AB, I don't know. I have a small supply of R12, but have not had to recharge in many years.
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Victor Robert
Clyde,
Clyde, Given your experience, I would appreciate your input to my thread "Troubleshooting Cold Machine" in this forum, since AB don't seem to have a response. Thanks
Clyde, Given your experience, I would appreciate your input to my thread "Troubleshooting Cold Machine" in this forum, since AB don't seem to have a response. Thanks
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Clyde Lichtenwalner
Wish I could
Sorry, though I am a mechanical engineer, my unit was new in 1983 and I know lots has changed in the 12v reefer world since then. My unit has been through a number of upgrades including a new cooling fan and new electronic module, but it has worked faithfully for about the last 10 years with no attention necessary (knock on wood). The last I worked on the unit I found a local service company in Baltimore that had a great deal of experience with AB, and had everything I needed for servicing the unit on the shelf. The question of replacing the entire unit came up at the time, and they had an entire compressor unit on the shelf for what I thought was an astoundingly low price. Their comment at the time was that the compressors never break. Fortunately, they were right. Simply replacing/upgrading the electronic module did the trick. I have the AB trouble shooting guide for my unit, provided by AB with the service T and pressure/vacuum gauge they used to sell to any do-it-yourselfer. But, because my unit dates to the dawn of AB refrigeration, I doubt if the information I have from the factory would be of much help. I will check it this weekend and see if the guide describes the symptons you are experiencing. If you had not measured the voltage already, I would have guessed you were seeing a low voltage situation, but given what you have posted, I am guessing that the compressor has an internal electrial fault that is heat related. Hearing that you have a freezer compressor doing the same thing after several hours of use makes me wonder if the heat in Key Largo this time of year is a factor. Are the units mounted in a hot location? It is hard to believe you have two units exhibiting the same symptons without them experiencing some common problem (low voltage, high ambient temperatures, etc.) Surely somebody in KL works on these things and is willing to talk it over with you. They may even have replacement compressors for a good price like the guy in Baltimore. I'll check my info and get back to you next week.
Sorry, though I am a mechanical engineer, my unit was new in 1983 and I know lots has changed in the 12v reefer world since then. My unit has been through a number of upgrades including a new cooling fan and new electronic module, but it has worked faithfully for about the last 10 years with no attention necessary (knock on wood). The last I worked on the unit I found a local service company in Baltimore that had a great deal of experience with AB, and had everything I needed for servicing the unit on the shelf. The question of replacing the entire unit came up at the time, and they had an entire compressor unit on the shelf for what I thought was an astoundingly low price. Their comment at the time was that the compressors never break. Fortunately, they were right. Simply replacing/upgrading the electronic module did the trick. I have the AB trouble shooting guide for my unit, provided by AB with the service T and pressure/vacuum gauge they used to sell to any do-it-yourselfer. But, because my unit dates to the dawn of AB refrigeration, I doubt if the information I have from the factory would be of much help. I will check it this weekend and see if the guide describes the symptons you are experiencing. If you had not measured the voltage already, I would have guessed you were seeing a low voltage situation, but given what you have posted, I am guessing that the compressor has an internal electrial fault that is heat related. Hearing that you have a freezer compressor doing the same thing after several hours of use makes me wonder if the heat in Key Largo this time of year is a factor. Are the units mounted in a hot location? It is hard to believe you have two units exhibiting the same symptons without them experiencing some common problem (low voltage, high ambient temperatures, etc.) Surely somebody in KL works on these things and is willing to talk it over with you. They may even have replacement compressors for a good price like the guy in Baltimore. I'll check my info and get back to you next week.
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Greg Nelson
Cold machine answers
The unit cannot be converted to R134a. It is completely incompatible with it. The reason for the issue of new compressors with old evaps. is due to coupling changes. The old ones sealed off when disconnected with a metal to metal seal. They work when connected, but can still leak a bit. The new AB couplings have a knife edge that pierces the mating coupling. They cannot be disconnected once they are installed without losing the charge. The system I bought recently has really neat couplings that can be disconnected and reconnected over and over without losing gas. They have O rings for a seal and do not leak like the metal to metal ones.
The unit cannot be converted to R134a. It is completely incompatible with it. The reason for the issue of new compressors with old evaps. is due to coupling changes. The old ones sealed off when disconnected with a metal to metal seal. They work when connected, but can still leak a bit. The new AB couplings have a knife edge that pierces the mating coupling. They cannot be disconnected once they are installed without losing the charge. The system I bought recently has really neat couplings that can be disconnected and reconnected over and over without losing gas. They have O rings for a seal and do not leak like the metal to metal ones.
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Phil Williams
WAECO answers
1. You will lose some gas when the connectors are taken apart. 2. You can purchase a new condensor with couplings that match those on the evaporator. This will be a custom built item as the product was changed to use the new style couplings. To place order you will need to provide serial number of condensing unit and the diameter of the couplings. 3. Don't go there. If you want to have your system converted hire a professional.
1. You will lose some gas when the connectors are taken apart. 2. You can purchase a new condensor with couplings that match those on the evaporator. This will be a custom built item as the product was changed to use the new style couplings. To place order you will need to provide serial number of condensing unit and the diameter of the couplings. 3. Don't go there. If you want to have your system converted hire a professional.
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Mike McCloud
409a. An excellant replacement for R12 and 134a
As a Marine refrigeration service person for many years I highly recomend a replacement called 409a. It is as good (and in some cases) even better then the old R12. Its Far better then the 134a which is barely a medium temp refrigerant. Every system that has 134a in it I changed over to 409a and the differance is remarkable. 409a is a drop in replacement for R12 or 134a and there is no need to be worrying about the oils. Although this does require a license to purchase, having a profesional do it is always cheaper in the long run.
As a Marine refrigeration service person for many years I highly recomend a replacement called 409a. It is as good (and in some cases) even better then the old R12. Its Far better then the 134a which is barely a medium temp refrigerant. Every system that has 134a in it I changed over to 409a and the differance is remarkable. 409a is a drop in replacement for R12 or 134a and there is no need to be worrying about the oils. Although this does require a license to purchase, having a profesional do it is always cheaper in the long run.
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Max Clark (GMC Refrig)
409a is excellent
I agree with Mike M. 134a is a poor R-12 substitute at low temperatures, and requires synthetic oil. R-409 usually gives better performance, but does raise head pressures. might require cooler operating conditions
I agree with Mike M. 134a is a poor R-12 substitute at low temperatures, and requires synthetic oil. R-409 usually gives better performance, but does raise head pressures. might require cooler operating conditions
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