Cherubini?

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Mark Crociati

I have a question about Cherubini's. Some of you may know me from my many posts in the last couple of months, (I just purchased a Cherub. 25 in March) I really enjoy this site and appreciate your kind wisdom. Is there really something special about a Cherubini? I have yet to launch mine, I do love her lines however, she is still indeed a fiberglass boat mass produced in the "seventies". Mine was built when I was 16 (1976), frankly in the world of legends, thats still quite a "pop-culture" plastic world/T.V. commercial "mass-produced" new item. What about, Shields or Herreshoff? I know this isn't an extensively expensive craft, however is this craft indeed a special sailboat or are we just waxing nostaglia? Just for those who may feel threatened by my sceptiscism, I do love my Cherub. and can't wait to sail her after all the love I've put into her! Your friend, Mark Crociati
 
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Andy

It's a conspiracy

As was once pointed out on this site, we Cherubini's are only trying to creat a mistique to drive up the resale price. Or I could say that there are various shades of opinion and one of shadiest is the Cherubini owners. Aside from the traditional look, the stabibility, and the reasonable cost there is not much to recommend it. Would I trade for a Union, C44 (Cherubini), the Blue Nose, or one of schooners up in Camden, Maine? Yes, this is a rhetorical question. "She's an old fat boat, slow but handsome, hard in the chine and soft in the transom. I love her well and she must love me, but I think its only for my money." (With thanks to Gordon Bok for a song that keeps boat ownership in perspective.) Andy "Baroque"
 
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Sam Lust

Was that a bubble bursting I heard?

We own production boats Manufactured by Hunter Marine. It happens they were designed by a noted designer, John Cherubini. I own Clipper designed by W. I. B. Crealock. That doesn't put it up there with Pacific Seacraft or any of those. In your case the design was by John and his buddy Rob Seidleman, who went on to produce his own line of production boats that look suspiciously similar to the Hunters of the period. Conspiracy? Close to it. They are basic boats, not all that special, not all that well equipped, not realy all that well built, not too fast, although not all that slow either. What they were was AFFORDABLE, first and foremost. They sold for moderate prices new, and their resale is moderate. How many other 33 foot boats in decent shape can you get into for under $20,000.? It only listed for $43,000. in 1982. Enjoy your Hunter. I know the rest of us do.
 
Jan 22, 2003
744
Hunter 25_73-83 Burlington NJ
Well I could respond, but....

... I wonder if I should. I'll leave it for more specific questions... or other people's responses. JC 2 jcomet@aol.com
 
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David Foster

Why a Cherubini?

It is certainly true that the first line of Hunter sailboats, designed by John Cherubini (with some of the interiors done by our JC II) were true production boats aimed at the largest possible market, and produced with a sharp eye on cost. But there were many competitors in the late 70's who simply did not have the appeal and success of the Cherubini Hunters. I don't see them from the eyes of the market when they were built, but here are the clear advantages I have seen and discovered sailing our '77 h27, and frequenting this site: - The design is seaworthy. With capsize ratios of two or below, they can take the weather and waves. - They have good cabin height. This is especially important on our h27. Six feet down the center of the cabin sets it apart from most other 27 footers of the era or later. - Although heavy by today's standards, a Cherubini moves well in all but the lightest breezes, and the overhangs give them a reasonably comfortable motion. - Solid construction was a feature of many classic boats of the era. This was before designers understood the strength of fiberglass, and hulls were overbuilt. That makes them solid, and tough, with a good grid, and thick layup around the bilges giving stiffness to the whole design. There were variations in manufacturing quality, but I have heard of few important manufacturing issues. (Maybe the lemons have disappeared from the fleet!) - The Cherubini section of hunterowners.com. This site is great - you can find out anything you need to know about your Cherubini Hunter here. - Functional and pleasant interior. OK, the fit and finish leaves something to be desired. But there is lots of real teak down below, and the layout really works for us. We have chartered modern 34 foot Hunters and Catalinas, and the fold up table and bench seats is actually more comfortable and functional than the huge cabins on those boats! - Finally, I like the way they look. I find it attractive. Yes it's similar to the Tartans and other designs of the era, but it is one of the good ones and it appeals to me. Indeed, there are some good reasons to consider a classic Cherubini design. David Lady Lillie '77 Cherubini Hunter 27
 
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Randall

'64 1/2 Mustang

Is there really anything special about a '64 1/2 Mustang? Naahh, it's just a revamped Falcon, designed for low-cost, mass production. Can it keep up with a Corvette or Jaguar of the era? Not even close. But does it have endearing lines? Does it turn heads when it passes by? Is it fun to drive (and be seen in)? Is it worth lavishing time, love and money on? Oh Yeah! Same with our H25s-- look nice, turn heads, worth lavishing love, time & money on. Only thing I can't attest to is whether they're fun to drive. I just bought mine last month, and haven't untied her from the dock yet. But I already like her better than the other 5 sailboats I've owned.
 
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Dennis Bidney

H25

All I can add is that 3 years ago I jumped into sailing – complete novice. I looked at several similar-sized boats – one was a 1984 Hunter 25.5 and almost wrote the check for it until I took a look at a 1980 H25. No contest for me - just by the looks and the feel. Bought the 25 without knowing one thing about this Cherubini thing. Bought it on the lines, the beauty of her. I had others look at her that actually knew something about boats so as to advise me about those minor details of structural integrity and the like. But for me it was those lines – those Cherubini genes. My thanks go to the design team that put this craft together. Twenty five years later I'm still enjoying the results of their vision. Better boats out there of the same class and vintage? - for sure - do I care? - couldn't give a rat's behind. Dennis
 
Jul 1, 1998
3,062
Hunter Legend 35 Poulsbo/Semiahmoo WA
'63 1/2 Falcon with the V-8

On the other hand, the '63 1/2 Falcon with the V-8, now that car really went! A real sleeper (on the drag strip). and the Futura hard top or convertable was a nice looking car, also worth keeping up.
 
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Mark

Cherubini's

I agree with the esthetic observation that most of you feel which is, that the Cherub. Hunters are attractive. I have looked at recent Hunter sailboats of similar size (current Hunter 26, trailable). Unless you move up in class, the 23-26 ' class leaves me cold. These boats look like one of those Thermos coolers inside. Open floor plan and very little teak/wood mostly white gelcoat. My H25 1976 (though w/poor head room) has alot of wood/teak for it's class and has a semi-private birth upfront. I love the wine-glass transom (the flat transoms have no sex appeal or water-dynamics, although practical in regard to space). The cabin on the new Hunter's of this class look more like land campers than boats, (whos designing these boats, Winnebago?). I have researched some of the new custom/more expensive sailboats made today and they look more like the old Hunters than the new ones! I'm ready to sail again and my hard work and pride of ownership make my boat far more special and a part of me than buying a new boat and turning the key! A part of me goes into the classic Hnnter. Hope to see you all in the N.E. area. Let's have a classic regatta! Best wishes, Mark
 
Jul 1, 1998
3,062
Hunter Legend 35 Poulsbo/Semiahmoo WA
Well Said Mark! (er, written)

What you're trying to describe, I think, is "classic beauty" and that's really hard to put into words, and what's worse, it varies with the item. In cars it can be like the 36 Fords, the square type Cadalics, Packards, etc of the late 20s and early 30s, 120XK Jaguar of the early 50s, 58 Chevy Impalla, etc. The classics become collectors items and increase in value. The 36 Ford wasn't and expensive gold plated car but it's a real collectable because it looks good and drives good. This is a little off subject, but I remember going on the first Jeep Jamboree in the Sierras from Georgetown to Lake Tahoe, over 10,000 ft granite mountains going in lower case grandma much of the way, rolling over large boulders and up and down steep slopes - no road for miles - and we came across a Model T Ford that someone had abandoned! It was no race car but it got you there. The 4-wheelers felt a little less smug. A proper little yacht - definitely hard to describe but you know it when you see one. That extra teak doens't hurt, either.
 
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Mark

To Jim Nantz...

I know what you mean. My father bought a 1965 Pontiac Lemans ragtop brand new when I was 5 years old. 11 years later he gave it to me when I was 16, of course I beat the poor car, then I gave it to my brother, who also beat it up until he hit a pothole with a dead stop destroying the linkage. My father took the car back, remove the body from the chasis and left it in our garage on it's side for ten years (he was in the midst of building a business). Eventually he got back to the ole' 65, placed a Buick 65 frame under the body, completely restored the car including original paint color and now it rides in the Fourth of July parade looking almost the same as it did the day we picked it up in 1965! A classic antique, as am I.
 
Jan 22, 2008
275
Hunter 33_77-83 Lake Lanier GA
No JC II, just sit back and enjoy....

Well, enough said that I can only start to repeat, so I want do that. But, what I will say is, no other boat could have held my interest, my dreams, my love,.... like my 1982 Hunter 33. Today, I viewed in the photo forum an article "Tampa to Dry Tortugas" by Kevin Hostler. Chill bumps ran up and down my spine! I am so hungry for information on other boats of the same design and size as mine, that when it happens I get almost unbearable to my wife. Just seeing someone else do what I want to do, but so far have not done, recharges my soul. My boat is 22 years old and she has never been better. She is my other "soul mate". P.S. don't let my wife see this, not sure how she'll take the "other soul mate" statement.
 
Jan 22, 2003
744
Hunter 25_73-83 Burlington NJ
That Cherubini Hunter 'look'

My semi-restored boat isn't even in the water yet and I still like looking at it. On the Saturday before Easter I had it trucked up from New Gretna to my cousin Dave's yard (www.cherubiniyachts.com) and blocked up in prepration for doing the bottom, rerigging the mast and finishing up the woodwork inside. Sometimes I get justifiably frustrated and want to quit, and then I will reapproach the boat with a beer or a soda in hand and stop and stare at it. There is something undeniably elegant about the rake of the bow and forefoot and the way the domed deck slants ever-so-slightly upwards towards the mast step that blows me away every time. The old man could draw angles like that in his sleep-- as though from pure intuition, just whatever he thought looked good at the time. But then when you do the numbers you realize why people for years have been calling yacht design a 'black art'. I grew up round this stuff and I STILL don't understand all the math. But if he could have made the waterline longer, he would have. If it had needed a full spade rudder with no skeg, he would have done it. If the keel needed a curved leading edge, it'd have had it. What, do you think he'd have overlooked something like that? You simply can't underestimate what a guy with that perfect comprehension of the blend of angelic art and rude science intends for the overall design of the boat. That's why you see me defend him so much on here. The one thing I know for certain is that he absolutely knew for certain what he was doing. And if you don't take it on faith, you can look at his Raider 33, a universally adored and sublimely beautiful cruiser-racer which came out 4 years after this boat, and see the same rakish angle to the bow, the same flat deadrise, the same angle of attack on the keel... and you realize there was a method to that madness. He was more than a shooting star, some comet passing through to be forgotten. We who love and sail his boats know that. The others may have just blinked when the comet was passing by. JC 2
 
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Mark

I'm getting an education JC

I have some old sloop models in my home and I believe I understand what JC I had intended. Preserve the past (late 1800's & early 1900's), improve upon previous designs and combine classic lines with modern technology. I love the fact that my H25 has the keel below the waterline as do many classic racing designs. The gudgeons and pindles with an outside rudder take away from the overall look of the boat. I love the "wine-glass" transom and the long straight bow not curved. As I stated before, look at the Hunters 24's & 26's in the last 12-15 years. These boats are designed not necessarily for their sailing prowess but more for their interior room and floor plan. The hull stops curving around the middle from the bow and goes straight line to the keel (no hull streamline). No sensuality, very pre-fab looking, plastic, not very nautical but very Winnebago!
 
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Rich Byrnes

New Cherub owner...

This has been a great thread and the timing is perfect!!!! We take delivery of a 1979 Hunter 33 (#139) this Saturday, the current owner is buying our '77 Catalina 27, he's retired and looking to simplify and downsize, meanwhile our growing family is moving on up to a beautiful cruiser!!! The owner does a lot of custom canvas work so you can see a lot of sumbrella on deck, he is also a woodworker and the interior woodwork will attest to his care. Check out the link for a slideshow of interior and exterior shots, I can't WAIT!!! It's pretty cool that the guy (OK, teen) who helped design the interior is active on this board. JC, my hats off to you and your dad, this is a beautiful boat and we can't wait to put her to work! Rich B 1979 Hunter 33 #139 SunByrnes 2 St Clair Shores, MI
 
Mar 14, 2004
13
- - Ithaca, NY
Hunter 30 (dot com)

We went to New Jersey to possibly purchase a Hunter 28.5. The deal fell through and (on a whim) we were shown the Hunter 30 (78). The INSTANT I set foot down below I knew I had to have this boat. The layout and design (coupled with the fact that this particular boat was blue water ready) are exactly how you want a sailboat to be. Sure, there are some things I wish our old boat had ... but I wouldn't trade for anything other than a bigger Cherubini. The name Cherubini is somewhat meaningless to most who board or crew on our boat ... but they absolutely love her just the same. Solid ... dependable ... TIGHT ... we've rarely sailed faster than 7 knots but we always have nowhere to go. We love our Cherubini Hunter 30 and this season will be one of our best! Just launched two days ago and she looks better in the water than ever!
 
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Deb

A lady's POV

I wanted to write this post last week before embarking on a 5-day stay on our recently acquired 1984 - 27' but time got the best of me. But I'm glad I waited until now because this last trip has reinforced what I wanted to say about our Cherubini. When we were boat shopping in February at our marina, I wanted the 90's model Hunter with all the interior bells and whistles. My husband liked the Cherubini - I didn't argue - it's his money. I was just happy to move up from our O'Day 23'. Once commissioned, I went down a few days ahead of my darling to set up housekeeping, since we will be spending many nights anchored out, and at the marina during the season (March - November.) 3 days aboard by myself, cleaning and setting up, the boat and I bonded. Our second sail, I took the wheel and fell in love. The captain has to beat me with a soft line to get a chance at the wheel. This last 5 days living aboard prompted me to post about the storage space. You guys know how us women are, but I just don't have enough stuff to stow onboard! My only complaint is there is no place to permanently mount my microwave near a receptacle- any ideas? Scrutinizing the newer Hunters of similar size in our marina, it's obvious where and when they started to *chintz back* on design and materials. I previously thought that a comfortable salon and big gally were important, but I love the fold-down table, and I really don't do that much real cooking, (like I want to) anyway. With indoor-outdoor carpet over the bilge covers, some new pleated shades, and a few future extras, we have comfort, and style on a well-built/designed solid vessel.
 

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Paul F

Safer electrical receptacle or outlet

Deb, for your microwave receptacle you may wish to add a 110v outlet in a convenent location. If you do, adding a ground fault interrupt with polarity protection will much improve the safety of your shorepower system. My 1980 33 was mis-wired by the former owner and the wiring while it worked sometimes was unsafe. I added a ground fault interrupt outlet with polarity protection. The shorepower is wired through this outlet first so that all power after this outlet is protected. I found that the power from my dock had reverse polarity. I have corrected it by using a made up plug changing the polarity back to what it should be. Don Casey of BoatUS has an excellent article on the subject - link below.
 

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