Canadian Charts SUCK!!!

druid

druid

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Apr 22, 2009
837
Ontario 32 Pender Harbour
OK, RANT time!
Getting Digital Charts for Canadian waters SUCK!!!! There's ONE company (basically Gov't) called Canadian Hydrographic Services (CHS) that provides charts for Canadian waters. They provide them in two formats: Vector (so outrageously expensive that nobody carries them!), and BSB4. (Three if you include printed versions).

Now, I have the BSB4 charts for BC coast, from 2013 (ie 3 years old). You have to get an Activation Code to use them. CPC CANNOT PROVIDE ACTIVATION CODES FOR CHARTS EARLIER THAN 2015! That's like Windows not supporting anything but Win10, except that for Canadian charts, there's no alternative like there is for Windows.

Not only that, BSB4 is a ridiculous format. There are only a few chart programs that support it (NONE on Linux, now that Polar View no longer works), and it's always a 2-day exercise in frustration to get them installed and working (assuming you can even GET the Activation Code!)

In the US, the charts are BSB3 (usable by just about anything) and FREE.

So, short of scanning in the printed charts, I have no alternative but to throw out my 3-yr-old digital charts and fork out $175 (plus tax!) for a new CD - And go through the hassle of installing it AGAIN...

druid
 
Charles Erwin

Charles Erwin

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Jan 30, 2012
1,140
Nor'Sea 27 "Kiwanda" Portland/ Anacortes
Mail order East side of Vancouver Is. Package from Nanaimo Marine store for 140 US. Open CPN on a laptop with BSB4 plugin for 0 US will run under Linux. Will lookup Nanimo store official name if you want.

Charles
 
druid

druid

.
Apr 22, 2009
837
Ontario 32 Pender Harbour
Charles Erwin said:
Mail order East side of Vancouver Is. Package from Nanaimo Marine store for 140 US. Open CPN on a laptop with BSB4 plugin for 0 US will run under Linux. Will lookup Nanimo store official name if you want.

Charles
Click to expand
That would be Harbour Chandler ($149.95 CDN). The point is, I HAVE to buy a new set even though I have a set that's only 3 years old. AND install it (like I said: a 2-day exercise in frustration - trust me!). And if I want to install it on another computer, or if I update the OS, or get a new computer... guess what? I have to buy ANOTHER set!

You USA guys have it easy - Free BSB3 charts.

druid
 
Jackdaw

Jackdaw

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Nov 8, 2010
11,386
Beneteau First 36.7 & 260 Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
Well take comfort in the fact that you are hardly alone. NOAA and the OCS are one of the VERY FEW government organizations worldwide that make their high quality charts available in all formats for FREE.
 
Meriachee

Meriachee

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Aug 1, 2011
3,972
Catalina 270 255 Wabamun. Welcome to the marina
The Navionics+ offering is actually quite good. Nothing worth having is free. You get what you pay for.
 
druid

druid

.
Apr 22, 2009
837
Ontario 32 Pender Harbour
Let me paint a picture of what I have to do. Note that the older version IS ALREADY INSTALLED AND ACTIVATED on the Linux side (using Polar View, which for some reason has stopped working). So even though it's installed and I'm running OpenCPN under wine in Linux, the charts have to be installed on the "Windows side". So:

- Install wine (already done)
- Install OpenCPN (Windows version, using wine, because the BSB4 plugin does not work on the Linux version)
- Buy a new copy of the chart set
- TRY to install the chart set using wine, so it thinks it's installed to Windows.
- Try again...
- And again...
- MAYBE get it to work, after tweaking wine and playing with folders and permissions and RegEdit... (to be honest I don't think I've ever been able to do this - I end up creating a Windows partition and installing Windows as a dual-boot)
- Install the BSB4 plugin to OpenCPN using wine
- Point OpenCPN to the proper directories and hope for the best...

If they were in BSB3, the procedure would be:
- Install Linux version of OpenCPN (or OziExplorer, or...)
- Install the chart set
- that's IT!

druid
 
druid

druid

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Apr 22, 2009
837
Ontario 32 Pender Harbour
Meriachee said:
The Navionics+ offering is actually quite good. Nothing worth having is free. You get what you pay for.
Click to expand
I'm not complaining about the cost - it's the PROCEDURE (caused by the insane BSB4 format and CHS's activation procedures) that I hate. I understand that we do have some pretty decent charts up here.

druid
 
druid

druid

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Apr 22, 2009
837
Ontario 32 Pender Harbour
Meriachee said:
The Navionics+ offering is actually quite good. Nothing worth having is free. You get what you pay for.
Click to expand
I see there's a version that runs on Windows (hopefully would also run under wine?). What charts do they use? How are the charts installed?

Oh, and I just saw that they are REMOVING the Windows version of Navionics...

druid
 
Meriachee

Meriachee

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Aug 1, 2011
3,972
Catalina 270 255 Wabamun. Welcome to the marina
That's because Windows isn't something that belongs on a boat. They make plotters and networks that have an even shorter shelf life than Bill's stuff, but don't require as many patches to start.
 
druid

druid

.
Apr 22, 2009
837
Ontario 32 Pender Harbour
Meriachee said:
That's because Windows isn't something that belongs on a boat. They make plotters and networks that have an even shorter shelf life than Bill's stuff, but don't require as many patches to start.
Click to expand
Well, first, I'm trying my damndest NOT to run Windows, running Linux instead ( and have a look at how many people use cellphones/tablets running Android or iOS - they CERTAINLY shouldn't be used as primary navigation aids!).

Second, I'm not using it on the boat - I use it at home for trip planning and "what-if"s. OK, I'm often running it "on the boat" on a laptop, but I think you mean as a primary navigation aid.

druid
 
Scott B

Scott B

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Sep 20, 2006
2,952
Hunter 33 Georgian Bay, Ontario, Canada
If you are trip planning at home have you tried the Navionics Webbapp etc??
 
CloudDiver

CloudDiver

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Sep 8, 2014
2,551
Catalina 22 Swing Keel San Diego
Send them a very curtly worded email and tell them to stop drinking so much Molson on the job. If you want to grease the skids to see if they will help out, send them a case of Molson.
 
Last edited:
Meriachee

Meriachee

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Aug 1, 2011
3,972
Catalina 270 255 Wabamun. Welcome to the marina
Molson.
Apparently Kermee needs to bring a few people for some "beerucation". Ha.
 
Stu Jackson

Stu Jackson

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Feb 26, 2004
23,008
Catalina 34 224 Maple Bay, BC, Canada
CloudDiver said:
Send them a very curtly worded email and tell them to stop drinking so much Molson on the job. If you want to grease the skids to see if they will help out, send them a case of Molson.
Click to expand
Hadda be :LaBatt's, not Molson. They should start drinking Piper Pale Ale or something good from BC. BC = BeCause they are rip off artists. Your taxes already paid for it and the govt is making you pay for it twice because they love the free market.

How helpful is that?!?

Disclaimer: on Wednesday, I am moving to Canada. I will then gripe even more!!!
 
Meriachee

Meriachee

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Aug 1, 2011
3,972
Catalina 270 255 Wabamun. Welcome to the marina
Stu Jackson said:
Disclaimer: on Wednesday, I am moving to Canada. I will then gripe even more!!!
Click to expand
Granville Island has a nice summer brew put together right now. The coolest part is that you can tie up right there for 2 hours and all the "Granville Market types" get to gawk and wish they had a sailboat. (I'm gonna pay for this)
 
Scott B

Scott B

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Sep 20, 2006
2,952
Hunter 33 Georgian Bay, Ontario, Canada
Stu Jackson said:
Hadda be :LaBatt's, not Molson. They should start drinking Piper Pale Ale or something good from BC. BC = BeCause they are rip off artists. Your taxes already paid for it and the govt is making you pay for it twice because they love the free market.

How helpful is that?!?

Disclaimer: on Wednesday, I am moving to Canada. I will then gripe even more!!!
Click to expand

Molson is / was a Canadian brewery just as big as LaBatt's.

Btw, sorry, but we've closed our borders to all immigrants. ;)
 
S

sesmith

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Jul 1, 2010
990
Catalina 350 Port Huron
If you're getting any worthwhile programs to run under wine, you're doing better than I ever did with it. Can you get anywhere using vmware or virtualbox rather than dual boot? I used to use virtual box with good success. The beauty of it, is when windows crashes (and it will) the blue screen of death is captured on a small window running on a perfectly functioning linux machine :)

Honestly, as much as I used to like to use linux...for trip planning especially, the android (or apple) versions of Navionics just works. I run navionics (US and Canada) on a nexus 7 tablet. It lives fine there. Don't even need the HD version for the 7"tablet.
 
Chris & Lenore

Chris & Lenore

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Apr 24, 2006
868
Aloha 32 Toronto, Lake Ontario
Scott B said:
If you are trip planning at home have you tried the Navionics Webbapp etc??
Click to expand
It seems a lot of people don't know about this. For planning at home it sure beats anything "installed". Works fine on your linux too.
Has both US and Canadian charts...

Chris

PS it sucks even more knowing that the individuals who control access to the Canadian charts (i.e. Collect the fees) have that privilege in perpetuity regardless of it being funded by my tax dollars (rant off).
 
druid

druid

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Apr 22, 2009
837
Ontario 32 Pender Harbour
Scott B said:
If you are trip planning at home have you tried the Navionics Webbapp etc??
Click to expand
I tried it and it works pretty well. Only problems I see are:
1. you have to be connect to the Internet, and
2. you can't (that I could find) see the distance between two points. (ie click on one point, draw a line (course) to another point, and it calculates the distance)

Other than that, yeah, it works great!
druid
 
Head Sail

Head Sail

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Nov 13, 2013
723
Catalina 34 Tacoma
First of all, Wine Is Not Windows. It's a simulated Windows environment and a buggy one at that. You are running a Windows version of OpenCPN (another development in work) under Linux running WINE, your bound to have issues. If your a software developer that's fine but if you are more of a user, you should run Windows version of OpenCPN under Windows.
 
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