I have a 1983 Catalina 27 with the original Universal Atomic Model 5411. The engine won't start and after having it checked out, I was told that there isn't enough compression to turn over the motor. Can this engine be rebuilt? Or should I purchase one that has already been rebuilt? If so, where do I find one? For the last two years I have been sailing in Puget Sound and knowing that this is a water cooled engine, I am concerned about corrosion damage. Putting on an outboard is something I hope to avoid. I was told that there is a Volvo that could fit but it would be very expensive. I see that the 5411 is mentioned often here so there are people who have dealt with this problem, I am sure. It would be helpful to hear from them.
Can a Universal Atomic engine be rebuilt?
- Thread starter carolbsailing
- Start date
Don Moyer at Moyer Marine is THEE person to talk to about anything that has to do with A4's. http://moyermarine.com/
Yes your engine can be rebuilt. Most of the time at a decent cost saving over new however remember your starting with a 30 plus year old piece of machinery and while that in itself is not bad parts etc etc will just get harder to get. You concern about raw water cooled and age are also valid. If you have your "lifetime" boat I would consider replacing it with a new one. While the outboard may not be what your want to do it will most likely be you cheaper option. Unfortunately most of your options are expensive. How much of the work can you do yourself ?? remove/replace your engine ? maybe even try the rebuild ?? Got a mechanically inclined friend ?? Maybe you only have to rebuilt the top half of the engine(need better diagnose info) and just replace the head ?? Do some more checking and get all the details first. Link below I found on line for a fully rebuilt replacement. Add removal/install and shipping. Most local diesel shops should be able to get you a rebuild or consider replacement. Many makes and models will fit, it just becomes a question of how much you are willing to spend. Good Luck !
http://dieselenginetrader.com/engines/engine_details.cfm?id=11822
http://dieselenginetrader.com/engines/engine_details.cfm?id=11822
Just a suggestion from a satisfied customer ... If you really like your boat and think that it will be yours in the long term, I think you might be happiest if you decide to bite the bullet and go thru the expense of installing a new engine. (What's not to like about a Catalina 27, which has faced the test of time and comes out as one of the most popular boats ever).
I have a very similar boat, which was slightly underpowered with a Yanmar 1GM. I put in a new 2YM15 and couldn't be happier. I did some comparison to see if the 2YM15 is a feasible option for you.
They appear to have the same prop rotation. The Yanmar engine may be lighter depending on whether or not the engine weights include transmission (I didn't research in detail). The width and length of Yanmar is less in both dimensions (approx 1" - 2" less). Only the height is about 2" higher, but if clearance is a problem, an alternate mixing elbow is a feasible solution.
Of course, much depends on the stringer set-up. I was fortunate that I didn't have to modify the mounting stringers. I did have to push my cabinet face out 2-inches into the cabin. Any modification for the mounting shouldn't be too difficult, though.
I worked with the installer to do a lot of the grunt work to minimize installation cost.
The benefits you will find include: more HP, far more power and better speed thru water; fresh-water cooled (instead of raw water) with heat exchanger; 80-amp alternator is std; and, piece of mind knowing that you have a reliable engine. I don't think I would explore much of the area you are at (what with the tidal currents, shipping traffic, fog, etc.) without having confidence in the engine. I'm sure others have more confidence in repaired or rebuilt engines ... I simply don't (well a re-built engine with a warranty might help). That's the basis for my suggestion.
BTW, petersea, thanks for that link. Once I tinker with my old engine in the basement and find out what needs to be repaired ... it's a running engine but needs repairs ... I'll be looking for a place to sell it.
I have a very similar boat, which was slightly underpowered with a Yanmar 1GM. I put in a new 2YM15 and couldn't be happier. I did some comparison to see if the 2YM15 is a feasible option for you.
They appear to have the same prop rotation. The Yanmar engine may be lighter depending on whether or not the engine weights include transmission (I didn't research in detail). The width and length of Yanmar is less in both dimensions (approx 1" - 2" less). Only the height is about 2" higher, but if clearance is a problem, an alternate mixing elbow is a feasible solution.
Of course, much depends on the stringer set-up. I was fortunate that I didn't have to modify the mounting stringers. I did have to push my cabinet face out 2-inches into the cabin. Any modification for the mounting shouldn't be too difficult, though.
I worked with the installer to do a lot of the grunt work to minimize installation cost.
The benefits you will find include: more HP, far more power and better speed thru water; fresh-water cooled (instead of raw water) with heat exchanger; 80-amp alternator is std; and, piece of mind knowing that you have a reliable engine. I don't think I would explore much of the area you are at (what with the tidal currents, shipping traffic, fog, etc.) without having confidence in the engine. I'm sure others have more confidence in repaired or rebuilt engines ... I simply don't (well a re-built engine with a warranty might help). That's the basis for my suggestion.
BTW, petersea, thanks for that link. Once I tinker with my old engine in the basement and find out what needs to be repaired ... it's a running engine but needs repairs ... I'll be looking for a place to sell it.
Re: Hi Carol with the A4.
I would like to consider other makes or models but the cost is an issue. Although it's in excellent condition and comes with lots of extras, the boat is getting on in years. If I could find someone who knew their way around this engine, then my options might be cheaper. So the search is on for a diesel shop that can determine if the engine can be rebuilt. The engine advertised on engine trader is very tempting, a certain fix. Thanks for your advice on this.
The 5411 is a marinized Kubota Z500 block which is same engine used in a B5100 tractor. Rebuild parts are pretty easy to come by. Kubota has an on line parts catalogue that has the latest on part numbers..
http://kubota.com/part/partsList.aspx
Pretty much everything is the same except for the exhaust manifold.
http://kubota.com/part/partsList.aspx
Pretty much everything is the same except for the exhaust manifold.
Carol: Why not buy you a book on repairing your motor and see what you might be able to do? Kloudie has provided you with a great asset with his post. You learned to sail as a Grandma didn't you?
Good luck, Chief
Good luck, Chief
Internally the engines are the same. Bolt on exhaust manifold and some other parts are only available from Universal. Glow plugs from Universal/Westerbeke $59, same exact item from Kubota is $29. Re-circulating water pump is one-third price at Kubota tractor dealer.
I believe any business must have a reasonable mark up to survive, but....?
I recently sold a 5411 on eBay for $2,495. They are good engines, but should be converted to closed system cooling for long life if you run in salt water.
Tom
Did a competent mechanic check the compression on your engine? The diesel engine will take a special tester to correctly check the engine. If the engine is rebuilt by a competent mechanic you should be fine. Taking shortcuts will just catch up with you later. If you have a friend that can rebuild gasoline engines, then they can build a diesel engine too. Timing of the injector pump will be crucial. If you decide to look at different engines,look at Beta Marine for a direct replacement. If I were closer to you then I would try to help. I help a lot of my fellow sailors on Cherokee Lake in Tenn.