Can a manual head do the job?

[Catnip]

I have a compact manual pump head. A Wilcox, I think. No maserator. When you have to pee, it works great. However, my first mate says there is no way it will flush a BM through the hose to the holding tank, and so I'm not allowed to use it. :naughty: Since I sail on an inland lake, and you are never that far from the marina, it is not an absolute necessity, but still inconvienent. I can't believe they would put these heads on boats, if they only work on beer. On the other hand, the flush water flow is nothing like home and she may be right. I don't want to issue a doggy scoop to guests along with their life jacket. Is there a trick to this or are we just too cautious?

 

[cptskip]

no. just add a maserator.even a old hand crank one.

 

[Ed Schenck]

Small manual head should work.

I have been using mine for ten years with no problems. You probably know how much TP women use just to pee(sorry if this sounds sexist). If it will flush that it will flush anything. I don't know why a Wilcox would work any differently than my Raritan Cricket head.

 

[sailingdog]

You're being overly cautious. Even the low-end marine heads will flush BM. The trick is not to clog the head with TP... That is generally the bigger issue, and on many boats the rule is if you didn't eat it or drink it, it doesn't go in the head. That means you need a small trash can for the TP that seals fairly tightly to keep the odor down. One of my friends uses a diaper pail on their boat... don't blame them...keeps the odors down.

One other thing that is very, very important. You need to have some way of monitoring the level of the holding tank, especially since you're on a lake and can't sail out past the three-mile limit to dump the tank. If your tank is close to full, DON'T USE THE HEAD. Overfilling the tank can cause a lot of problems, like clogging the vent line, bursting hoses, etc.—all of which are not fun to fix.

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

I was never a fan of any toilet which is incapable of accepting reasonable amounts of TP.
To me , boating and camping are mutually exclusive things.
Your head hoses may be clogged or restricted with build-up, a byproduct of urine, which can't easily be removed necessitating periodic replacement, if for no other reason than to minimize odor. They require replacement just like a number of things on a boat but are often overlooked for obvious reasons.
If you don't want to switch to a pressurized or macerating toilet, my suggestion is to ensure both the intake and discharge hoses are replaced

 

[Stu Jackson]

K.I.S.S.

I met another C34 owner a few years ago who had a new C34, ours is a 1986. He had the same head and complained about it not working because it "didn't have enough water in the bowl," he said.

Same Wilcox Crittendon Head Mate unit.

What we learned with ours is VERY SIMPLE: Put a few glasses full of water into the bowl before you use it for #2. Then, before you use any TP, flush the bowl, then keep flushing as you use the TP.

We have not had any problems with this unit for ten years (replaced a few because of age, same unit).

Just gotta do it right, based on how it works.

 

[Tim R.]

Most toilets should have no problem with BM or TP. Test your TP by taking a sheet and putting it in a glass of water. If it disolves fairly quikly, you are fine. If not, try another brand. I have been using the Sealand 2 ply TP for years and have never had a clog either pumping in or pumping out.

Head etiquette:

1. No stand ups
2. Nothing other than what comes out of an orafice below the belt. (puke over the rail)
3. Limit TP usage
5. Don't drop a deuce on someone elses boat when not necessary
6. If you do, clean the bowl

To aid guests in following these rules:

Have a trash receptical
Provide some way to clean bowl and dispose in trash recepticle
Show guests how to use the head
Inform them that the clogger does the unclogging

I once had a guest violate rule 1 and made my head look like someone took a shower outside of the shower stall. I never exlpained the rules but he was a lifelong sailor so I thought it was implied.

 

[r.w.landau]

Manual in my neighborhood means a bucket.

The rest of us use portapotties.
Yes, there are sailing folk out there that use a bucket overboard in a 3200 acre lake. They are obvious because brown trout are not native to our lake.
r.w.landau

 

[sailingdog]

BTW, if you don't want to pay RV/Marine store prices for Sealand TP...try getting Scott brand single-ply... it should work fine.. and it's a lot cheaper.

 

[Tim R.]

I like the feel of the Sealand better and it comes in a neat little zip lock bag. I go through about 8 rolls a season so the price difference is really not an issue. When it comes to TP, comfort is the overriding factor behind(pun intended) compatibility with the potty.

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

I can't add much to what's already been said

It's absolutely essential to add about 1/3 bowl of water with a cup to the bowl ahead of solids. I'm pretty sure that it's failure to do that that's upsetting your wife. However, sometimes 'intermediate flushing" MAY be required (in which case, you may need to rethink your diet)...be sure to add water ahead of use again.

As for TP...use ONLY quick dissolve TP. No reason to spend the money for TP labeled "marine/rv" 'cuz it's just the cheapest flimsiest TP repackaged and marked up about 4x. Too find out whether any TP is suitable for use in a marine toilet, tear off a sheet and put it in a glass of water....come back in an hour and stir the water. If the water is milky and all you see is a little "snow," it can be used in any marine toilet...if it's still an intact--or mostly intact--sheet, keep looking. And there's no reason not to flush it. 5-6 sheets is enough to do the job (women do have to be retrained to use only that much)...but even an overload of quick-dissolve TP is no reason to panic, 'cuz the stuff dissolves so quickly in water that any clog will dissolve on its own in less than hour. However, wet wipes, paper towels and--God forbid--tampons are another story. So it may be best to instruct you guests to flush only what they've eaten first and put the TP and EVERYTHING ELSE in the trash.

Don't even THINK of installing a macerator in the plumbing downstream of a manual or any other toilet that doesn't have one!!!

And finally...if the toilet is more than 5 years old and has never been rebuilt, it'll work a lot more efficiently if you put a rebuild or "service" kit in it. If it's at least 10 years old, it's prob'ly time to replace it. Compact manual toilets are designed to have only a 7-10 year life expectancy.

 

[Ross]

We have used our Raritan II for 9 years with no problems at all. We use the same TP that we use at home and it swallows it without a complaint. Marine toilets get a lot of discussion here but we have been wonderfully trouble free.

 

[SamLust]

That's Silly!

The head is there to be used. Any marine head should take whatever your body can give it and a decent wad of toilet paper too. If you are all that concerned about the TP, or the other for that matter, install a Raritan PH II toilet. I can GUARANTEE you it will ingest not less than 12 sheets of VIVA (very strong, very thick) paper toweling. It was tough to count because I had to fish it all out of the holding tank in bits and pieces with a bent coat hanger. Almost the most fun I had that whole season.

 

[sailingdog]

Peggie-

Just curious, why do you say:

Don't even THINK of installing a macerator in the plumbing downstream of a manual or any other toilet that doesn't have one!!!

 

[Ross]

The head is there to be used. Any marine head should take whatever your body can give it and a decent wad of toilet paper too. If you are all that concerned about the TP, or the other for that matter, install a Raritan PH II toilet. I can GUARANTEE you it will ingest not less than 12 sheets of VIVA (very strong, very thick) paper toweling. It was tough to count because I had to fish it all out of the holding tank in bits and pieces with a bent coat hanger. Almost the most fun I had that whole season.

Sam, Nancy and I haven't tried paper towels but we unhesitatingly use as much TP as the job requires. If this one were to get smashed I would buy another just like it.

 

[Steve Dion]

Different heads with all the same results. We have had WC, Jabsco, Raritan PH II, Raritan Sea-era and they all swallow the poop & the toilet paper. We have never had a problem in over 30 years of different heads on different boats.

I do agree that you need an adequate supply of water to move everything along, but there is no reason NOT to flush paper down the head when the members of the crew are adequately instructed.

If you are really concerned try a macerating head like the Sea Era, it will grind everything when exiting the head and it can grind it again when you exit the tank (assuming you are beyond the legal limit).

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

Because...

A macerator pump moves 12 gal/min...faster than a manual toilet can be pumped. So running it while pumping will result in a fried impeller in the macerator pump. The macerator blocks the head discharge line, so flushing the toilet without running the macerator is impossible and will only result in a back up. Attempting to alternate between pumping the toilet and short bursts with the macerator to keep things moving is a lot like rubbing your stomach and patting your head at the same time while you alternate hopping on one foot at time...it can be done, but it's not worth the effort.

 

[sailingdog]

LOL... very good explanation... I see..

The way I plumbed the head on my boat simplifies the plumbing and maximizes the capabilities of the system. Here's a very crude diagram of what I did.

Originally, the head was plumbed into the diverter valve and it led either to the holding tank or overboard, and the only way to empty the holding tank was via a pumpout station. While the head can no longer discharge directly overboard, I don't feel that I've lost any real capabilities, since I can now discharge the holding tank overboard.

 

[Tim R.]

Nice diagram Dog. If you already have the diverter valve than use it but it is not necessary in your setup. The system will work fine as long as your deck fitting has a decent seal and your through hull has a working seacock. This removes an expensive valve and eliminates a point of failure.

 

[sailingdog]

Tim-

Had the valve that the original setup used to divert the head waste line... so decided to re-locate it.