So I'm not ready to buy a boat but I'm confused at the quality of boat I should buy. I've seen a # at the $20K+ range - requiring little work. I've also seen some <$10K or $12-14K - obviously some work there. I'd prefer to buy a boat that needs some work so that I can put in the systems I want - as well as my own cushions - don't want my face on a cushion when I don't know what else was on the cushion. What do you guys think? Another consideration is that I want to use my 401K and live aboard the sailboat. It is allowable but I think I've read some restrictions like a max of $10K is all that is allowed - that's a problem and is what will limit my buying ability. What do you all think?
Buying a Catlaina 30
- Thread starter Kernix
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catalina 30 for 14k
save your money. a prime condition catalina 30 will take at least 5k a year just to keep it up; i know, i have one. think a minimum of 30k.
save your money. a prime condition catalina 30 will take at least 5k a year just to keep it up; i know, i have one. think a minimum of 30k.
I agree with Morty
Boats cost a lot of money so unless you have a large pension I would say clear of them. Your 401K is for food and shelter unless you have millions in it!
Boats cost a lot of money so unless you have a large pension I would say clear of them. Your 401K is for food and shelter unless you have millions in it!
Catalina 30 owner
Kernix.... When it comes to the Catalina 30, get the model you can best afford! My favorite 30 is the Mark II that started in 1987. It came with the updated electrical package panel and harness), winged keel, improved interior (laminants on counter tops are white), "T" shaped cockpit for more helmsman room, Universal M-18 or optional M-25, etc, etc, etc. Sure you can buy an older Catalina 30; however, make sure that the vessel was well kept that will minimize very costly repairs, updates and equipment purchases. Be aware of the historic issues in older bosts (mast compression post, "catalina smile" from leeching rusted keel bolts, engines lacking sufficient power (Universal 11HP), etc). Go the link and look up International Association for the Catalina 30 and you can download a chronology of changes based on hull number. For my money I would buy a newer model like the Mark II. Any sailboat can be a money pit and certainly the Catalina is no exception. Do your homework, take a look at as many as you can within the price range you set for yourself, compare models and by all means TAKE YOUR TIME. The Catalina 30 is a great boat, a decent liveaboard, able cruiser and one that seems to hold its value. If you have time on your hands and are a jack of all trades, the older, cheaper model may be just the ticket as well, especially since you desire to live aboard and will have the time to make the changes you want. Good luck Bob '88 Catalina 30 Breezin II
Kernix.... When it comes to the Catalina 30, get the model you can best afford! My favorite 30 is the Mark II that started in 1987. It came with the updated electrical package panel and harness), winged keel, improved interior (laminants on counter tops are white), "T" shaped cockpit for more helmsman room, Universal M-18 or optional M-25, etc, etc, etc. Sure you can buy an older Catalina 30; however, make sure that the vessel was well kept that will minimize very costly repairs, updates and equipment purchases. Be aware of the historic issues in older bosts (mast compression post, "catalina smile" from leeching rusted keel bolts, engines lacking sufficient power (Universal 11HP), etc). Go the link and look up International Association for the Catalina 30 and you can download a chronology of changes based on hull number. For my money I would buy a newer model like the Mark II. Any sailboat can be a money pit and certainly the Catalina is no exception. Do your homework, take a look at as many as you can within the price range you set for yourself, compare models and by all means TAKE YOUR TIME. The Catalina 30 is a great boat, a decent liveaboard, able cruiser and one that seems to hold its value. If you have time on your hands and are a jack of all trades, the older, cheaper model may be just the ticket as well, especially since you desire to live aboard and will have the time to make the changes you want. Good luck Bob '88 Catalina 30 Breezin II
I agree with Bob too!
if your going to live on the boat make sure you can afford the slip fees which tend to go up 5% per year. Make sure the marine you cehck allows live aboards and for goodness sakes live down south. It is too cold in the north to live aboard.
if your going to live on the boat make sure you can afford the slip fees which tend to go up 5% per year. Make sure the marine you cehck allows live aboards and for goodness sakes live down south. It is too cold in the north to live aboard.
catalina 30 for 14k
there's a fix-it-up fantay; before you bite spend a rainy sunday trying to fabricate standing rigging wire, running rigging, a winch, any sail, a diesel engine, and the next rainy sunday practice some serious fiberglass work.
there's a fix-it-up fantay; before you bite spend a rainy sunday trying to fabricate standing rigging wire, running rigging, a winch, any sail, a diesel engine, and the next rainy sunday practice some serious fiberglass work.
I don;t agree with mortyd
I have a '81 C-30 and I don't spend anything near $5000. a year for up-keep. I think that my expenses are more like $20. to $50. now and then. It is just not that bad, and you sound like a do-it-yourselfer so a $12000. boat might be just the ticket. Take your time and try to buy a dirty boat on a rainy day. Go ahead and make a low ball offer, what do you have to loose. I would say to fix the leaky windows first. Then pick your battles and enjoy.
I have a '81 C-30 and I don't spend anything near $5000. a year for up-keep. I think that my expenses are more like $20. to $50. now and then. It is just not that bad, and you sound like a do-it-yourselfer so a $12000. boat might be just the ticket. Take your time and try to buy a dirty boat on a rainy day. Go ahead and make a low ball offer, what do you have to loose. I would say to fix the leaky windows first. Then pick your battles and enjoy.
catalina 30 for 14k
roger, where can i send you fifty dollars for all the supplies just to recomission my engine this spring? then i'll another fifty for my chain plate repair. and after that another fifty for my new mainsheet, jib halyards, and traveler line i'm planning for just this spring. now, you'll have three years prepaid. just exactly how long have you had your 81 and what have you managed to repair and replace at the rate of fifty dollars per year?
roger, where can i send you fifty dollars for all the supplies just to recomission my engine this spring? then i'll another fifty for my chain plate repair. and after that another fifty for my new mainsheet, jib halyards, and traveler line i'm planning for just this spring. now, you'll have three years prepaid. just exactly how long have you had your 81 and what have you managed to repair and replace at the rate of fifty dollars per year?
catalina 30 for 14k
and roger, can we assume you clean the bottom of your never hauled, nor bottom painted, unregistered and uninsured boat, which you anchor for free, yourself? this among many, many other realities of sailboat ownership.
and roger, can we assume you clean the bottom of your never hauled, nor bottom painted, unregistered and uninsured boat, which you anchor for free, yourself? this among many, many other realities of sailboat ownership.
Some kind of a mission
Kernix, this guy is on some kind of a mission, I don't know what is. But don't let him stomp on your dreams. I have had project boats and loved every minute that I worked on them. Rodger
Kernix, this guy is on some kind of a mission, I don't know what is. But don't let him stomp on your dreams. I have had project boats and loved every minute that I worked on them. Rodger
1980 ...
or newer. IIRC it was 1979 before the boats came with SS keel bolts. I'm in the process of making my 1975 C30 "like new" ... $6000 to replace the keel bolts, $6000 for painting the topsides (between the WL and the rub rail). I spent the weekend stripping the deck for re-finishing, probably going to be another $12000. I spent over $1000 for upgrades to the engine (while it is out to get to the keel bolts). The bill for new halyards and other items is close to $4000. Rebuilding the pulpit and stern rails will be another $2000 or so. Over $30,000 not including replacing the wooden spreaders with aluminum, painting the mast and boom, or the new sails. I'll have over $40,000 into the boat in the last 14 months. The boat was built in 1975 ... 31 years ago ... not counting the money I've spent in the last 11 years that I've owned the boat, the refit alone adds up to more than $1000 per year of boat age. Anyone that says you are not going to spend $3-5000 per year to keep *any* 30 foot boat in good shape is lying to you, to themselves, or they neglect their boat. Count on 10% of the value of the boat to maintain it. If the average 1980 C30 is selling for $25,000 and the one you are looking at is $11,000, figure $1,000 for every year of boat age to bring the $11,000 boat up to above average condition, and another $2,500+ per year to keep it that way. That's $26,000 to bring the less expensive boat to as good or better condition than the $25,000 boat. Does $11,000 + $26,000 = $37,000 sound like a good deal for a boat that has an average resale of $25,000? Yes, I'm a fine one to talk ... I'm putting over $40,000 into a boat with an Atomic 4 that might sell for $19,000 on a good day.
In a few years, if I decide to sell her, someone will get a very nice boat for pennies on the dollar!
or newer. IIRC it was 1979 before the boats came with SS keel bolts. I'm in the process of making my 1975 C30 "like new" ... $6000 to replace the keel bolts, $6000 for painting the topsides (between the WL and the rub rail). I spent the weekend stripping the deck for re-finishing, probably going to be another $12000. I spent over $1000 for upgrades to the engine (while it is out to get to the keel bolts). The bill for new halyards and other items is close to $4000. Rebuilding the pulpit and stern rails will be another $2000 or so. Over $30,000 not including replacing the wooden spreaders with aluminum, painting the mast and boom, or the new sails. I'll have over $40,000 into the boat in the last 14 months. The boat was built in 1975 ... 31 years ago ... not counting the money I've spent in the last 11 years that I've owned the boat, the refit alone adds up to more than $1000 per year of boat age. Anyone that says you are not going to spend $3-5000 per year to keep *any* 30 foot boat in good shape is lying to you, to themselves, or they neglect their boat. Count on 10% of the value of the boat to maintain it. If the average 1980 C30 is selling for $25,000 and the one you are looking at is $11,000, figure $1,000 for every year of boat age to bring the $11,000 boat up to above average condition, and another $2,500+ per year to keep it that way. That's $26,000 to bring the less expensive boat to as good or better condition than the $25,000 boat. Does $11,000 + $26,000 = $37,000 sound like a good deal for a boat that has an average resale of $25,000? Yes, I'm a fine one to talk ... I'm putting over $40,000 into a boat with an Atomic 4 that might sell for $19,000 on a good day.
In a few years, if I decide to sell her, someone will get a very nice boat for pennies on the dollar!catalina 30 for 14k
ok rodger, here's my mission. this summer was an unusual one for me - absolutely nothing went wrong on my boat. still, i spent over eight hunred on insurance, two thousand on mooring, one hundred on registration. over a grand on hauling and winter storage, none of which i could have done myself nor cut costs on. and that's just what i recall off the top of my head. what don't you get? don't you think i have dreams too?
ok rodger, here's my mission. this summer was an unusual one for me - absolutely nothing went wrong on my boat. still, i spent over eight hunred on insurance, two thousand on mooring, one hundred on registration. over a grand on hauling and winter storage, none of which i could have done myself nor cut costs on. and that's just what i recall off the top of my head. what don't you get? don't you think i have dreams too?
Well
It depends on were your live i sold my J-24 10 years ago because the slip and other fees that cant be missed had become so high I have started looking again and again find a slip is out of the question in this area 125 + per foot and finding one that will allow over a 10 Ft beam is even harder A LOT of places DONT want sailboats at all they want powerboats that buy fuel every week Many of the yards here now are FULL SERVICE ONLY In general i have found that even buying NEW the boat cost is a drop in the bucket compared to the fixed costs in this area Tommays
It depends on were your live
i sold my J-24 10 years ago because the slip and other fees that cant be missed had become so high I have started looking again and again find a slip is out of the question in this area 125 + per foot and finding one that will allow over a 10 Ft beam is even harder A LOT of places DONT want sailboats at all they want powerboats that buy fuel every week Many of the yards here now are FULL SERVICE ONLY In general i have found that even buying NEW the boat cost is a drop in the bucket compared to the fixed costs in this area TommaysCatalina 30
Kernix, I suspect that they are all right. You can go crazy and spend outrageous amounts of money or be conservative and be just fine. We just bought an 85 for 23K that needs some work. We are do-it-yourselfers and are already in the mix. There are areas that you can save money with some research. Like you I was not using the existing cushons so we recvoered them. We found the Sunbrella fabric online for $8 per yard ratehr than the normal $30 local costs. We found the replacement knobs for losts less online. We decided to take our time and save where we can. I am re-doing the electrical little bit at a time (previous owner was abutcher). The lip fees for us are $444 per month. We expect to stay onboard 2 weekends a month so it is a good deal. We looked at around 15 CAT 30's over 2 months before we bought the one we have. Best I can suggest is make sure it is sound does not need anything major out the door. Nothing worse than not being able to sail after taking posession. It is MANDATORY that you get an independent surveyor to inspect the boat before you buy. You should have it hauled for the inspection. You want to be there for the inspection and ask lots of questions. If you want I have lots of liks I can send you that provided us with lots of data before we bought. The one we bought needed lots of TLC had been adandoned for 11 months and was filthy and trashed inside. I took 7 bags of trash out the first day I cleaned. Had to clean lots, fix electrical, new head and spray silicone on everything. We have had it 5 weeks and sailed six times and loved every minute. Stayed aboard last weekend and are getting ready for first long trip over Thanksgiving. Need new head installed dna dingy repaired before we go.
Kernix, I suspect that they are all right. You can go crazy and spend outrageous amounts of money or be conservative and be just fine. We just bought an 85 for 23K that needs some work. We are do-it-yourselfers and are already in the mix. There are areas that you can save money with some research. Like you I was not using the existing cushons so we recvoered them. We found the Sunbrella fabric online for $8 per yard ratehr than the normal $30 local costs. We found the replacement knobs for losts less online. We decided to take our time and save where we can. I am re-doing the electrical little bit at a time (previous owner was abutcher). The lip fees for us are $444 per month. We expect to stay onboard 2 weekends a month so it is a good deal. We looked at around 15 CAT 30's over 2 months before we bought the one we have. Best I can suggest is make sure it is sound does not need anything major out the door. Nothing worse than not being able to sail after taking posession. It is MANDATORY that you get an independent surveyor to inspect the boat before you buy. You should have it hauled for the inspection. You want to be there for the inspection and ask lots of questions. If you want I have lots of liks I can send you that provided us with lots of data before we bought. The one we bought needed lots of TLC had been adandoned for 11 months and was filthy and trashed inside. I took 7 bags of trash out the first day I cleaned. Had to clean lots, fix electrical, new head and spray silicone on everything. We have had it 5 weeks and sailed six times and loved every minute. Stayed aboard last weekend and are getting ready for first long trip over Thanksgiving. Need new head installed dna dingy repaired before we go.
CAT 30 Liveaboard
Kernix, Cruising World magazine has an article on cruising budgets in the October issue. It describes 3 types of budgets Simplicity, Moderation and High Life. Let me know if you cannot find it and I could sned you the article now that I am done. Brian Hakuna Matata San Diego
Kernix, Cruising World magazine has an article on cruising budgets in the October issue. It describes 3 types of budgets Simplicity, Moderation and High Life. Let me know if you cannot find it and I could sned you the article now that I am done. Brian Hakuna Matata San Diego
catalina 30 for 14k
brian, you say we all may be right, but you did not say how much your fixed costs are per year; insurance, anchorage, hauling and painting, and so many others. where does fifty dollars a year fit into your reality if we may all be right? it's nice that you got a deal on sunbrella, but what do you expect to spend on sails, not if, but when? you may get a deal on bottom paint, but at fifty dollars max/year don't expect to to paint much more than one tenth of the rudder.
brian, you say we all may be right, but you did not say how much your fixed costs are per year; insurance, anchorage, hauling and painting, and so many others. where does fifty dollars a year fit into your reality if we may all be right? it's nice that you got a deal on sunbrella, but what do you expect to spend on sails, not if, but when? you may get a deal on bottom paint, but at fifty dollars max/year don't expect to to paint much more than one tenth of the rudder.
catalina 30 for 14k
I never said $50 per year. What I was saying is that the costs can vary by each individual. There are fixed costs to owning a boat that you have to pay no matter what. For example San Diego is one of the more expensive areas for slip fees based on what I have read. We cannot get around them. WHat each of us does to their boat and how we accomplishh the maintenance have direct effects on the TCO (Total Cost of Ownership). We are going to have to replace our sails fairly soon and OI have started to shop for the best price. Costs of botom pain vary by who does it and when. For example there is a yard in Ensinada Mexico that does it for half the labor costs of San Diego and Newport Beach is 25% less than prices here in the off season. Based on our budget our TCO is going to be about $8500 per year including taxes, slip fee, insurance(s) and maintenance. We also plan on using it 2 to 3 weekends a month in prime season (9 months a year) and 2 weeks a month off season. We specifically looked for a boat that had the right price tag and was mechaniocally sound. Asthetics and other stuff we can do ourselves and it will not cause safety issues or impare our use. The whole goal is to be able to use the boat. If you have to expend every waking moment and dollar to fix it frsutration will come quickly. Each set of woners have to determine their level of dooalrs and committment. There is a balance between both.
I never said $50 per year. What I was saying is that the costs can vary by each individual. There are fixed costs to owning a boat that you have to pay no matter what. For example San Diego is one of the more expensive areas for slip fees based on what I have read. We cannot get around them. WHat each of us does to their boat and how we accomplishh the maintenance have direct effects on the TCO (Total Cost of Ownership). We are going to have to replace our sails fairly soon and OI have started to shop for the best price. Costs of botom pain vary by who does it and when. For example there is a yard in Ensinada Mexico that does it for half the labor costs of San Diego and Newport Beach is 25% less than prices here in the off season. Based on our budget our TCO is going to be about $8500 per year including taxes, slip fee, insurance(s) and maintenance. We also plan on using it 2 to 3 weekends a month in prime season (9 months a year) and 2 weeks a month off season. We specifically looked for a boat that had the right price tag and was mechaniocally sound. Asthetics and other stuff we can do ourselves and it will not cause safety issues or impare our use. The whole goal is to be able to use the boat. If you have to expend every waking moment and dollar to fix it frsutration will come quickly. Each set of woners have to determine their level of dooalrs and committment. There is a balance between both.
catalina 30 for 14k
brian, now we agree totally. it wasn't you, but a rodger who said 25 to fifty dollars a year. catalina 30's are expensive toys no matter whether expensive, very expensive, or very, very expesinve.
brian, now we agree totally. it wasn't you, but a rodger who said 25 to fifty dollars a year. catalina 30's are expensive toys no matter whether expensive, very expensive, or very, very expesinve.
Buy Newer
When I decided that I wanted a Catalina 30 I looked at a lot of them. The nice thing is that this is a very popular boat so it is easy to find them, find parts, etc. Research your boat and what you are willing to spend on it in the end. A fixer-upper might or might not be a good deal, know what you are getting into. The biggest piece of advice that I can give you is to take a camera with you, digital is nice. Take a lot of pictures of the boats you look at. Organize the pictures by the boat and break them down further by good points and bad points. If you do this it will make your decision much easier. I ended up with a 1990 Catalina 30 MK II Tallrig, bowsprit. I love this set up and I only draft 3' 10". That is a very nice draft for my area (Chesapeake Bay and Potomac River). Remember that any engine work will be expensive. You don't want to have any serious problems with the electrical work either. When you find a boat that you think might be the one, get a good survey. Things will be missed during the survey, but you will get a good working knowledge of the condition of the boat from a professional. Be there during the survey!!!! Remember, there are tons of Catalina 30s out there. Look at as many as you can, even ones out of your price-range (these will give you ideas on ways to fix up your boat etc.). Good Luck
When I decided that I wanted a Catalina 30 I looked at a lot of them. The nice thing is that this is a very popular boat so it is easy to find them, find parts, etc. Research your boat and what you are willing to spend on it in the end. A fixer-upper might or might not be a good deal, know what you are getting into. The biggest piece of advice that I can give you is to take a camera with you, digital is nice. Take a lot of pictures of the boats you look at. Organize the pictures by the boat and break them down further by good points and bad points. If you do this it will make your decision much easier. I ended up with a 1990 Catalina 30 MK II Tallrig, bowsprit. I love this set up and I only draft 3' 10". That is a very nice draft for my area (Chesapeake Bay and Potomac River). Remember that any engine work will be expensive. You don't want to have any serious problems with the electrical work either. When you find a boat that you think might be the one, get a good survey. Things will be missed during the survey, but you will get a good working knowledge of the condition of the boat from a professional. Be there during the survey!!!! Remember, there are tons of Catalina 30s out there. Look at as many as you can, even ones out of your price-range (these will give you ideas on ways to fix up your boat etc.). Good Luck
brian
brian, i'm new. have '82 ( just purchased ). could you email me... i have some questions. i also ordered a new head for the boat this am. tom_integrity@yahoo.com
brian, i'm new. have '82 ( just purchased ). could you email me... i have some questions. i also ordered a new head for the boat this am. tom_integrity@yahoo.com
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