I had my O'Day out yesterday evening. It was a bit of a chilly evening and the engine had some problems, but was an rather uneventful sail. After looking at how far I have to back in the boat, and how far forward the boat sits on the trailer, I'm begining to think that it's set up wrong. The trailer I have is a two axle, and the rear of the stub keel is lined up with the front axle. This seems really far forward. Most of the weight is distributed over the front of the trailer, where I belive it really should be centered over the axles. My question is where should the keel be? For anyone with a stock trailer on a 1979 Shoal keel O22, where does the axle lay under the keel? With this information I can properly center my O22 on my trailer and move the front post back. I'm thinking it's about four or five feet forward of where it should be. Thanks, Josh
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Tongue weight
Josh, You should adjust the boat for proper tongue weight. Opinions differ on this but I work between 100 and 300 pound tongue weight. You will find that it is not easy to guess how far to move the boat for a given tongue weight. I hope others will give opinions on tongue weight. r.w.landau
Josh, You should adjust the boat for proper tongue weight. Opinions differ on this but I work between 100 and 300 pound tongue weight. You will find that it is not easy to guess how far to move the boat for a given tongue weight. I hope others will give opinions on tongue weight. r.w.landau
Boat placement
My O'Day 23 rides fairly well even though it sits on the trailer with the keel a little forward of the axles. I've attached a photo. Hope it helps.
My O'Day 23 rides fairly well even though it sits on the trailer with the keel a little forward of the axles. I've attached a photo. Hope it helps.
Hey Dave,
Can you physically lift your trailer tongue by hand? Most boats I've had I could do this with, some a little harder then others. The Oday I can't even budge. I'm assuming it's about 400-500 lbs on the tongue. I'm also sits about three feet forward of where yours does. Also, does your trailer have a bunk for the keel to rest on? How high does the tongue sit off the ground when it's hitched to your pulling vehicle? I'm wondering if raising the tongue would float the boat easier? My trailer has rollers and a longer tongue, but otherwise is very similiar to yours. Can you tell me how high the front most and rear most bunk support posts are? I have some room to lower mine, and might do so, but am curious how low I should take them. I'm going to take it down tonight and drop her in the water, allowing me to work on the trailer while shes tied up to the dock. I'm going to have to see where everything sits when I move that front farm rearward. I will probably set it up similiar to yours, because that looks about right! Also, my trailer has a much longer tongue which will allow me to back the boat that much further into the water... Thanks for the pics, I'm going to take some tonight and post them if I can! Thanks, Josh
Can you physically lift your trailer tongue by hand? Most boats I've had I could do this with, some a little harder then others. The Oday I can't even budge. I'm assuming it's about 400-500 lbs on the tongue. I'm also sits about three feet forward of where yours does. Also, does your trailer have a bunk for the keel to rest on? How high does the tongue sit off the ground when it's hitched to your pulling vehicle? I'm wondering if raising the tongue would float the boat easier? My trailer has rollers and a longer tongue, but otherwise is very similiar to yours. Can you tell me how high the front most and rear most bunk support posts are? I have some room to lower mine, and might do so, but am curious how low I should take them. I'm going to take it down tonight and drop her in the water, allowing me to work on the trailer while shes tied up to the dock. I'm going to have to see where everything sits when I move that front farm rearward. I will probably set it up similiar to yours, because that looks about right! Also, my trailer has a much longer tongue which will allow me to back the boat that much further into the water... Thanks for the pics, I'm going to take some tonight and post them if I can! Thanks, Josh
Photos
I just added photos to the forum after adjusting the trailer. I found that the tongue weight was maybe 25 lbs if that after I moved it that far back. That was a little light! I moved it six inches forward from the 'after' picture. Check the photos or click the link..let me know what you think! Josh
I just added photos to the forum after adjusting the trailer. I found that the tongue weight was maybe 25 lbs if that after I moved it that far back. That was a little light! I moved it six inches forward from the 'after' picture. Check the photos or click the link..let me know what you think! Josh
How bout moving the axles forward
Any chance you could move the axles and wheels forward--it would balance the whole situation without having your boat cantilevered out over the back end of the trailer. Man, that looks scary to me. It's also probably putting a lot of stress on the trailer's whole frame (like a tree branch suporting a 150 lb blue jay hanging off the tip end--sooner or later, it might snap in the middle). I would also think about finding ways to put a bunk/platform or set of rollers under the bottom of the keel--it will help take some of the stress/weight off the existing stand rollers. I know that when you put a boat on stands in a boat yard, the pros always block/support under the keel, placing all the weight of the boat on the bottom of the keel. The jackstands are used merely for balance and side support to keep the boat from falling over. They NEVER put the full weight of the hull and keel on the hull via the stands. The same principles apply to trailer support. Your comment about the keel hanging in the water is not accurate because, when the boat's in the water, the whole hull/bottom distributes the weight of the keel against the water pressure (i.e., displacement). The keel hangs from the hull but its not pulling down the hull on a few rollers pressed against a few square inches of fiberglass--it's hanging on the whole underside of the hull (about 80 square feet of fiberglass) pressing against the water and distributing the weight over that whole area. It's analogous to holding up a loaded plastic garbage bag from underneath with the palm of your hand versus trying to balance the full bag on your pointer finger--chances are, your finger alone will poke through the plastic before the flatter, wider surface of your palm would. Your boat's hull will probably take the strain/stress of just the rollers holding it up but a kinder, gentler. more proper solution would be to install a bunk/platform to support the keel and then use the rollers simply for side to side/front to back balance and support. You might also be able to lower the whole boat on the trailer a bit--it looks pretty high up the way it is now. That looks pretty scary to me as well. Lowering the whole boat on the trailer has the added benefit of being able to float the boat off in a lot less water depth--no need to back down as far or find a really steep ramp. Good luck. Rich Lemmler, Jr. s/v TIME BANDIT 1975 O'Day 22
Any chance you could move the axles and wheels forward--it would balance the whole situation without having your boat cantilevered out over the back end of the trailer. Man, that looks scary to me. It's also probably putting a lot of stress on the trailer's whole frame (like a tree branch suporting a 150 lb blue jay hanging off the tip end--sooner or later, it might snap in the middle). I would also think about finding ways to put a bunk/platform or set of rollers under the bottom of the keel--it will help take some of the stress/weight off the existing stand rollers. I know that when you put a boat on stands in a boat yard, the pros always block/support under the keel, placing all the weight of the boat on the bottom of the keel. The jackstands are used merely for balance and side support to keep the boat from falling over. They NEVER put the full weight of the hull and keel on the hull via the stands. The same principles apply to trailer support. Your comment about the keel hanging in the water is not accurate because, when the boat's in the water, the whole hull/bottom distributes the weight of the keel against the water pressure (i.e., displacement). The keel hangs from the hull but its not pulling down the hull on a few rollers pressed against a few square inches of fiberglass--it's hanging on the whole underside of the hull (about 80 square feet of fiberglass) pressing against the water and distributing the weight over that whole area. It's analogous to holding up a loaded plastic garbage bag from underneath with the palm of your hand versus trying to balance the full bag on your pointer finger--chances are, your finger alone will poke through the plastic before the flatter, wider surface of your palm would. Your boat's hull will probably take the strain/stress of just the rollers holding it up but a kinder, gentler. more proper solution would be to install a bunk/platform to support the keel and then use the rollers simply for side to side/front to back balance and support. You might also be able to lower the whole boat on the trailer a bit--it looks pretty high up the way it is now. That looks pretty scary to me as well. Lowering the whole boat on the trailer has the added benefit of being able to float the boat off in a lot less water depth--no need to back down as far or find a really steep ramp. Good luck. Rich Lemmler, Jr. s/v TIME BANDIT 1975 O'Day 22
Trailer Modification...
Nope, the axles can't be moved. It's a very heavy duty trailer, rated for twice what my boat weighs. The hardware and suspension is welded to the frame. Even if I did, moving the axles would only cause more problems. With the axles further forward, the boat would also need to be further forward. This would mean I have to back the van half way into the water to get the boat off
As far as boat placement ON the trailer, it is still very front heavy, even after moving it back. Even when I had it back too far (as is in the picture) it was impossible for me to lift the front end of the boat off the trailer. The problem I found was that I had moved it too far past the pivot point of the trailer, not that of the boat. Too much weight to the back of the trailer past the rearward axle gave me a very light tongue. I moved it six inches forward, which made it more in line with suggested tongue weights, even if still a little light. The position of the rollers could be lowered, but if I'm going to put a bunk in for the keel I will be left with little room to lower them. The bunk would have to span the trailer cross members, and could therefore be placed no lower then the height of the trailer central frame member. The rollers will also have to be evened out so that the boat sits level if it is going to be placed properly on a bunk. If you look at the picture David provided, my boat now sits roughly at about the same position above the axles as his does. My trailer doesn't extend as far past my last axle as his does, but my rollers do. Thanks for the clarification on the bunk, I hadn't thought about the weight distribution of the water pressure versus that of the rollers on the hull. I guess those pictures will become 'before' pics, and some time this summer I'll put up the after's! Thanks everyone, Josh
Nope, the axles can't be moved. It's a very heavy duty trailer, rated for twice what my boat weighs. The hardware and suspension is welded to the frame. Even if I did, moving the axles would only cause more problems. With the axles further forward, the boat would also need to be further forward. This would mean I have to back the van half way into the water to get the boat off
As far as boat placement ON the trailer, it is still very front heavy, even after moving it back. Even when I had it back too far (as is in the picture) it was impossible for me to lift the front end of the boat off the trailer. The problem I found was that I had moved it too far past the pivot point of the trailer, not that of the boat. Too much weight to the back of the trailer past the rearward axle gave me a very light tongue. I moved it six inches forward, which made it more in line with suggested tongue weights, even if still a little light. The position of the rollers could be lowered, but if I'm going to put a bunk in for the keel I will be left with little room to lower them. The bunk would have to span the trailer cross members, and could therefore be placed no lower then the height of the trailer central frame member. The rollers will also have to be evened out so that the boat sits level if it is going to be placed properly on a bunk. If you look at the picture David provided, my boat now sits roughly at about the same position above the axles as his does. My trailer doesn't extend as far past my last axle as his does, but my rollers do. Thanks for the clarification on the bunk, I hadn't thought about the weight distribution of the water pressure versus that of the rollers on the hull. I guess those pictures will become 'before' pics, and some time this summer I'll put up the after's! Thanks everyone, JoshScale
I agree with RW. Tongue weight should be 100 to 300. My 25 is over 2 tons and tongue wieght is 300. Too heavy and the back of your vehical will get pushed when you hit significant bumps. Too light and you get a pull. You probably have to find a way to center the boat and use a scale to wiegh tongue wieght. Ric
I agree with RW. Tongue weight should be 100 to 300. My 25 is over 2 tons and tongue wieght is 300. Too heavy and the back of your vehical will get pushed when you hit significant bumps. Too light and you get a pull. You probably have to find a way to center the boat and use a scale to wiegh tongue wieght. Ric
tongue weight
As I recall, tongue weight should be about 10-15% of the total trailer/boat pkg weight. Maybe someone can verify/correct this recollection. Tongue weight can be adjusted by boat placement or axle placement. Move axle rearward, tongue weight increases. Move boat forward, tongue weight increases. Tongue weight too light, you can end up with a lot of side sway. Very dangerous. Tongue weight too high, excessive strain on vehicle.
As I recall, tongue weight should be about 10-15% of the total trailer/boat pkg weight. Maybe someone can verify/correct this recollection. Tongue weight can be adjusted by boat placement or axle placement. Move axle rearward, tongue weight increases. Move boat forward, tongue weight increases. Tongue weight too light, you can end up with a lot of side sway. Very dangerous. Tongue weight too high, excessive strain on vehicle.
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