I'm researching an article on Bilge Pump Systems, and seek information on actual Bilge Pump Failure Modes - particularilly and occurances of FIRE due to fouled or failed Pumps. Thanks & regards, Gord
- Status
- Not open for further replies.
P
Peggie Hall/HeadMistress
Fire due to failed bilge pump???
I suppose it's barely possible, but unlikely. If bilge pump has ever started a boat fire--at least on any recreational boat, I've never heard of it. The function of a bilge pump is to remove water from the boat, not pump it in...making bilge pumps useless as a fire fighting tool. An overheated motor caused by running dry--a stuck float switch, for instance--is about the only possible way that bilge pump failure could start a fire...and that's HIGHLY unlikely because a) safety regs require all electric pumps to have internal switches that turn them off when the motor overheats, and b) the surrounding environment is too wet to ignite. Most boat fires are electrical in origin, but rarely is the electrical device to blame...the cause can almost always be traced to the wiring--neglect or installation--chafed and fray wires, corroded connections, overloaded circuits, wrong wire size, wrong type of wire, etc--99% of which are due to owner neglect and ignorance. But even if the wiring went to a bilge pump, the pump wouldn't be blamed for any fire...the wiring would be. So any article relating bilge pumps to onboard fires is likely to be a very short one--TOO short to be a viable topic...leading me to wonder: what's your real agenda?
I suppose it's barely possible, but unlikely. If bilge pump has ever started a boat fire--at least on any recreational boat, I've never heard of it. The function of a bilge pump is to remove water from the boat, not pump it in...making bilge pumps useless as a fire fighting tool. An overheated motor caused by running dry--a stuck float switch, for instance--is about the only possible way that bilge pump failure could start a fire...and that's HIGHLY unlikely because a) safety regs require all electric pumps to have internal switches that turn them off when the motor overheats, and b) the surrounding environment is too wet to ignite. Most boat fires are electrical in origin, but rarely is the electrical device to blame...the cause can almost always be traced to the wiring--neglect or installation--chafed and fray wires, corroded connections, overloaded circuits, wrong wire size, wrong type of wire, etc--99% of which are due to owner neglect and ignorance. But even if the wiring went to a bilge pump, the pump wouldn't be blamed for any fire...the wiring would be. So any article relating bilge pumps to onboard fires is likely to be a very short one--TOO short to be a viable topic...leading me to wonder: what's your real agenda?
G
Gord May
Thanks, Peggy
1)The article would be a tutuorial on Bilge Pump System design & installation. 2)The Editor's original request was for Electrical considerations, including fire hazzards. My response was pretty similar to yours, but I thought I'd seek other (confirming?)experience. 3)I also thought that Bilge Pump Motors required thermal overload protection, but my initial research indicates otherwise in many cases. Regards, Gord
1)The article would be a tutuorial on Bilge Pump System design & installation. 2)The Editor's original request was for Electrical considerations, including fire hazzards. My response was pretty similar to yours, but I thought I'd seek other (confirming?)experience. 3)I also thought that Bilge Pump Motors required thermal overload protection, but my initial research indicates otherwise in many cases. Regards, Gord
G
Gord May
Bilge Pumps & Switches etc.
often fail. I would like to hear your anecdotes, on what caused the failure, and the consequences. Thanks, Gord
often fail. I would like to hear your anecdotes, on what caused the failure, and the consequences. Thanks, Gord
D
Don Alexander
Float Switches
Peggy, When my H376 was brand new (1996) the float switch became fouled with builder's debris. Having the recommended drip in the stern gland resulted in the stub keel filling up with seawater. Though I caught it before it reached the cabin sole, the water had already reached the cable splice where the switch and motor wires joined. Worse the three wires, one of which was permanently live, were all taped together. Result - wires completely corroded through and an inoperative pump. Modifications were to strip back and extend each wire separately, cover each join with self amalgamating tape and fit a junction box as high as possible under the cabin sole. No problems since. Other owners would do well to look at their installations. I like all your stuff Don.
Peggy, When my H376 was brand new (1996) the float switch became fouled with builder's debris. Having the recommended drip in the stern gland resulted in the stub keel filling up with seawater. Though I caught it before it reached the cabin sole, the water had already reached the cable splice where the switch and motor wires joined. Worse the three wires, one of which was permanently live, were all taped together. Result - wires completely corroded through and an inoperative pump. Modifications were to strip back and extend each wire separately, cover each join with self amalgamating tape and fit a junction box as high as possible under the cabin sole. No problems since. Other owners would do well to look at their installations. I like all your stuff Don.
B
Bill Ebling
Wrong fuse size could lead to failure and fire
One weekend last fall, when I entered my boat after being docked all week, I smelled burnt electrical insulation, and the smell of burned wood. I looked in the bilge and found about two gallons of water in the bilge covering my Rule 500 sump pump. The top of the submerged bilge pump was melted and charred and had a hole burned through the top about the size of a quarter. The underside of my sole just directly above the pump was had a char mark about 1 1/2 " in dia. The float switch was fouled and in the down position. I traced the bilge pump wiring back to the panel, it was all intact without any signs of damaged insulation. The Fuse at the panel was intact but held a 10 amp slow blow rather than the recommended 2.5 amp. What I believe happened..... The previous owner of the boat (or someone else, maybe me?) had placed a 10-amp slow blow fuse in the Bilge pump circuit. The float switched fouled keeping it in the down position. The pump ran dry and continued to run dry until the motor burned out, catching on fire, but fortunately the fire burned out before if spread to the sole. The water in the bilge is what subsequently entered the boat from the time the pump burned out until I arrived. If the pump was supposed to have overheated protection it did not work. I consider my self very lucky. This could have been much worse and set my boat on fire if the sole actually ignited. Lesson....Make sure the fuse is properly sized for the pump. Bill Ebling Yesterday's Dream 1985 H31 Crab Alley Bay, Kent Island MD
One weekend last fall, when I entered my boat after being docked all week, I smelled burnt electrical insulation, and the smell of burned wood. I looked in the bilge and found about two gallons of water in the bilge covering my Rule 500 sump pump. The top of the submerged bilge pump was melted and charred and had a hole burned through the top about the size of a quarter. The underside of my sole just directly above the pump was had a char mark about 1 1/2 " in dia. The float switch was fouled and in the down position. I traced the bilge pump wiring back to the panel, it was all intact without any signs of damaged insulation. The Fuse at the panel was intact but held a 10 amp slow blow rather than the recommended 2.5 amp. What I believe happened..... The previous owner of the boat (or someone else, maybe me?) had placed a 10-amp slow blow fuse in the Bilge pump circuit. The float switched fouled keeping it in the down position. The pump ran dry and continued to run dry until the motor burned out, catching on fire, but fortunately the fire burned out before if spread to the sole. The water in the bilge is what subsequently entered the boat from the time the pump burned out until I arrived. If the pump was supposed to have overheated protection it did not work. I consider my self very lucky. This could have been much worse and set my boat on fire if the sole actually ignited. Lesson....Make sure the fuse is properly sized for the pump. Bill Ebling Yesterday's Dream 1985 H31 Crab Alley Bay, Kent Island MD
- Status
- Not open for further replies.