I am wondering what I am able to run off my 2 marine batteries. I ahve a 85 Catalina with its stock batteries. I am a t a mooring so I don't have shore power. What type of appliances can I use that won't drain my batteries. Coffee maker, Microwave, TV, things of this nature. Any help in this matter will be helpful
Battery Usage
- Thread starter jaydog5000
- Start date
- Status
It all depends
on what applicances you use,what power they draw, and for how long you use them. And, how you plan to recharge or maintain the batteries. See link below for a tutorial by Don Casey.
on what applicances you use,what power they draw, and for how long you use them. And, how you plan to recharge or maintain the batteries. See link below for a tutorial by Don Casey.
My experience
I have a similar setup on my O'Day 25. I do use a 5 watt solar panel and charge controller that I leave in the cockpit when I'm not on the boat. Last season we always ran the chartplotter, delth finder, and eaither the VHF radio or stereo system. Water pump ran occasionally as well as running lights (maybe 30 minutes per trip). I sailed at least three nights a week and most weekends. I found that running on one battery and then switching to the other worked for me, and I pulled one battery at a time for charging. Each battery got one full charge during the season - I pulled the boat Nov 21. I think one of the things to consider is running one battery at a time - if you have the battery switch in the ALL position, the stronger battery will try to charge the weaker one. This is assuming you don't use the batteries for starting your engine, and that you get no charge from the motor. If you use one as a starting battery I would only use it for that purpose. Solar panels are getting reasonably priced now, and I think for most people in our situation (I am also on a mooring) they are a good investment. I paid about $90 for mine.
I have a similar setup on my O'Day 25. I do use a 5 watt solar panel and charge controller that I leave in the cockpit when I'm not on the boat. Last season we always ran the chartplotter, delth finder, and eaither the VHF radio or stereo system. Water pump ran occasionally as well as running lights (maybe 30 minutes per trip). I sailed at least three nights a week and most weekends. I found that running on one battery and then switching to the other worked for me, and I pulled one battery at a time for charging. Each battery got one full charge during the season - I pulled the boat Nov 21. I think one of the things to consider is running one battery at a time - if you have the battery switch in the ALL position, the stronger battery will try to charge the weaker one. This is assuming you don't use the batteries for starting your engine, and that you get no charge from the motor. If you use one as a starting battery I would only use it for that purpose. Solar panels are getting reasonably priced now, and I think for most people in our situation (I am also on a mooring) they are a good investment. I paid about $90 for mine.
Try these references
1. http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/WestAdvisorListView?storeId=10001&langId=-1&catalogId=10001 scroll down to electrical, energy budget 2. www.amplepower.com, download the Ample Power Primer 3. buy a book on sailboat electrical stuff - Don Casey's is good 4. go to sailnet.com, or BoatUS and do some more reading. 5. use google
1. http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/WestAdvisorListView?storeId=10001&langId=-1&catalogId=10001 scroll down to electrical, energy budget 2. www.amplepower.com, download the Ample Power Primer 3. buy a book on sailboat electrical stuff - Don Casey's is good 4. go to sailnet.com, or BoatUS and do some more reading. 5. use google
Basically ... at a mooring you run little more
than standard boat stuff off the standard dual batteries. If you need extra juice ... you need to get a small generator. Anything that requires heat to make ... stove it. Vic
than standard boat stuff off the standard dual batteries. If you need extra juice ... you need to get a small generator. Anything that requires heat to make ... stove it. Vic
You're At The Beginning Of A Steep Learning Curve
Jay, You really can't go in blind here. The first thing you're going to need to do is to test your batteries to see what general condition they're in, and then find out how your system is handling the demands put on it now, before those appliances come on board. Since you're on a mooring, you will need to reserve energy for starting the engine, so it will be prudent to move your battery switch from "All" to either "1" or "2" when using power in the mooring or while under sail, so that you always have a fresh starting battery. Many owners with our simple system (two deepcycle batteries, each wired separately through that master DC switch) alternate which battery is designated to be the starting battery and which the house battery on alternate days: draw bank #1 down on house loads, switch to bank #2, start engine, let alternator replace the starting charge, then switch the selector to bank #1 to replenish that bank. When that bank is charged up, switch to "2" and use that as the new house bank. It's possible to discharge 80% of a a deep-cycle battery's capacity without permanent damage, but a 50% discharge is more economical in the long run, and is the rule of thumb among sailors. The deeper the discharge, the fewer the number of times the battery will be able to go through a discharge/charge cycle. Disccharge 20%, you don't get much out of them, but they last a long time; discharge 80%, you get a lot out of each cycle, but they won't last long. 50% is a good balance between service and economy. Here is my advice based on very modest knowledge. I will not try to sell you generators and such; my comments are just about using the system you have. If you primarily use your engine only to leave/return to your mooring, you will very likely discover that you in a 24-hr period you are drawing more power from your system than you are putting back, and then must decide how you will balance your energy demands with your charging capacity. Those options would include, in the order I'd want to install them, going generally from most economical/quietest to more complicated and/or noisy, are: running your engine on the hook each day with a "smart" regulator that will shorten the time it will take for your alternator to charge your batteries; solar panels; a wind generator (in concert with the solar); and finally a portable generator. We each have our preferences, and those calls are up to you. I think my progression is logical. You don't say which Catalina you have, but I'm pretty sure that year C30, for example, has two group 24 deep-cycle batteries; the right type, but rather small in terms of storage capacity. If you have 24s, the next time your batteries need replacing, I'd recommend enlarging the size of your battery boxes to accomodate group 27s, which are bigger and will naturally store more amp-hours. Choose a time after you have motored for a while with your master DC switch set on "All," you have picked up your mooring, and are confident that both batteries are charged to their full capacity. Let them settle five minutes or so after the the engine is shut off. Have a digital multi-meter handy. Set it to 20v DC. Turn on your DC panel (the top switch on the right-side column of swithes, just under your analog voltmeter). The needle should jump to life, but it's impossible to tell what's going on by looking at that needle. Set your master DC switch to "1." Drop (unlock and lower) the panel face. Measure the voltage of your #1 battery by touching the leads of the digital voltmeter to the two posts on the back of the analog voltmeter, red to red, & black to black. Note the voltage. Switch the master DC to "2." Test the second battery. Note the voltage. 12.7v 100% charge 12.4v 75% charge 12.2v 50% charge 12.0v 25% charge 11.9v 0% charge Now you know where you are starting from. Assuming you're motored around a good long while, values under 12.7v indicate a battery that has lost a percentage of its overall storage capacity. This typically happens through repeated under-charging, but it can mean a bad battery. "Super-charging" a battery like this can restore some/all capacity, if the battery itself does not already have one foot in the grave. I'll let you read up on this yourself. After the test, make sure that EACH battery will start the engine easily by itself (I have a weak one that will not: if I let the good one discharge, how would I start my engine?). They're not starting batteries, so put out fewer cranking amps, so they, and your engine, need to be in good shape to do this. When you're satisfied each battery will easily start the engine by itself and that they are generally healthy, move your master DC switch to "1" and try to use a typical day's worth of electricity in one evening: a few hours of radio; a couple hours of VHF; a few hours of cabin lights; wash your hands/do dishes, etc. Measure your closed-circuit voltage across the back of the voltmeter every hour or so, so see how you're holding up. If you get down to 50% (12.2v), your battery's done before you are. Now you can think about what life will be like w/OUT an inverter to run AC appliances. Barely adequate? Probably. A DC-to-AC inverter will allow you to operate all the AC equipment you want, but at a price. You might be able to install one and use appliances that use power intermittently (like the microwave for a couple of minutes at a time); but it's unlikely that you will be able to run a TV very long. And the inverter itself uses up power because of the inefficiency of coverting DC to AC, so that has to be factored in. If you have a bigger boat that is likely to have group 27s, you might get away with some of it, but you'll definitely become an amp-hour miser. You'll likely see that you need more charging capacity. Depending on how you use your engine, the smart regulator (to replace the external regulator on your alternator) if you typically have the motor running for some time every day, or don't mind running it at the mooring, will recharge your batts more quickly; the solar panel/s (quiet, pricey for output, needs right conditions and a little wiring know-how); the wind generator (less quiet, kinda pricey for output, needs right conditions and some wiring know-how); or the gasoline generator (needs its own fuel, not quiet, but relatively quick with unlimited output) will go onto your shopping list. Doing a lot of research on each of these options, and considering your boating lifestyle, would be wise before commiting to any of them. Adding a third, dedicated starting battery usually tumbles into the mix somewhere along the line as owners seek to maximize their house bank performance. Know what you have now and how you use it; then consider whether or not upgrading to get more convenience and maintenance is what you want. The articles above will be helpful, but that's just the tip of the information iceberg available. Fair Winds, Jeff
Jay, You really can't go in blind here. The first thing you're going to need to do is to test your batteries to see what general condition they're in, and then find out how your system is handling the demands put on it now, before those appliances come on board. Since you're on a mooring, you will need to reserve energy for starting the engine, so it will be prudent to move your battery switch from "All" to either "1" or "2" when using power in the mooring or while under sail, so that you always have a fresh starting battery. Many owners with our simple system (two deepcycle batteries, each wired separately through that master DC switch) alternate which battery is designated to be the starting battery and which the house battery on alternate days: draw bank #1 down on house loads, switch to bank #2, start engine, let alternator replace the starting charge, then switch the selector to bank #1 to replenish that bank. When that bank is charged up, switch to "2" and use that as the new house bank. It's possible to discharge 80% of a a deep-cycle battery's capacity without permanent damage, but a 50% discharge is more economical in the long run, and is the rule of thumb among sailors. The deeper the discharge, the fewer the number of times the battery will be able to go through a discharge/charge cycle. Disccharge 20%, you don't get much out of them, but they last a long time; discharge 80%, you get a lot out of each cycle, but they won't last long. 50% is a good balance between service and economy. Here is my advice based on very modest knowledge. I will not try to sell you generators and such; my comments are just about using the system you have. If you primarily use your engine only to leave/return to your mooring, you will very likely discover that you in a 24-hr period you are drawing more power from your system than you are putting back, and then must decide how you will balance your energy demands with your charging capacity. Those options would include, in the order I'd want to install them, going generally from most economical/quietest to more complicated and/or noisy, are: running your engine on the hook each day with a "smart" regulator that will shorten the time it will take for your alternator to charge your batteries; solar panels; a wind generator (in concert with the solar); and finally a portable generator. We each have our preferences, and those calls are up to you. I think my progression is logical. You don't say which Catalina you have, but I'm pretty sure that year C30, for example, has two group 24 deep-cycle batteries; the right type, but rather small in terms of storage capacity. If you have 24s, the next time your batteries need replacing, I'd recommend enlarging the size of your battery boxes to accomodate group 27s, which are bigger and will naturally store more amp-hours. Choose a time after you have motored for a while with your master DC switch set on "All," you have picked up your mooring, and are confident that both batteries are charged to their full capacity. Let them settle five minutes or so after the the engine is shut off. Have a digital multi-meter handy. Set it to 20v DC. Turn on your DC panel (the top switch on the right-side column of swithes, just under your analog voltmeter). The needle should jump to life, but it's impossible to tell what's going on by looking at that needle. Set your master DC switch to "1." Drop (unlock and lower) the panel face. Measure the voltage of your #1 battery by touching the leads of the digital voltmeter to the two posts on the back of the analog voltmeter, red to red, & black to black. Note the voltage. Switch the master DC to "2." Test the second battery. Note the voltage. 12.7v 100% charge 12.4v 75% charge 12.2v 50% charge 12.0v 25% charge 11.9v 0% charge Now you know where you are starting from. Assuming you're motored around a good long while, values under 12.7v indicate a battery that has lost a percentage of its overall storage capacity. This typically happens through repeated under-charging, but it can mean a bad battery. "Super-charging" a battery like this can restore some/all capacity, if the battery itself does not already have one foot in the grave. I'll let you read up on this yourself. After the test, make sure that EACH battery will start the engine easily by itself (I have a weak one that will not: if I let the good one discharge, how would I start my engine?). They're not starting batteries, so put out fewer cranking amps, so they, and your engine, need to be in good shape to do this. When you're satisfied each battery will easily start the engine by itself and that they are generally healthy, move your master DC switch to "1" and try to use a typical day's worth of electricity in one evening: a few hours of radio; a couple hours of VHF; a few hours of cabin lights; wash your hands/do dishes, etc. Measure your closed-circuit voltage across the back of the voltmeter every hour or so, so see how you're holding up. If you get down to 50% (12.2v), your battery's done before you are. Now you can think about what life will be like w/OUT an inverter to run AC appliances. Barely adequate? Probably. A DC-to-AC inverter will allow you to operate all the AC equipment you want, but at a price. You might be able to install one and use appliances that use power intermittently (like the microwave for a couple of minutes at a time); but it's unlikely that you will be able to run a TV very long. And the inverter itself uses up power because of the inefficiency of coverting DC to AC, so that has to be factored in. If you have a bigger boat that is likely to have group 27s, you might get away with some of it, but you'll definitely become an amp-hour miser. You'll likely see that you need more charging capacity. Depending on how you use your engine, the smart regulator (to replace the external regulator on your alternator) if you typically have the motor running for some time every day, or don't mind running it at the mooring, will recharge your batts more quickly; the solar panel/s (quiet, pricey for output, needs right conditions and a little wiring know-how); the wind generator (less quiet, kinda pricey for output, needs right conditions and some wiring know-how); or the gasoline generator (needs its own fuel, not quiet, but relatively quick with unlimited output) will go onto your shopping list. Doing a lot of research on each of these options, and considering your boating lifestyle, would be wise before commiting to any of them. Adding a third, dedicated starting battery usually tumbles into the mix somewhere along the line as owners seek to maximize their house bank performance. Know what you have now and how you use it; then consider whether or not upgrading to get more convenience and maintenance is what you want. The articles above will be helpful, but that's just the tip of the information iceberg available. Fair Winds, Jeff
- Status