My Boat has a simple autopilot that I haven't uesed a lot. The main use has been to head the boat into the wind while raising or lowering sails or running to the head. But I am wondering if many people use their autopilots on longer passages or do most people use some sort of windvane self steering. My autopilot uses a compass and if the wind heels too much the compass card can get stuck. If you are using an autopilot or self steering device how long do you sleep??? Obviously if close to shipping etc sleep is not a good idea. But say you are away from the shipping lanes and over 50 miles from shore. 30 minutes??? I guess that the only other option for sleep would be to drop sails.
Autopilot steering
- Thread starter MoonSailer
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We use ours all the time
on long distance sails. ST 3000. For more reading on autopilot operations, see the link Two "sleeping" options: if there's a breeze, heave to; no wind, leave a reefed main up and motorsail slowly. Dropping sails is usually more effort for a singlehander, because then you have to get them up again.
on long distance sails. ST 3000. For more reading on autopilot operations, see the link Two "sleeping" options: if there's a breeze, heave to; no wind, leave a reefed main up and motorsail slowly. Dropping sails is usually more effort for a singlehander, because then you have to get them up again.
I use our Autohelm 7000 pilot quite a bit...
during cruising. It gives me time to tweak sail trim, frequent bow sweeps and just enjoying the scenery and marine life. Most all of our cruising is in PNW protected waters, but commercial shipping lanes, navigation hazards and related vessel issues all need a watchful eye. Terry
during cruising. It gives me time to tweak sail trim, frequent bow sweeps and just enjoying the scenery and marine life. Most all of our cruising is in PNW protected waters, but commercial shipping lanes, navigation hazards and related vessel issues all need a watchful eye. Terry
A little different
I use an auto pilot a lot when single handing. It is a practically a must for single handers. But as for sleeping I do it a little different. Maybe I'm just anal. But I do all my sleeping during the day. That way at least when I am asleep I am usually visible to others. I have a radar, turned on watch, with the incursion range at 10 miles. Don't have a set amount of time that I sleep, but when on the boat I am a very, very light sleeper. Probably average 30 min or less, for naps. This has worked well for me on 6 & 7 day gulf crossings.
I use an auto pilot a lot when single handing. It is a practically a must for single handers. But as for sleeping I do it a little different. Maybe I'm just anal. But I do all my sleeping during the day. That way at least when I am asleep I am usually visible to others. I have a radar, turned on watch, with the incursion range at 10 miles. Don't have a set amount of time that I sleep, but when on the boat I am a very, very light sleeper. Probably average 30 min or less, for naps. This has worked well for me on 6 & 7 day gulf crossings.
Autopilot
Moonsailer- I have a 25' boat with a tiller. I use the tiller pilot a lot under power and with the sails up. It really lets me relax and enjoy myself. I like to grab the tiller and handle the boat too. When I am sailing with the AP on I tend to loosen things up. It gives you a little more time if the crap hits the fan. I dont have any passages that require me to sleep, but I have closed my eyes to rest them for an extended period of time. I know if my tiller pilot went bad, I would have one air dropped in pronto!
Moonsailer- I have a 25' boat with a tiller. I use the tiller pilot a lot under power and with the sails up. It really lets me relax and enjoy myself. I like to grab the tiller and handle the boat too. When I am sailing with the AP on I tend to loosen things up. It gives you a little more time if the crap hits the fan. I dont have any passages that require me to sleep, but I have closed my eyes to rest them for an extended period of time. I know if my tiller pilot went bad, I would have one air dropped in pronto!
Auto
I use mine quite a bit while cruising in fact I am so spoiled by it I consider it a necessary item. I think if I had to choose between rooer furling and the AP I would take the AP. I have slept for 15 - 20 minute shots with it, but almost had a collision doing that once, so I don't do that anymore.
I use mine quite a bit while cruising in fact I am so spoiled by it I consider it a necessary item. I think if I had to choose between rooer furling and the AP I would take the AP. I have slept for 15 - 20 minute shots with it, but almost had a collision doing that once, so I don't do that anymore.
Hi Charlie, give Raymarine a call and see whether ...
they have any factory returns or model close outs available for purchase. Give them a poor mouth tight budget spiel and see if they can help you out. It is worth a shot. (800) 539-5539 Terry
they have any factory returns or model close outs available for purchase. Give them a poor mouth tight budget spiel and see if they can help you out. It is worth a shot. (800) 539-5539 Terry
I use a NAVICO WP5000 all the time and my experience is
similar to NICE N EASY. I use radar and try to do my sleeping during the day. I also use my GPS to instruct my WP ( my system is all integrated with a Fluxgate Compass and the Radar included). That way I can set in an extreme course change 4 or 5 miles away and when I get there the auto pilot will not respond because the change is too severe (it won't let me automatically turn into lets say a boat alongside), so it sounds an alarm and gets my attention. I think an alarm clock could do the same thing. I think all autopilots use a compass and the internal gimbal should accommodate 15 to 20 degrees heel and that is to much for efficient sailing. At about 15 degrees heel you would be beginning to use too much corrective rudder and actually start slowing the boat. If you are jamming the AP compass you should ease off the main a little more. Actually you should single hand that way anyway, as in balancing your sails to take the load off your pilot. Your main should be a little loose and the jib should be a little tight. That way your boat hunts the wind. When you fall off your main gets more efficient and the jib stalls. It shifts the drive aft, and turns the boat up. Then the main luffs slightly, and the jib gets more efficient and turns the head down. I sailed many miles by just balancing the rig before I ever had an autopilot.
similar to NICE N EASY. I use radar and try to do my sleeping during the day. I also use my GPS to instruct my WP ( my system is all integrated with a Fluxgate Compass and the Radar included). That way I can set in an extreme course change 4 or 5 miles away and when I get there the auto pilot will not respond because the change is too severe (it won't let me automatically turn into lets say a boat alongside), so it sounds an alarm and gets my attention. I think an alarm clock could do the same thing. I think all autopilots use a compass and the internal gimbal should accommodate 15 to 20 degrees heel and that is to much for efficient sailing. At about 15 degrees heel you would be beginning to use too much corrective rudder and actually start slowing the boat. If you are jamming the AP compass you should ease off the main a little more. Actually you should single hand that way anyway, as in balancing your sails to take the load off your pilot. Your main should be a little loose and the jib should be a little tight. That way your boat hunts the wind. When you fall off your main gets more efficient and the jib stalls. It shifts the drive aft, and turns the boat up. Then the main luffs slightly, and the jib gets more efficient and turns the head down. I sailed many miles by just balancing the rig before I ever had an autopilot.
Ross I don't blame you for not wanting to change but
you should know that if you charge both banks at once as is most often the case, the charge goes disproportionately to the most discharged bank. If that bank is weak the charge might not contribute much to the other and the bad one might not accept the charge. You could end up - up the creek. A single combined bank besides being twice the capacity and more efficient wears down more gradually, and will take an ever increasing charge at each recharge letting you know that they might be getting tired. Keep what you have but be cautious.
you should know that if you charge both banks at once as is most often the case, the charge goes disproportionately to the most discharged bank. If that bank is weak the charge might not contribute much to the other and the bad one might not accept the charge. You could end up - up the creek. A single combined bank besides being twice the capacity and more efficient wears down more gradually, and will take an ever increasing charge at each recharge letting you know that they might be getting tired. Keep what you have but be cautious.
Getting Ran Over by a SHip
I don't know what I will do if/when I ever get out there but heaving to to sleep does not sound like a great ideal. If you are well away from land the biggest threat is getting hit by a ship. So heaving to does little or nothing to protect you from this event. The other downside of heaving to is that you are not making forward progress. So whatever your speed times the length of sleep is distance not made. So if you were sailing along at 5 knots and sleep for 6 hours you have lost 30 miles of progress!!!!! So sailing from Mobile to Key west is about 400 miles and at 5 knots takes about 80 hours of sailing. Sleeping while hove to would add another day to the trip. Hopefully when and if I make this trip I will have at least one other crew member. But if alone I don't know what I'll do. If the weather is calm stopping to sleep might be the way to go. If it is rough I doubt that sleeping would be possible except as a series of 15-30 minute cat naps. The few times I have been without sleep for a day or more I've found that a catnap really helps.
I don't know what I will do if/when I ever get out there but heaving to to sleep does not sound like a great ideal. If you are well away from land the biggest threat is getting hit by a ship. So heaving to does little or nothing to protect you from this event. The other downside of heaving to is that you are not making forward progress. So whatever your speed times the length of sleep is distance not made. So if you were sailing along at 5 knots and sleep for 6 hours you have lost 30 miles of progress!!!!! So sailing from Mobile to Key west is about 400 miles and at 5 knots takes about 80 hours of sailing. Sleeping while hove to would add another day to the trip. Hopefully when and if I make this trip I will have at least one other crew member. But if alone I don't know what I'll do. If the weather is calm stopping to sleep might be the way to go. If it is rough I doubt that sleeping would be possible except as a series of 15-30 minute cat naps. The few times I have been without sleep for a day or more I've found that a catnap really helps.
"may lead to a relaxation of the permanent watch"
I love my Raymarine ST1000+ Tiller Pilot. I don't have radar and I don't sleep while underway. I remember the manual for the tiller pilot warned against a "relaxation of the permanent watch".
I love my Raymarine ST1000+ Tiller Pilot. I don't have radar and I don't sleep while underway. I remember the manual for the tiller pilot warned against a "relaxation of the permanent watch".
Might want to read some books about singlehanding
and how they deal with sleep. Don Street, Richard Henderson and Frank Granville (sp?) have written extesnively about the issue. If you "don't know what I'm going to do about it" wait to go until you do. The basic concept is to rearrange your sleeping routine befor you leave to sleep during the day (catnaps, alarm clock, etc.) and stay awake at night. Your math is fuzzy on the lost time, too, because you move when hove to at anywhere from 1 -2 knots, so you don't lose a whole day. Of course, it all depends on the direction of the wind compared to where you are going, in order to find the best tack to heave to on.
and how they deal with sleep. Don Street, Richard Henderson and Frank Granville (sp?) have written extesnively about the issue. If you "don't know what I'm going to do about it" wait to go until you do. The basic concept is to rearrange your sleeping routine befor you leave to sleep during the day (catnaps, alarm clock, etc.) and stay awake at night. Your math is fuzzy on the lost time, too, because you move when hove to at anywhere from 1 -2 knots, so you don't lose a whole day. Of course, it all depends on the direction of the wind compared to where you are going, in order to find the best tack to heave to on.
Chuck, nice install
Building confidence in your equipment is what much of this sport is all about. Good luck next season. As I said recently, on another thread, "Not all sales are bargains and not all bargains are sales."
Building confidence in your equipment is what much of this sport is all about. Good luck next season. As I said recently, on another thread, "Not all sales are bargains and not all bargains are sales."
Stu , How true it is.
I think Jackie Gleason said that too.. Thanks for the compliment. After power boating for 50 years I'm sure enjoying my sailboat in retirement. Need to live where I can sail all year.
I think Jackie Gleason said that too.. Thanks for the compliment. After power boating for 50 years I'm sure enjoying my sailboat in retirement. Need to live where I can sail all year.
Sleeping and single handing
Others may have different areas and different needs. In the gulf, the vast majority of the big boat traffic comes out of the Yucatan Channel, and is headed for either New Orleans, or Houston/Galveston. Large boat traffic heading anywhere east of Mobile is pretty scarce. And once away from Mobile bay, there are almost no oil rigs, long as you don't head west. In the eastern gulf, Mobile to Key West would be a good example, boat traffic is very light. Last time I crossed was from Sannibel to Pascagula, and if memory serves we saw one other boat in four days. And it was another sail boat. I wouldn't hesitate to do that trip single handed. If I were to go from say, Mobile to Galveston, through the shipping lanes and the oil fields, I would probably not even attempt that single handed. Just too much stuff out there to try and be safe and sleep.
Others may have different areas and different needs. In the gulf, the vast majority of the big boat traffic comes out of the Yucatan Channel, and is headed for either New Orleans, or Houston/Galveston. Large boat traffic heading anywhere east of Mobile is pretty scarce. And once away from Mobile bay, there are almost no oil rigs, long as you don't head west. In the eastern gulf, Mobile to Key West would be a good example, boat traffic is very light. Last time I crossed was from Sannibel to Pascagula, and if memory serves we saw one other boat in four days. And it was another sail boat. I wouldn't hesitate to do that trip single handed. If I were to go from say, Mobile to Galveston, through the shipping lanes and the oil fields, I would probably not even attempt that single handed. Just too much stuff out there to try and be safe and sleep.
Sleep Deprivation and the Singlehander
Like Stu, I’m mainly a day sailing singlehander (albeit, sometimes for very, very long days) so I do not have firsthand knowledge about sleep deprivation and the singlehander. The singlehanders I know who have done long passages (SF to Honolulu) do the 20-30 minute cat-nap thing, or about the time it takes a ship to go from horizon to you. Granted, half of the ship traffic is going in their direction. The good news is these ships are manned by American crews and IMHO have better watch keeping standards (or at least that is what my friends from Matson and APL tell me). Now, here is the interesting part from my two singlehander friends (6 transits to Hawaii, 2 as singlehands). They tend to do more 20 min sleep cycles at night and spend longer awake durations during the day so they can fly their spinnakers when it is easier to see, and at night, they take down the spin and fly double headsails (no main). That way, the boat tracks DDW (the general direction to Hawaii) and they don’t have to worry about sailing by the lee and suffering an accidental gybe. I also understand that the fellow who did this trip in a WWP 19 double headsailed most of the way.
Like Stu, I’m mainly a day sailing singlehander (albeit, sometimes for very, very long days) so I do not have firsthand knowledge about sleep deprivation and the singlehander. The singlehanders I know who have done long passages (SF to Honolulu) do the 20-30 minute cat-nap thing, or about the time it takes a ship to go from horizon to you. Granted, half of the ship traffic is going in their direction. The good news is these ships are manned by American crews and IMHO have better watch keeping standards (or at least that is what my friends from Matson and APL tell me). Now, here is the interesting part from my two singlehander friends (6 transits to Hawaii, 2 as singlehands). They tend to do more 20 min sleep cycles at night and spend longer awake durations during the day so they can fly their spinnakers when it is easier to see, and at night, they take down the spin and fly double headsails (no main). That way, the boat tracks DDW (the general direction to Hawaii) and they don’t have to worry about sailing by the lee and suffering an accidental gybe. I also understand that the fellow who did this trip in a WWP 19 double headsailed most of the way.
Stu there is a catch 22
You read and plan but once you are out there in a situation it is often different. It is what I call a "reality check". I can easily see drifting along alseep but if the wind is up I don't know how I will react. A movingboat is often more comfortable than one just rocking in the waves. Nice and Easy's point about location is relevant. I don't think that sleeping while sailing around oil rigs is a good ideal. But your ideal might be right. Mistakes happen when you are tired so whatever it takes I will need to sleep. I was reading about a woman Heather Neill who was talking big about her plan to sail a Flicka around the world single handed. I humbly suggested that she might want to make some smaller voyages. Anyway she got about 100 miles out in the guld got scared and came back. So far no plans to make a second attempt. That is what I call a reality check. Sail across the gulf of mexico and around the carribean BEFORE planning to single hand around the world. Who knows I might circumnaviage some day. But first I will be real comfortable coastal cruising and maybe a few 4-500 mile passages.
You read and plan but once you are out there in a situation it is often different. It is what I call a "reality check". I can easily see drifting along alseep but if the wind is up I don't know how I will react. A movingboat is often more comfortable than one just rocking in the waves. Nice and Easy's point about location is relevant. I don't think that sleeping while sailing around oil rigs is a good ideal. But your ideal might be right. Mistakes happen when you are tired so whatever it takes I will need to sleep. I was reading about a woman Heather Neill who was talking big about her plan to sail a Flicka around the world single handed. I humbly suggested that she might want to make some smaller voyages. Anyway she got about 100 miles out in the guld got scared and came back. So far no plans to make a second attempt. That is what I call a reality check. Sail across the gulf of mexico and around the carribean BEFORE planning to single hand around the world. Who knows I might circumnaviage some day. But first I will be real comfortable coastal cruising and maybe a few 4-500 mile passages.
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