Are the interior wooden walls structural? Ok to remove them?

[Gillingham]

We have a Catalina 22, an early model with an interior as shown below.

We would like to remove the two interior separator walls shown with the red arrows below, to create a bigger open space down below.

Please could you tell me if you know, do these wooden separator walls serve any structural function? Is it OK to remove them, or will this affect the structure of the boat?

 

[Doug4bass]

Might wanna look at your chainplates.

 

[CaptDon01]

Re: Are the interior wooden walls structural? Ok to remove t

Ditto on the chainplates. Also it would make the boat illegal IAW the class racing rules. But, if you don't intend to race the boat, who cares,(but you might want to hold onto them for the next owner).

Don

 

[CloudDiver]

If you want to remove them (if you don't intend to race), you can but you will have to make 'substitutes' that are trimmed down.
- Take your rig down
- Unbolt the chain plates and unscrew the bulkheads (walls)
- Keep the originals, stow them somewhere safe (but first use them as a pattern).
- Get some nice 3/4" sanded plywood. Marine grade is ideal, but you'd be fine with regular plywood as long as you prime it and paint it.
- Make a shortened version of the originals; on the outboard of each bulkhead it needs to go all the way top to bottom then over to where the chain plates bolt in. At an inch or two inboard of the bulkhead you can drop a line vertically or at a slight angle down to where the top edge of where the bulkhead meets the fiberglass liner.
- Its important to carry over the Port side at the right height so there some material to put two screws in the back and into the compression post, this prevents the compression post from being 'kicked out' accidentally. Basically follow the same line that cover boards for the V berth make.

I write all this stuff.... I talk to much. I made some lines on your original picture. Here ya go;

 

[watercolors II]

Bulkheads

That partition is there for a purpose and that is right where the wind loads on the sails is transfered to the sides of the hull. The post supports the cabin roof, but the pull on the side stays will want to pull the sides inward towards the base of the mast without the bulkheads being there.

The 1986 year started what is called the new style of 22 and in this area is were major side support was added to the hull shape when they eliminated other areas of the old design.

 

[Gillingham]

Re: Are the interior wooden walls structural? Ok to remove t

Thank you for your quick response Doug4bass!

 

[Gillingham]

Re: Are the interior wooden walls structural? Ok to remove t

http://forums.catalina.sailboatowners.com/member.php?u=87055Thanks CaptDon01 + CloudDiver + Watercolors! Your replies are all great, very helpful!! We decided to leave the partition walls in place for now. Perhaps sometime in the future we will trim them down. We just got the boat and it is wonderful to know that we can tap into your knowledge on items like this. We are really happy with the boat, only one annoying issue so far, seems to be quite common, rain water leaking in..... at the back on the starboard side seems to be one source of the leak (water accumulates there) but exactly where it comes in we don't know. Any suggestions from your experience? + any other obvious places to look in general for rainwater leakage? Thank you and appreciate your help!

 

[CloudDiver]

Re: Are the interior wooden walls structural? Ok to remove t

Most common leaks are from improperly bedded deck hardware and windows. Just because the water collects in a certain place does mean that area is the source, just where it collects. Start with re-bedding deck hardware with butyle tape. If you still have leaks after that it could be windows, which you can also re-bed with the same butyle tape.

 

[CaptDon01]

Gillingham,

I just noticed that your from the UK, and I don't believe many,(if any), of the MK-II C-22 versions made across the Atlantic, but for an open interior, like you wanted to do with your boat, you can't beat the MK-II version. And not only is the salon more open, but the hull is also 8" wider. The photo is a 2006 MK-II I refurbished about a year and a half ago. She's enjoyed by a local family here in San Diego.

Keep us posted on the boat, and of C-22 activities there, or don't they call it the Jaguar-22 there?

Don

 

[CCrane2299]

Re: Are the interior wooden walls structural? Ok to remove t

As to the leak, is it in the it in the locker? If so, you might want to check your cockpit drains. This is what I found on my '89.

 

[watercolors II]

If the boat is moored, check the lower rudder gudgeon, the water slapping on the stern will leak in at that point if the water is somewhat like the water you’re moored in.

 

[Gillingham]

Leaks in Catalina 22 (= Jaguar 22 in UK)

Hello CCrane2299

Thank you for your message about the leaks, I appreciate your response!
However I don't completely understand the photo... we found water right at the back of the boat on the starboard side, inside the boat, so more or less underneath the outside locker. It is behind the area where the Kitchenette unit is usually stored.

Where is the hole in the photo that you sent?
And do you mean that the hole was not connected to a drainage hose?

Please tell us a little more about your exact problem.

Thank you very much for your time!

 

[Gillingham]

Re: Are the interior wooden walls structural? Ok to remove t

Hi CaptDon01

Here in the UK the boat is indeed called a Jaguar 22.
We have a red one, which is also rather unusual it seems.
The MK-II does indeed look more spacious!

It is great having a forum like this one to ask people's advice on the boat, it is very comforting to know that we are not on our own trying to solve problems.

Stirling

 

[Gene Neill]

Hello CCrane2299

Thank you for your message about the leaks, I appreciate your response!
However I don't completely understand the photo... we found water right at the back of the boat on the starboard side, inside the boat, so more or less underneath the outside locker. It is behind the area where the Kitchenette unit is usually stored.

Where is the hole in the photo that you sent?
And do you mean that the hole was not connected to a drainage hose?

Please tell us a little more about your exact problem.

Thank you very much for your time!

Gillingham, your boat doesn't have the type of cockpit drains shown in the photo, they didn't come along until '86. Your cockpit slopes forward and drains through the two scuppers in the floor at the forward end; the newer cockpits slope aft and drain through two holes in the transom, like the one pictured.

 

[Tim22868]

Re: Are the interior wooden walls structural? Ok to remove t

Gillingham, My '76 would accumulate water inside while sitting on the trailer and in heavy rains. I looked for and solved all of the issues the team has mentioned above, but it still leaked in the rain. I finally ran a bead of high quality silicone which advertised

2x Stretch

alone the top of the aluminium rub rail/deck to hull joint cover and the issue was solved. However, this is only a temporary fix and a bigger job awaits my attention.

 

[Jacktar]

Re: Are the interior wooden walls structural? Ok to remove t

For the leak, check the dinette water tank for leaks, also watch for condensation from interior wall of hull liner from humid weather. You might check the drain channel around the starboard locker lid to make sure it is tight, also around base of stern light and any stern pulpit baseplates. Try childs sidewalk chalk lines at various places around these to detect which is culprit. Lots of luck but remember all boats leak somewhere.

 

[hawk232]

Try childs sidewalk chalk lines at various places around these to detect which is culprit.

what an excellent tip!!! hopefully after the resto I don't have leaks, but if I do you better believe I will remember this idea

 

[CCrane2299]

Re: Are the interior wooden walls structural? Ok to remove t

Oops, I wasn't paying attention...

 

[CCrane2299]

Re: Are the interior wooden walls structural? Ok to remove t

I did have a hunter that someone siliconed the rub rail both top and bottom. When the silicone failed near the front of the boat it would allow water behind the rail and the only place it could go was over the hull deck joint near the rear (lowest point). I removed the entire rub rail, cleaned up all the silicone, sealed the hull deck joint, and reinstalled the rub rail with no sealer any where. That cured it. It was a bear to find because the leak was far from where the water was pooling.

 

[Gillingham]

If you want to remove them (if you don't intend to race), you can but you will have to make 'substitutes' that are trimmed down.
- Take your rig down
- Unbolt the chain plates and unscrew the bulkheads (walls)
- Keep the originals, stow them somewhere safe (but first use them as a pattern).
- Get some nice 3/4" sanded plywood. Marine grade is ideal, but you'd be fine with regular plywood as long as you prime it and paint it.
- Make a shortened version of the originals; on the outboard of each bulkhead it needs to go all the way top to bottom then over to where the chain plates bolt in. At an inch or two inboard of the bulkhead you can drop a line vertically or at a slight angle down to where the top edge of where the bulkhead meets the fiberglass liner.
- Its important to carry over the Port side at the right height so there some material to put two screws in the back and into the compression post, this prevents the compression post from being 'kicked out' accidentally. Basically follow the same line that cover boards for the V berth make.

I write all this stuff.... I talk to much. I made some lines on your original picture. Here ya go;

Hi CloudDiver and CaptDon01

Good news, we successfully trimmed down the bulkheads on our boat this past week, following the pattern on the newer versions / on the photo that you sent, the result is great, the interior space is more open and it feels less claustrophobic sleeping in the front bunk. We added a new edging onto the bulkhead so that it looks like the original edging, only much lower down. Structurally it seems to make no difference, they are still both very solid on both sides. Thanks very much for you help and advice!

Stirling