another keel lockdown bolt discussion....

[rpludwig]

'84 C22, no soft decks, no leaky windows, no leaky poptop, solid leak-free restored volcano, drains and sink plumbing all double clamped. No other thru hulls, no evidence of water at lower gudgeon or motor mount or forward hatch, or chainplates, or maststep. Two days recently of relentless rain, no additional water.

This one is left in a slip year round. Never an ounce of water in the "bilge" (yea I know there is no bilge in a C22), thus no bilge pump.
Due to health and work, it has been left more or less unattended for a year. Opened it up last week (prior to rainstorm) and had the equivalent of a quart or two of water laying 1/2" max under and in the port settee compartments and running aft to the volcano/battery area. No sign of any ingress anywhere as stated above. Nothing on stbd side.

The ONLY suspect left IMO is the keel lockdown bolt, which I have never deployed, and I see a tiny bit of water staining in that area.

So the question....how many of you actually use the keel lockdown bolt, have you removed it and plugged it? Thoughts???

 

[Gene Neill]

Removed and plugged.

 

[Jacktar]

same here, and by the way you do have a bilge in a c22 actually two of them one on each side of the volcano hump, ta da!

 

[Any Sea]

I agree with the lock down responses above.

I'm not sure of your logic that the keel lockdown bolt would be the source of your water if you left it unattended for a year in a slip. The keel lockdown bolt might leak a little when under way. Seems unlikely water would get up into the trunk while just sitting.

I would also recommend installing a bilge pump in a boat that lives in a slip. It may not get all of the water out. It will help keep it floating when some starts to get in. And some will always find a way in.

 

[pclarksurf]

+1 with @Gene Neill The physics of that bolt are worthless... I have mine -- sealed in place but never ever never to be deployed on my now sexy smooth keel.

Kept it functional on the offchance there is a next guy who want's to ruin my keel

 

[kclancy]

I had similar issues. I also glassed mine thinking that was the cause of the water ingress. However, only when healed over should there be any chance of water entering thru the useless keel bolt. However, if there have been some rough water while at rest, it could possibly happen. the source of my leak was a crack in the trunk housing. I was able to access the area by putting the boat up on stands and lowering the keel. The crack in the housing was behind the keel pin area. I opened the crack up a little with a Dremel and then epoxied and glassed it.

Also, see pics of my keel bolt (after I grinded it free) and repair attached. The keel bolt has rusted off and all that was remaining was the bolt on the outside, which of course couldn't be turned. Nuts!

 

[kclancy]

Fast forward to last Fall and a different C22 - I was on a sailing trip from Santa Cruz to Moss Landing to Monterey Bay to Stillwater Cove and then back in reverse order. On the leg from Santa Cruz to Moss Landing, I had a hard hit to my keel. I didn't see anything, but I definitely hit something, and hard. I was taking on water the remainder of the trip. Then on the last leg, from Moss Landing to Santa Cruz, another hard hit. This time I saw a 5-6 white shark afterwards rolling beside my port side. I still had a keel and made it back to Santa Cruz. I spoke with the harbor master and he told me that the juvenile white sharks have been very aggressive and many sailors were reporting hits to their keels.

Once I got back home, I tried to get a look under the boat to see what/where the cause of the leak. I lifted the boat as much as possible while on the trailer as I felt was safe, and even then I was pretty nervous. It turns out I have another crack in the trunk housing from the keel slamming into the side of the housing. This time I will need to remove the keel to make the repair because it is forward of the keel pin. Lots more work than the previous repair.

 

[Gene Neill]

Fast forward to last Fall and a different C22 - I was on a sailing trip from Santa Cruz to Moss Landing to Monterey Bay to Stillwater Cove and then back in reverse order. On the leg from Santa Cruz to Moss Landing, I had a hard hit to my keel. I didn't see anything, but I definitely hit something, and hard. I was taking on water the remainder of the trip. Then on the last leg, from Moss Landing to Santa Cruz, another hard hit. This time I saw a 5-6 white shark afterwards rolling beside my port side. I still had a keel and made it back to Santa Cruz. I spoke with the harbor master and he told me that the juvenile white sharks have been very aggressive and many sailors were reporting hits to their keels.

Once I got back home, I tried to get a look under the boat to see what/where the cause of the leak. I lifted the boat as much as possible while on the trailer as I felt was safe, and even then I was pretty nervous. It turns out I have another crack in the trunk housing from the keel slamming into the side of the housing. This time I will need to remove the keel to make the repair because it is forward of the keel pin. Lots more work than the previous repair.

Ohhhh man ... wow. I truly feel your pain. That sucks.

 

[watercolors II]

That keel bolt, is not a locking bolt to hold the keel in the down position under all conditions. If the hull turtles it will not hold the keel up because of the keels weight, so from 90 degrees up to the 180 degree point this bolt would be useless. But, from 0 to 90 degrees it would have some potential, 0 degrees would be straight down in the water and 90 degrees would be flat on the surface of the water.

Think about what situations you could put yourself into in that first 90 degrees, also, think about you getting caught in 5 to 10 foot seas and the hull flat on the water going up and over waves of this size.

Note; the swing keel on a Cat 22 does not hang vertical because of the offset of the keel pin being close to the trailing edge, this would make the keel hang about 10 degrees towards the stern. The upper part of the keel trunk has a stop edge built into the hull to limit the vertical, to an actual 30 degree position towards the stern. So, the design of the swing keel has 20 degrees of weight holding it forward to keep it in the designed position without any additional mechanical additions, except that lock down bolt.

Another problem with the swing keel is that upper part of the keel trunk that stops the keel in that 20 degree position from hanging vertical, weightless forward and backwards. Think of hitting something under water, the keel slides up over the object under water and keel drops, big time, off the top of the item you hit. 500+ lbs of force and leverage is applied to this fiberglassed upper edge of the keel trunk. Something has to break with that kind of force. I feel that your only help in this situation is the keel cable, cable turning ball, and winch. If some of the keels weight is lifted off this keel trunk stop with an extra crank or two on the keel winch, the 3 items listed would be of some help, and also maybe that locking bolt. The only problem with this is that, famous keel hum!

 

[rpludwig]

I don't mind the hummin', have become quite used to it over the years....it assures me all is good down there!

 

[Gene Neill]

It's a beautiful sound when you've been waiting ages for some wind, I'll say that much for it.

 

[rpludwig]

I believe it hums in the key of B#, not certain though...

 

[Jacktar]

Aint nuthin like the hum when you get going in fair winds, love the sound